Tool invention advice

[Horton Brasses]

I would talk to Lee Valley for production first. Like Rockler and Woodcraft they do this sort of thing and pay royalties. Unlike Rockler and Woodcraft-they actually either make it themselves or work with factories who can.

Making a product a winner in the marketplace has a lot more to do with marketing and distribution than it does with the product itself. Read about Tesla and Edison for a classic example.

In today's world getting your product out there as a standalone item is both easier and harder. The internet has leveled the playing field-anyone can set up a website-but it has also made people more wary of gimmicks and fly by night operations-with good reason. If you want to devote yourself to your invention fully then by all means determine how to get it made, commit to an inventory, set up a website and get a booth at every trade show you can. All of those things are more difficult the patent. Otherwise try to get someone else to build it and collect a royalty.

I don't know a whole lot about patents-but I believe you will need to spend between $3 and $5K getting it done. It might be best to contact a reputable patent attorney. I think the mailing yourself a part is bogus but I'm not sure.

Best of luck!

[Vince Shriver]

A friend of mine invented a jointed fishing lure and used it himself effectively for several years. He then wanted to market it, so he made a deal with a very well know tackle company who eventually manufactured it in different sizes. He did get the one year patent, but after that the company basically told him to go pound sand - bottom line he got virtually nothing for his design, the the tackle company is enjoying solid sales of the lure.

Many years ago, a close friend of my folks designed a set of rollers: two aluminium trucks with a threaded rod between them with two steel ball bearing tubes in each truck. They were to be place under refrigerators. When he approached the appliance companies, they offered him a small fraction of what he asked for, and explained that his rollers, as designed, would be prohibitively expensive. He stead fastly stood his ground and refused the deal they offered. Bottom line: they manufactured their own redesigned rollers and put them on all their units. And the family friend slowly, but stead fastly, went broke. BTW, I have a couple sets of those original rollers and they work great, but then again, so do my refrig casters.

Rain Bird started with a guy's design and were first produced in his garage here in So. Calif. He became very successful as most people know.

I think success is possible, but it's a mine field out there. Good luck.

[Mike Henderson]

I'm not an attorney so take this for what it's worth.

If you want to document the date of invention, have your design documents notarized.

You have one year from publication to seek a patent. But if you disclose your idea to a company, do it under a Non-Disclosure Agreement (NDA) which is not public disclosure and doesn't start the clock running. Get help in drafting an NDA.

Many companies will require you to sign an agreement before you disclose your idea to them. The reason is that they may be working on something similar and don't want you coming back at them claiming they stole your idea. The knife cuts both ways.

In my opinion, for a $150 tool, I think you have to go to someone already in the business. At that price level, you just couldn't afford to build the distribution channels. As someone else suggested, Lee Valley may be a good choice. They seem to be a very ethical company and are selling into the woodworking market. Whether your product fits their product mix is another question that only they can answer.

The best of luck to you.

Mike

[Myk Rian]

I'm not an attorney so take this for what it's worth.

If you want to document the date of invention, have your design documents notarized.

To add to that, send a copy to yourself in a certified letter. Don't open it when delivered.

[Tom Walz]

Paul Akers at Fastcap will do all the work and pay you a royalty. He is very successful and dead honest. Also a nice guy.

see www.fastcap.com

tom

[Mark Maleski]

To add to that, send a copy to yourself in a certified letter. Don't open it when delivered.

I'm no patent attorney, but I've read enough to know this is an urban legend - it won't hold up in court. For evidence, here is a link to a scam prevention folder on the USPTO website: http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/com...camprevent.pdf

This is a brochure published by the United States Patent and Trademark office. Check out item #4:

"You are told to describe your idea in writing, mail it to yourself and don’t open the envelope. This is worthless advice."

The rest of this brochure may be helpful to the OP in seeking potential business partners.

[Glen Butler]

I have invented a few things myself, but after looking into it found that I didn't have the funds to move forward. Patents are worthless unless you have a lot of money. I find that it's all about marketing. Getting your name out there above the others. Advertise, advertise, advertise.

[William Falberg]

I have a couple ideas for creating new tools. Looked high and low for the designs and purposes and am 'fairly' convinced they aren't out there. Have made some detailed drawings, built prototypes that work exactly as I hoped. I know I need to contact a patent attorney, but then even if I do get a patent... then what? How do you get it manufactured? marketed?

Any advice from anyone with experience in this area is greatly appreciated!

