Question about building rules and codes

[Barry Lyndon]

I'm planning on building a small storage shed under my deck right next to my house (possibly using the ext. house as the back wall to the shed) and have a few questions about codes/rules.

I looked up permit information on my cities website and found that I don't need a permit for a shed under 200 sq. feet (mine will be significantly less than 200) and called to confirm this. While I was on the phone, out of curiosity, I also went ahead and asked if it would be a problem if I used the house as one of the walls of the shed and was told that I had to build the shed at least 10 ft away from the house even though it doesn't require a permit. The lady that I talked to said she would email me a guide of what can and can't be done which I am still waiting on.

I guess my question is, why are there rules for my building if there is no permit needed? I just assumed that if there was no permit needed then that is the city basically saying that the item is small enough that they don't really care about it. How are codes/rules enforced if there is no permit required so no inspection either? It seems like the city is basically saying you need a permit to build a shed but if you build something under 200 sq feet then it's not *really* a shed, it's just some small thing you build that we don't really care about - so then why can't I connect it to my house? Would there be a problem if I build a dog house and put it right next to my house? That would be within 10 feet. What about a small doll house? I can't build a 1ft. cube out of wood and place it next to my house? I just don't understand at what point do I not need to worry about city codes and rules and what point do I have to worry about them? I thought the permit was the line of worrying about them and not worrying about them but apparently not.

Any thoughts/ideas/help?

Thanks!

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Just because there is no permit required doesn't necessarily mean there aren't code requirements that have to be met.

They probably figure a shed could store motorized tools as in lawnmowers etc. that use gasoline engines. They probably want the 10' of clearance so that in the event there would be a fire caused by gasoline for example, the 10' might prevent your house from being involved. Sometimes it is a fire code that prevents a total freedom.

When I built my shop, I ran into an interesting requirement. Normally I could build my shop and only need a 5' clearance from the property line. HOWEVER, a major sewer line runs 1' outside the fence on the east side of my backyard. Thus, I had to leave at least a 10' space between that sewer line and the wall of my shop so the city had access to the sewer line. Not a big deal to me...but my neighbor had a carport built and it is only about 4' from that line. That could become a big deal in the future.

BTW..ask the city inspectors why you need that clearance. In all my dealings with the local code inspectors, I have always been treated fairly and got some pretty good information from them also. The inspectors are just doing a job that really benefits the average Joe and prevents him from endangering himself or having others do less that stellar work.

[Dan Keeling]

I belive the issue is using the wall of the existing structure as part of the "shed". Doing so would be no different than any other addition. As for a standalone shed, the 10 ft rule is probably for the fire marshall.

[Thom Sturgill]

I think Dan has it right, the issue is the house not the shed. The house requires 10' clearance on all sides. Building the shed too close would violate that. Where I plan on building no inspection is required under 200 feet UNLESS I include either power or water, then they (the power or water, not the shed itself) must have permits and be inspected.

[Barry Lyndon]

Thanks for the quick responses! I called and asked why there is the 10' from house rule and was told it was basically because of looks. Home owners can have multiple "Accessory structures" on the premises and having too many close to the house looks cluttered. Kinda weird, but ok. I was also told that this rule could be changed on a case by case basis by a building official so I guess I'll try to go that route. Unfortunately, I have to bring in a sketch to get it approved. I could probably build the shed in the time it's going to take me to make a sketch of it.

Using the house as one of the walls would be convenient but not necessary so I guess I won't be too heart broken if that part doesn't happen. All these codes, rules, permits, regulations, guidelines, etc... are confusing.

Thanks again for the insight guys!

[Mitchell Andrus]

Using the house as one of the walls would be convenient but not necessary so I guess I won't be too heart broken if that part doesn't happen. All these codes, rules, permits, regulations, guidelines, etc... are confusing.

I can't imagine selling a house with a shed stuck to it's side. Don't do anything that starts people picking at stuff they might find 'odd'. You might not care, but someday someone, maybe not you, will have to undo the stuff you did just to get the place sold.
.

[Barry Lyndon]

I can't imagine selling a house with a shed stuck to it's side. Don't do anything that starts people picking at stuff they might find 'odd'. You might not care, but someday someone, maybe not you, will have to undo the stuff you did just to get the place sold.
.

I appreciate the input and it's definitely something to consider, I don't think it will look bad though. Think of it less as a shed and more as a small storage unit. An outside closet if you will. It will be somewhere around 50 - 60 sq. feet. Attached to the house or not it won't really make much difference because of the limited amount of space I have. If it's not attached then the back wall will basically just be a matter of inches away from the house (assuming I get it ok'd). There really isn't much of an option for me.

I got the lumber for it for free and spent about $70 on the corrugated metal for the roof. That's really all I'll have into it. Worse case scenario, in 6 years when I decide to sell the house and a potential buyer doesn't like it I tear it down. It's small enough that it won't be a big deal and I'll have gotten my 6+ years of use out of it.

