Diy track saw

[Gene Howe]

Neat ideas here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYJcGDQ3pk4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8mTqlW3LPw

[Britt Lifsey]

Cool ideas. My shop isn't large enough to use TS with full sheets and I've just been using a "clamp and guide" type clamp - which is only 54" long so doesn't work for 8' rips. Might try to come up with similar jig for my next project

[Gene Howe]

Cool ideas. My shop isn't large enough to use TS with full sheets and I've just been using a "clamp and guide" type clamp - which is only 54" long so doesn't work for 8' rips. Might try to come up with similar jig for my next project

I seldom need an 8' long piece but I seem to always cut the width first, then the length. Then I have to use the TS to true up the edges. My clamp and guide system is pretty good as I don't need to figure an offset for the circ saw's shoe/plate, but I hope that using the ideas in the video will give me an edge that will not need trueing on the TS.
I have an idea to make the ones in the video even more precise.
Stay tuned

[Britt Lifsey]

I've very rarely needed to rip full 8' piece also...usually more of "construction" project than "woodworking."

Since I no longer have a truck, I've thought about have BORG cut down sheets so they will fit in SUV (original Dodge Durango). But, as I told the wife that's like stopping and asking for directions!

Look forward to your improvements!

[Gene Howe]

Britt,
Finding the one guy who HD allows to run the panel saw is WORSE than asking for directions!

My idea is just that, so far. I have found the materials, though. Take a look and you'll get the idea.

http://www.ptreeusa.com/ttrackproducts.htm

[Britt Lifsey]

Britt,
Finding the one guy who HD allows to run the panel saw is WORSE than asking for directions!

Just load your wood into the panel saw and start cutting...they come running then

[ben grossman]

I've come up with a few ideas myself, including one with an aluminum track not much different than the "real" tracksaws. However, all of my ideas require minor modifications to the circular saw, and I am not sure if I want to do that. Still much cheaper than the real thing though, and would give me a reason to buy a worm drive saw.

[Gene Howe]

I've come up with a few ideas myself, including one with an aluminum track not much different than the "real" tracksaws. However, all of my ideas require minor modifications to the circular saw, and I am not sure if I want to do that. Still much cheaper than the real thing though, and would give me a reason to buy a worm drive saw.

ben,
Tell us about your idea!
I've already decided that I'm going to need a dedicated saw. I'll use my worm drive and pick up a lighter one for other uses. The worm drive is a heavy beast and not the best for framing tasks, anyway.

[ben grossman]

OK, well here are my ideas (really long post alert!!). I have two ideas, one is based on what I assume the YouTube videos are, since I can’t really watch them at the moment (slow connection). I spent some time on EZ’s forums looking around, and pondering and so forth, and spent a fair amount of time on it.

The first design pretty much replicates the commercial track saws, or perhaps even closest to the EZ system—since you are using an off-the-shelf saw.

The idea is to take some aluminum flat bar—1/2” wide by ¼” or 1/8” thick—and mount it to some wider, thinner aluminum flat. I was looking at 1/8” thick by 4-6” wide aluminum. The smaller flat bar would be mounted on top, and serve as the “rail” for the saw. The small bar would be tapped for flat head screws coming up from underneath the large flat bar and counter-sunk (drilling, tapping and counter-sinking this could be rather time-consuming).

On the bottom of the wide flat bar assembly would be some heavy-ish adhesive backed rubber. It would be the friction material to keep the rail system stuck to the board, and the rubber would overhang the aluminum just like on the Festool/Dewalt systems, to act like a zero clearance insert.

On the bottom of the circular saw, the idea is to make a “shoe” that mounts on the saw and rides the rail (the ½” wide alum bar). My intent was to use nylon or phenolic or something, to reduce the friction. It would be thicker on the side that overhangs the rail so it would contact the material being cut, and it would be separate piece so that it could be replaced as it wears (like Festool’s replaceable ZCI).

Adhesive backed rubber can be a little elusive, so a substitution would be using 1/8” thick hardboard. However, it would have to be screwed into the aluminum, and with that being pretty thin it may prove to be a challenge. The rubber is out there. You can buy all the metal parts off some place like Online Metals, but I found a local supplier (apparently rare), and if you could it would reduce potentially high shipping for lengthy sections (like 10 foot rails).

If the aluminum base of the rail is wide enough, it could be built like the DeWalt rail such that it is fully reversible—but that depends if you can get enough width. The reason for using aluminum for the track base (you could use wood) is the ease of finding it in longer lengths easily (over 8-foot). You could just screw the ½” aluminum rail to a piece of ¼” hardboard, and have all of your ZCI and everything in one spot. It would be less complicated, but harder to do in one piece past 8 foot rails (or impossible?). If you are only using 8-foot or shorter sections, I would actually seriously consider using wood for the base instead of aluminum.