There's no one web site or phone call that's going to answer your questions, Tom. In that simple question: " How do you get it manufactured? marketed? " you're actually asking a million smaller questions regarding EACH of those matters. In all probability you CAN make a living from your ideas but you'll have to literally MAKE every dollar on your own as you make each product and sell every piece. There are a few generalities I can vouch for. The big and medium sized companies can and will profit from your IP but they'll do everything in their power to avoid recognizing, much less paying you, for it. There are no sugar-daddies out there. Hope and pray your product fills only a niche and the Global Squidcos won't see it as profitable to them. There IS sufficient market share to run a niche marketable product and it's not that hard. Just make 'em and sell 'em. You won't get rich, but you can make a comfortable living.

The marketing is where you make money. If you don't market it yourself, you won't make a dime. Nobody will even bother to rip you off until they see you making money. By then, you own the "brand" and it becomes less appetizing to compete with an already established competitor (you) . In the process of making and selling a product; if you're really an inventor; you'll generate a new patentable idea every day and eventually forget about the whole issue of who's stealing your ideas. It doesn't really matter. Do your thing - let the rest do theirs. Forget manufacturers and distributors -their focus is on your money, not selling your wares.

If you have enough EGO to think your idea is better than all others, then you should also have enough EGO to think you can beat the "business" at business. Like Jebediah Nike says: "Just do it!"

If it's not a great idea nobody will buy it and you won't have gone into debt finding that out. IF IT DOESN'T PAY FOR ITS OWN DEVELOMENT - DON'T DO IT!

My marketing campaign started out with door-to-door sales at local construction sites. It's instant feed-back. They'll tell you how to make it and how much they're willing to pay. Your customers will tell you exactly what to do. All you have to do is listen to them. Let your market design your product: they're NEVER wrong.

[Myk Rian]

I'm no patent attorney, but I've read enough to know this is an urban legend - it won't hold up in court.

Strange. My Brother, an Attorney, told me to do this.

[Will Blick]

Tom, from one fellow inventor to another, I applaud your efforts. You got some great advise on this ww site...this demonstrates just how many people have been through this process... I will offer a few additional comments...

For starters, we are trying to comment on something we know very little about, such as, who you are, what kind of bankroll are you willing to invest, how big is your ego (do you want your name on the product), do you have any interest in starting a business? How patentable is the product? Who is the target market, hobbiest or commercial? What is market size? What are tooling costs to build the product? What age are you, how long are you willing to wait? As you can see, none of these issues involve disclosing the product itself. Before I offer anyone advise on "what to do next" I always ask these questions.....

Now some generalized comments....

Filing a provisional patent application will secure your idea for a year. (it replaces the mailing the letter to yourself)

99% of all patents never generate any revenue.


Avg cost of patent infringement case in 2008 was $500k

Patent search is critical, however, considering this field is hundreds of years old, its not just about other patents, but the lurking trap is in "prior art"....i.e. if this concept was ever in the market (with no patent) or discussed in trade magazines at any time, it will null n void any patent you may get...i.e. you will not be able to defend your patent. This search is much more difficult than a patent search. Hence why you never can be overly confident when you own a patent, it may be less defendable than you think. Of course, none of this matters until a product is a success. therefore, you take on the entire risk....

Market size is key.... the larger the potential market, the more interest you will generate. Most inventors have no clue how small markets and profits can be vs. the investment capital required for start up, inventory, marketing, service, etc.

The potential sale price, and the resultant profit margin is critical for attaining interest. And in todays competitive market, without a strong patent, competition will drive down the price, and therefore, the margins. With small margins, the inventor can not expect a lot in royalties.

As suggested by others above, in the end, in most cases, their is more value in the ability to maufacture the product cost effectively, sufficient capital to inventory the product and accessories, have distribution channels in place, have a name brand attached to the product, offer reliable service for the product, strong marketing, etc.... vs., the product invention itself. That is the sad reality of the business world today where anyone can have products made overseas for peanuts. There are very few rare exceptions to this generalized statement.

For what its worth, I have been approached by several ww's through the years for investment capital for their ideas, in all cases, the risks were too great to "go into business" to make the product. In most cases, the inventor did it anyway, and in those cases, the inventors never stopped contacting those of us for added investment capital. They all severely underesitmated how costly it is to bring a product to market....and turn a profit....


Fortunatley, you have some good options in this field... but based on the complexity of the product, not sure if it falls into areas for a company like LV or Rockler. Lets face it, they buy and re sell 99% of the products they offer.... your chances are much greater if the company already manufacturers something similar, and could easily tool-up to make your prodcut....only you know if that is the case.... and if this is true, now patent protection is critical, or at least strong non compete, non disclose contracts, which also can be costly, hence the value of patents. And also, these companies don't sign these contracts so handily, as they could already be working on similar products, so they run risk of potential litigation.

