Locking an electrical sub panel

[Rollie Meyers]

Bruce, I am in a similar boat. When I google "non fused disconnect" most of the hits are for 200$+ devices with a minimum of 3 poles. For normal 2 phase power are you required to disconnect ground to?

It is not permitted to switch a grounding conductor, it is permitted to switch a grounded (neutral) if they are switched simultaneously w/ the ungrounded (hot) conductors. (They must make /break at the same time).

2 phase is a obsolete power system, it only still exists in a few areas, what you have is 2-legs of a single phase system.

[Lee Schierer]

Many industrial Square D boxes come with locks built into the door latch. You might be able to just buy a new door panel.

[Bruce Wrenn]

Bruce, I am in a similar boat. When I google "non fused disconnect" most of the hits are for 200$+ devices with a minimum of 3 poles. For normal 2 phase power are you required to disconnect ground to?

Salem, HD carries disconnects up to 60 amps. Even if they are fused, they will work. Most indoor HP units require a 60 amp disconnect. You will pay more for a 3 pole (3 phase) disconnect, than a 2 pole. Bruce

[Paul Atkins]

Seems like this is really about the 2 year old and not the panel. Let him grab a spark plug wire and let him know what electricity can do. He'll leave those alone till he grows up. O.K a little harsh I know, but I stuck my finger in a light socket when I was about that age and remember it well. And yes, I still change switches while hot. Boy did I get up on the wrong side of bed today------(Take a deep breath-----)

[Scott Gibbons]

LOL, I think the best school is the school of hard knocks

[Mark Bolton]

Seems like this is really about the 2 year old and not the panel. Let him grab a spark plug wire and let him know what electricity can do.

While I think Paul talked himself down off the ledge quite nicely I dont think he is too far from the truth.

Way too many parents nowadays are expecting society, and manufacturers, to do their parenting for them. To the OP please dont take this the wrong way, however, one has to wonder where were the decals on the sides of buckets saying "your infant can drown in a bucket full of joint compound" when we were kids. Why werent the packages we opened at Christmas all filled with bags labeled "this is not a toy" on them?

My perspective on this is that we are in the "age of empowerment". We want our children to be completely unchallenged and spread their wings. It is absolutely ludicrous. A childs life is about boundaries and consequences to crossing them.

As a child, my house had an old screw in fuse panel with glass fuses. Any one of these could be easily removed and a finger or tongue inserted (thats how stupid this is), yet it never crossed my mind. In fact what DID cross my mind is "my mom or dad would probably be pretty pissed if I went in that thing". I remember those mental taps on the shoulder clearly when I was doing something really stupid. Of course some I still did, but those taps saved me many many times.

While I think advances in safety are wonderful and I dont want to see a return to the days of screw in fuses, at least your child has no access to live current. There is NO WAY, the child could do ANYTHING in that panel to put themselves in danger. The only reason that child will enter that panel is because of a parents lack of supervision, or lack of information (read that as imparting a serious sense of fear).

I will just say, that I was only spanked one time in my life. It wasnt even a bad spanking, and it didnt straighten me out. But my mother had a way of grabbing you by the arm, pinching pretty tight,l and giving you a look, that was far worse than her picking up a 24" crescent wrench and clubbing you across the face with it.

It's was the look that said "you have let me down".

I avoided that face at all costs throughout my life. Far better than any lock.

Am I on the ledge? Yuk Yuk
Mark

[John Coloccia]

Maybe this is a dumb question, but what's the big deal if he flips breakers back and forth? I know if I was flipping breakers back and forth, and someone came into my shop and said, "What are you crazy? Stop flipping those breakers back and forth. That's DANGEROUS!", I'd say, "No it's not. Now if you didn't bring beer, get out of my shop."

Let him flip the breakers back and forth all he wants. In a minute or so he'll figure out that nothing interesting is happening and he'll look for some other way to get in trouble.

[Bob Luciano]

Funny that you ask this question. I just installed a non fused disconnect to the panel that powers up all the tool circuits. The lights are fed from another panel altogether. Cost me a bit more to do it that way but I won't have to worry about a kid get cut all to shreds by something with a motor. Next is a locking cabinet for chisels and planes so far upper shelves have worked but that luxury is running out soon. The soon to be installed RPC will have another panel and disconnect. The way things are going might give up woodworking and get myself licensed as an electrician

[Rod Sheridan]

That's funny Bob, however don't give up woodworking.

It very much is hit and miss with manufacturers of machinery, some put lockable disconnect switches on each piece of woodworking machinery, others don't.

The machines that didn't have a lockable switch, I used a clam shell lockout on the cord end.

Of course eventually as the kids got older they were allowed to use any machine that they were trained to use in their shop class.

One of my daughters wasn't interested in wood working, the other remains interested and is building herself a desk now.

I never locked up the sharp stuff, however that may be a good idea for the children as well as the sharp stuff.

Regards, Rod.

[Joshua Layne]

I'm wishing I had at least put a subpanel or disconnect in when I wired my shop. As I am going to have to redo the 220 anyway (I need way more outlets than I thought... who knew I'd have so many big machines? MUWHAHA...) I will add a disconnect (probably locking) there - that will cover the TS, Shaper, RAS and once I get around to rewiring them, the jointer and the bandsaw - the DPs I may not screw with, but maybe...

Not that my dad didn't point out the defect in my design as he was wiring it, but he did make one mistake... he didn't insist.

-Josh (you're not the only parent who is paranoid - a little shock, ok but I'd prefer 9V battery to a 20 amp circuit and whirling metal blades? no thanks)

[Mark Boyette]

Don't use 3" screws to attach the hasp.

[Jason Roehl]

2 phase is a obsolete power system, it only still exists in a few areas, what you have is 2-legs of a single phase system.

Put the 2 legs of 240V service on an oscilloscope, and you'll see that they are 180º out of phase, hence "two phases". Yes, those two legs are obtained by center-grounding a transformer and tapping the two ends of the secondary coil, while the primary coil is off a single phase of the higher-voltage lines. In the end, it's just nomenclature--the reality is that there are two phases present in a "single-phase" electrical service.