The nice thing about this design is that it could easily be adapted to the “power table” system, and some of the designs from the EZ forums would be super easy to replicate with this homegrown rail. I even thought about building it into a super-workbench-thing (to replace my particle board and 2x4 bench).

My second idea is pretty much the same as the YouTube t-track system, but I think maybe reduces the loss induced with the rather thick “track” material. Instead of using a full chunk of t-track, just use a small piece of aluminum flat bar the length of the circular saw’s “shoe”, and ¼ or 1/8 inch thick. I would like to think 1/8” would work, but I am worried it is not deep enough to keep the saw on track.

For the “rail” with that system, all you need is ¼” or ½” thick plywood, hardboard, etc. Rout a proper-depth groove the length of the rail, and run the circ saw down the rail to cut the hardboard to blade-width, thus making it a ZCI. For better ZCI, add a second hardboard “shoe” to the circ saw on the part that overhangs past the “rail”.

Both of these systems really don’t do much in the way of modifying the circular saw, really you just need to drill a few holes in the saw’s shoe to mount the guides. It could be removable, which I’ve considered, but I think it would be a pain to re-adjust for accuracy regularly so it would be best with a dedicated saw.

Either of these systems are cheap though. Even the aluminum track, if purchased locally, would probably be less than $100 for every length you’d ever need. My Makita was about $175, so I imagine I could build all this for less than $250 with the saw. This should also be able to use the circular saw’s built-in safety guards, as long as you don’t build the ZCIs and such to impede them significantly. That’s another good reason for a saw with a break, though.

Keep in mind I haven’t tried any of this yet, it’s simply concept—but there isn’t any reason it shouldn’t work. You also shouldn’t lose more than ½” capacity of the saw. A Freud 80-tooth circ blade is only $20 as well, opposed to $60+ for Festool.

I have demoed the Festool on a power table, and it is AWESOME. And clearly, for some applications, this is no replacement. Dust collection is very good, it is quick and clean, and it is much quieter than I anticipated.

On a side note about circular saws, I recently picked up a Makita 5007MGA after looking really hard at worm drive saws like the Bosch unit. After I bought the Makita, I was at the store and noticed Makita’s worm drive saw (they have a few models, but this is the magnesium one). Most worm drive saws are heavy, in the 17-18 pound region. However, the Makita (5477?) weighs in at only 13 pounds-or about two pounds heavier than the 5007MGA. Had I realized that before, I might have reconsidered-though the 5007MGA gets pretty glowing reviews.

[David Thompson 27577]

Both of the videos in the original post show interesting and clever ideas. There are a couple of things to be aware of.......

In both cases, they added a piece to the bottom of a circ saw. The precise positioning of that piece is absolutely critical to the quality of the finished cut.

And in both cases, they added a groove to a "track" piece of wood. The straightness of that groove (even the one with the metal insert) is just as critical.

I have a guide that I made from two rips of plywood. It's a full 8' length, even tho I rarely need that long of a guide. I ripped a factory edge off of a sheet of 1/2" ply. I ran that through my table saw a second time to get the best assurance that it was straight and the sides were parallel.

I then glued that strip to the same sheet, so that the base of my circ saw could use the strip as a guide. The saw base sits on the ply, and the back side of the base runs against the edge of the strip. Careful pressure against that strip assures a straight cut.

Other suggestions: Add some self stick sandpaper to the underside of the track, to reduce the possibility of movement.

And be sure to clamp it, even if just with a couple of spring clamps.

[Gene Howe]

ben,

Thanks for posting your concept. Lotta work, but either one sure looks like they would do the trick.

My present guide is an aluminum straight edge, 8' long, attached to a length of 1/4" birch ply. I cut the ply about 8" wider than my Skil's shoe then attached the aluminum, made the first cut to establish the edge. The excess on the other side of the aluminum is for the clamps. Had to do that because the Worm Drive's motor hangs over the edge guide.
I like that I can set the guide on my pencil marks without worrying about the offset. I have a similar set up for the router.
I've used this guide for over 15 years and it serves well for breaking down sheet goods. However, I could save a lot of time and my back if I didn't need to take the pieces to the TS. At 69 yrs of age I have to save all the time and back breaking work I can.