So based on your background and experience in the area of product development (you seem to be past the invention stage) you may consider investing in these next steps...if this is not your bag, seek out someone who you feel is, and let them do it for you, because even the processs of assinging your invention over to another firm, can end up taking years and still incurr a lot of costs and require a lot of expertise and business experience.....

keep us posted, and best of luck to you!

[brian c miller]

Paul Akers at Fastcap will do all the work and pay you a royalty. He is very successful and dead honest. Also a nice guy.

see www.fastcap.com

tom

I have seen tons of this stuff in the local Rockler / Mann Tool. IT never knew it was all from the same source. The grip thing is actuall pretty cool and the pocket chisel seems to be everywhere.

[Dave Rathert]

As far as a Patent Search goes you may want to try this for starters. Contact your local Law School and see if they have an Intellectual Properties Clinic (or something similar). They “may” do the patent search for free. In this case JD students studying IP and patent law will work under the supervision of a professor (Attorney) to do the patent search. I did this a few years ago with something non WW related and the students I worked with were very professional. IIRC I had three meetings with them (two with the prof attending and one with only the students). They couldn’t do the full on patent for me (I don’t think the law will allow it) but they gave me plenty of information to take to an attorney should I pursue a patent and answered many questions I had. I opted not to pursue the patent process; I decided it wasn’t worth it in my case, but it got the ball rolling and answered a lot of questions. And the price was right.
Best of luck.
-D

[brian c miller]

Getting a Patent search and a Freedom to Operate are Expensive. Here's my $.02 on the subject.

To start off with you must know you market. What's the potential? Who are you targeting? How many of the more expensive units are selling? How much of this market share do you intent to capture? What's the switching behavior of the customer (meaning even if your product is "better" are the brand loyal)?

An idea is only as good as the market it sells into.

For a product to be successful for start up guys it MUST be:
1. Easy to distribute.
2. The technology is simple.
3. People view the product as unique.
4. The benefits are obvious.
5. You can sell the product for 3-5X what your cost is. (It's expensive to acquire customers)

I would test market the product before I ever went through the headache and cost of getting it patented. People are unlikely to steal an unproven idea. I'd protect myself by keeping an inventors notebook (check the patent office website for how to do this) and document the steps of you invention, so that you can prove you were working on an idea - write down your ideas and thoughts in a dated sequence, and include notes on who you discussed the idea with, and when.... so on.

Very few people actually sell an idea, many people sell products. I would suggest that you prototype a few of these and give them away to people to Beta test in exchange for feedback. It's it better to tweak the idea with end-users before you go out and get a patent (which are useless unless you are willing to fight it (Think wiper delay))

Once you get a product people are happy with, then move forward with that idea. Can you take it to market? What’s the manufacture cost? You’d want to be 25-33% of selling price. Overhead, Cost of capital (carrying inventor), marketing, et alii will quickly eat up the rest of you margins. I would make a small batch of units and sell them small scale. If you are going to try to sell this ting yourself, how are you going to shield yourself from liability? Someone cuts the hand off and sues sort of thing.

Then after it’s got a proven history of PROFIT shop it around to the big guys.

[Stephen Edwards]

Making a product a winner in the marketplace has a lot more to do with marketing and distribution than it does with the product itself. Read about Tesla and Edison for a classic example.

Ain't that the truth!? Tesla, to this day, has not received the credit due him. Marketing and distribution does indeed seem to be the key to success.

[Darin Kauffman]

I didn't read every post, but you could always do a poor man's copyright. It will hold up in court too.

What you need to do is, take all of your detailed drawings, copy them and place them in a secured envelope. Then mail that envelope back to yourself. The postmark and stamp of the USPS is good enough to prove you had the idea first. NEVER open this envelope, and keep it in a safe.

I invented a gravity weight machine for building upper body mass, and a patent lawyer told me that this is priority number one before you go in search of a patent. No one will know what you have in your secured envelope, and if you go to court, the date stamp on the envelope will set the timeline.

Depending on how difficult it is to get a prototype up and running, you should look at manufacturing these "tools" yourself. Start small and maybe even give a few to trusted carpenters/tradesmen to test the waters. If your tools are worth while then you will most likely be busier than you want. This is when you can decide on outsourcing or starting a small company yourself.

Good luck to you!