[Mitchell Andrus]

50 -60 sf. Baaa. Build it 10 feet away and slide it over. If anyone says anything, slide back. Say.... you could mount it on rails.
.

[Barry Lyndon]

.... you could mount it on rails.
.

Now that's an idea...

[Shawn Christ]

A permit isn't required as a courtesy to you. You don't have to draw up any plans or pay for a permit because it's a relatively minor improvement. But there are still building codes for safety and zoning codes for the orderly use of land. You need to follow those rules, even if they don't require a permit. It's not worth the hassles, fines, and penalties. All it takes is one complaint, or a few shots with your hammer or nail gun to notify someone you are building something on your property.

I'm surprised the best answer they could give you was aesthetics, although I would agree, attaching a shed to the house isn't the most appealing arrangement. Move it over and use the area of separation to store other stuff like trash cans, a compost bin, ladders, dog kennel, whatever.

[Don Alexander]

you might want to consider safety ........ you said in your OP that you were wanting to build it under your deck right up against or attached to your house which is understandable i think however please do not store anything flammable in it if you in fact build it there it would most certainly be a fire hazard and we don't want to read about your untimely demise due to a fire

[Barry Lyndon]

you might want to consider safety ........ you said in your OP that you were wanting to build it under your deck right up against or attached to your house which is understandable i think however please do not store anything flammable in it if you in fact build it there it would most certainly be a fire hazard and we don't want to read about your untimely demise due to a fire

Actually, I am planning on storing my lawnmower and pressure washer in there which both use gas along with garden tools and probably whatever spare gas I have. All this stuff is being stored in the garage right now so I don't really understand why you're saying I shouldn't store it in this shed. If there is a fire barrier (insulation) between the garage and the house then surely there is a fire barrier between the outside of the house and the inside of the house. I don't really understand what difference it makes if I build a few walls next to the house. Does everyone store gasoline out in the open air at least 10 ft away from any wooden structure? I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a smart ass, I don't really mean to, I just don't get it. As I'm sure I've proven, I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. Someone school me.

[Don Alexander]

insulation is NOT a fire barrier however in an attached garage (as long as its built to code) the sheetrock between the garage and the rest of the house structure must be fire code rated sheetrock that is designed to slow down the burn through so that you have substantially more time to get the heck out in case of a fire

this code is because normally you find gasoline and other flammable stuff in a garage

you do not have the same protection under your deck right up against the house therefore it is much more dangerous to store flammables in such a structure

you need to be careful about storing flammables in enclosed/ restricted airflow type spaces period . buildup of gas fumes for example is not a desirable thing you could safely light a match and dip it in liquid gasoline IF and only IF you could completely remove the gasoline vapor from the equation ( don't try it kids ... gas vaporises rapidly and the vapors are extremely flammable)
not trying to lecture anyone here just trying to point out that safe is alot better than sorry

[Shawn Pixley]

Yes, many / most current codes require a one hour separation between the dwelling and the garage. The insulation is immaterial to the fire separation.

The way you are describing it, combustion in your proposed attached shed would run up your siding (I presume wood siding) and involve the structure and deck above very rapidly. Here in Southern California, many houses now are required to have residential fire sprinkler systems. Fire is not to be underestimated.

As others have stated permits are for covenience / compliance. Codes are are a minimum requirement. I'd bite the bullet and make it freestanding.

[Barry Lyndon]

Lots of great information, thanks everyone!

I certainly would like to be safe rather than sorry. A couple people have mentioned that it's not safe to keep the gas in an enclosed area but the "roof" won't actually be attached to the shed. I am planning on screwing the corrugated metal directly to the bottom of the deck more to act as an umbrella and then just build 3 walls (or rain shields) underneath it. I know I call it a shed but I'm really looking at it more as a simple rain barrier. That's why I can't get my head around why it's a bad idea to keep gas in there. I'm looking at like it's pretty much the same as keeping my gas canister on the concrete below my deck just out in the open (which I don't think would be a problem but it wouldn't be the first time I was wrong).

Anyway, does the fact that the roof isn't even attached to the structure make any difference? There wouldn't really be anywhere for the vapor to get trapped. Also, could I just put up a sheet of the fire code sheetrock between the house and the shed and make it safer?

Unfortunately, a completely detached (more than 10 feet away) shed isn't really an option because of space. I could detach it from the house with no problem but it wouldn't be more than a few inches (MAYBE a foot) away. It really has to be either right next to the house or nothing and nothing isn't really an option either because the only place to keep all this stuff right now is the garage and the wife is having to park outside as a result and isn't too happy about it. I'd like to do it cheaply but I'm not against spending some money to make it safer.

Thanks again for taking the time to help me out everyone. I've been thinking about it myself for a few weeks now and have needed to pick some people's brains.