After looking at the Peach Tree T-Track and mating T-Bar that I cited earlier, it looks like a good system could be had by just routing a piece of ply or building up to enclose the track and attaching the bar to the saw's shoe.
I'm a big fan of Tenryu blades. They seem to have just the correct tooth set so that I get no splintering on the off cut side. And, of course the guide it's self provides half of a ZCI. So, I don't see a need for a shoe incorporating a ZCI. Just my opinion. However, A ZCI could certainly be used with the T-Track system.
Whaddaya think?

[Shawn Albe]

not claiming originality, but I built this for crosscutting shelf stock last weekend. Will plan on building an eight footer for my next sheet goods purchase. It guides the saw straight, so it is easier (more idiot proof) than pushing it against the fence, and it ends up with a zero clearance effect since the guide goes on both sides of the saw. Note it is critical that you pick a 90* piece that is thicker than the stock you are cutting! I used simple 2x4 lumber.

Somewhere several years ago I saw something simliar in a WW mag, except the guy had used melamine for the base, and slotted shelf standards for the rails.

[ben grossman]

Gene, I don't think a ZCI "shoe" is particularly necessary either, when the track is doing most of the work (and the DeWalt track saw doesn't have one of these at all). It's just a possibility, and I was not sure how stable the saw would be without it. It's probably no difference--and unnecessary addition.

The track you are talking about is a lot less work, and would probably work great, and little concern about accuracy (other than getting the saw mounted right). You definitely would have less worry about getting the routed groove perfect, which is a big plus. My idea is a lot of work, which is why I haven't done it and have been mostly considering #2--except I like the power table idea. I think it would be hard to rout the groove without a router table though, which I don't have (yet).

Shawn, my original idea was a lot like yours except with angle aluminum for the channel. I think it's a great idea and requires no saw modifications, but seemed unwieldy for long cuts. Clearly a cheap and easy solution, and I might just copy your idea for smaller stuff! It's probably more "elegant" that my angle aluminum idea.

The rail on my aluminum design, or the routed groove idea would keep the saw from wandering either way. I think the designs here mentioned in this thread make the actual track saws nearly irrelevant, if someone wants to put in a little sweat equity. However, it may be fairly difficult to replicate the dust collection, and not really feasible to duplicate the plunge effect, but I think that has fairly limited uses. No ding against the track saws though, that Festool is pretty neat.

I'm quite interested to see what else people come up with, and Gene I would like to see yours in action!

[Gene Howe]

ben,
The same guide I described could be built for the router to guarantee a straight groove for the miter track.
Stability isn't an issue as the saw rides on the guide, except for that small piece out board of the blade.

Just got off the phone with Peach Tree.
Their item #1023 and #1033 http://www.ptreeusa.com/ttrackproducts.htm
are matched perfectly. No wiggles!
Ordered enough for an 8' guide.
this gonna be fun.
I'll post pics when I get it made. Probably 2-3 weeks.
Gene

[Shawn Albe]

Shawn, my original idea was a lot like yours except with angle aluminum for the channel. I think it's a great idea and requires no saw modifications, but seemed unwieldy for long cuts. Clearly a cheap and easy solution, and I might just copy your idea for smaller stuff! It's probably more "elegant" that my angle aluminum idea.
...However, it may be fairly difficult to replicate the dust collection, and not really feasible to duplicate the plunge effect, but I think that has fairly limited uses.

I thought about using aluminum or steel angle too in various incarnations. At the time I built this, I was just in a hurry so used what I had on hand. It is sized to fit over a 12" wide shelf. I was cutting melamine, so wanted the ZCI effect to reduce chipping.

I have been thinking about cobbling together a plate or something to cover up the side of the saw to improve DC.

One thing I learned the hard way a while ago concerned the flatness of the plate. I had bought a new Milwaukee saw (awesome overall) and it cut flat when placed straight on a board, but if you used it with an edge guide mounted on a 1/4" piece of hardboard or ply (trimmed to the cut line as was described above), it didn't cut 90*. Turns out the plate was dished in the middle, also making it hard to calibrate to 90. I ended up returning it for a Hitachi (same problem) and finally settled on the Porter Cable, which is perfectly flat and has a nice DC port).

The other thing I experienced was the occasional 'whoops' where I didn't keep the saw all the way to the guide. Thus I wanted to use a guide that locked in the saw, either in a channel like the one I built, or some kind of track like the two videos earlier.

I thought about attaching a plate to my saw, but when I took a closer look at my Porter Cable, it didn't look that easy so I moved on. Either a track like Festools', or the 'straight edge mounted to a sacrificial base' or the version I showed above will get you right to the cut line with less measuring or chances for errors.

For what it's worth. WOuld love to see other ideas...