new shop tools?

[steve gard]

I was discussing furniture building using power tools today, starting from scratch what would be your estimate on cost to outfit a shop to produce quality furniture. Tons of variables and I don't want to hear that sarcastic answer, but decent quality tools along the lines of Grizzly.

10k
20k
30k
more?

[Erik Christensen]

all in k$

table saw 1-2
8" jointer spiral 1
15" planer spiral 1.5
SCMS .5
drum sander 1.5
DC 1.5
bandsaw 1
shaper 1.5-2
workbench 1
blades & cutters 2-3
hand tools & misc stuff 1-4

total 13.5-19

advice worth what you paid for it

[Paul McGaha]

Steve,

I think Eric's estimate is pretty close.

I'd say if all new to set up a shop about $20K depending on which machines you selected. Maybe a little more counting absolutely everything.

I'm not against buying tools used also so long as they are really low milage tools. I've seen Craigslist adds of people selling complete shops, with decent tools in them, at a fraction of the cost of new ones.

Good Luck with it.

It's a lot of fun.

PHM

[Will Overton]

If you are talking about a basement/garage hobby shop, you could save quite a bit from Erik's estimate. For example, a $1.5k dust collector wouldn't fit in my shop. If you are looking to go into business, you just may want/need to fill his shopping list.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Erik's got a pretty much complete shop..... Assuming hand tools and asst stuff includes hand power tools, that could be a little low.....

Just adding a jigsaw, circular saw, router/router table table & bits, drill, RO sander, etc etc to some un corded hand tools you're already on the high end. Little things you need add up quick.

[tyler mckenzie]

i'd say 25-30 will get you started. Grizzly is considered to be on the lower end of the quality spectrum.

[Damon Stathatos]

If you're able to set up shop where you have 3 phase available to you, then you can purchase old machines (the ones that were built to last a lifetime) for a fraction of the cost of new single phase. I'm not sure if I would trade many of my older machines for the entry to mid level newer machines aimed at the enthusiast level.

You hear it indirectly every night on the news and it's translates as: the manufacturing base in the U.S. has either gone bust or moved overseas (and they didn't take their machines with them). Internet auctions of those machines take place on a daily basis, dozens to hundreds at a time. After awhile, it's a bit disheartening for me to keep punching them up.

Anyway, I set up a fairly complete shop for around $40k but I bought way too many machines and only use about a quarter of them. That $40k wouldn't buy one or two of these things new.

Check this site out:
http://www.irsauctions.com/index_calendar.asp?flash=0
at the end of the day you can see what sold and the price as well. Add to those prices a 10% commission, rigging, and shipping, but even at that, they're still dirt cheap.

I need to get around to taking some better pics of what I have but here's just a few for your entertainment or interest (in order): Neuman Whitney 26" planer (conical helical head), Northfield 4 18" TS with stock feeder, Porter 20" surfacer (a big, automated jointer with metal 'fingers' that push the wood over the head), Powermatic model 68 12" TS, Powermatic model 90 lathe (this one came from CL), Tannewitz 36" BS.

In a few of the backgrounds, against the wall is some of the cocobolo slabs after milling. The good looking guy lurching over the machines in a few of the photos???...me.

[Dan Karachio]

Whoa, 25-30k? Come on, there are plenty of people with far less who can kick the furniture making a$$ of most people. Alas, I am not one of them, but I know a few. A home hobby shop can be had for under 10k easy. Cut that down 25-40% if you are savvy at getting good deals on used. You don't have to buy it all at once you know.

Table saw: 1k
Band saw: 1k
Jointer: 700
Planer: 300
Miter saw: 300
Dust collector: 350
Drill press: 300
Drill: 200
Bench: 400 build one yourself
Router: 300
Router table: 400
Router bits: 400
Hand planes: 1k
Chisels and saws: 500
Clamps: 500

I am at about $7000 right here. Still need a variety of bits, blades, jigs, measuring and other stuff, but this is the meat.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Obviously depends on if you are a weekend hobbyist or a full-time commercial shop, but <$10k could buy you a very well-equipped hobby shop. If you buy used equipment, you could spend substantially less.

Just adding it up quickly, I think I spent $1,300 on my table saw, jointer, planer, router and table, miter saw, dust collector, and drill press. All were purchased used, and are good or better quality tools. I've probably spent another $1300 on clamps, bits, dust collector duct, blades, sandpaper, etc.

So look through the Grizzly catalog, and add up what you like

[Dan Friedrichs]

Whoa, 25-30k? Come on, there are plenty of people with far less who can kick the furniture making a$$ of most people.

Very true - you can't buy skill

For a very good example of doing AMAZING work in a small shop with probably much less than $30k of tools, take a look at Dave Diaman's work:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=140948

[tyler mckenzie]

Whoa, 25-30k? Come on,

That gets you a shop that doesn't need to get replaced or upgraded. My estimate was based on someone who builds for their living. My shop is all used machinery, i've found it's all the little thing that add up quick.

[Dan Karachio]

I suppose the context of the OP isn't quite clear, but I'm thinking of hobby interested people coming in here and reading, "You need 30k to make furniture" and scaring the poor guy/woman away! There are many many ways to go. Certainly if I did my shop over I would have made different purchases and spent less, but I have 15k in easily. If I had that same 15k to spend today, boy would things be interesting (less Festool and more old iron). Like you said, it is the small stuff that really adds up. Of course, nobody I know has gone out and bought a complete shop at once. To get *started* making furniture, you certainly don't need everything. For example, start off with a book shelf or simple cabinet type project and you might get by with just a table saw, dado blade, sander and some clamps. I am kicking myself, but a while back I found a site about a guy in Japan, in a dinky apartment in Tokyo with a foot stool as a bench and some hand tools who made beautiful cabinets that, in my life, I could never equal.

Tyler, tell us about your bandsaws! The smaller - is that a 14" WT? Both look awesome!

[Rod Sheridan]

If I knew what I know now, I wouldn't go through the multiple upgrades to get where I am, I'd start with the end machine.

In my opinion unless you're a commercial shop, you can't beat the Euro combination machines for performance, accuracy and functionality.

I'd put $2K to $2.5K for a cyclone dust collector, about $15K for a combo jointer/planer and a saw/shaper or a 5 function combo which includes a slot mortiser.

Add $2K for a bandsaw and $1K for a drill press and you're there except for hand tools.

Felder had a promo a while ago where you bought a combo and they gave you a bandsaw, plenty of deals available now.

As someone who owned high end stuff (General) I wish I had bought a Euro combo at the beginning.

Regards, Rod.

[tyler mckenzie]

Tyler, tell us about your bandsaws! The smaller - is that a 14" WT? Both look awesome!

Dan the smaller one is a 14" Walker Turner! He just got a facelift (scroll down a post). The other is a Davis and wells great machine, just started putting it through its paces.

[Jim Rimmer]

Maybe I'm naive but I think some of these estimates are over the top. I made a list awhile back as to what it would take to replace all the major toosl in my shop and add a few I didn't have at the time and I could put together a pretty nice shop for under $5K. Now that doesn't include hand tools, bench, and the various routers, drills, sanders, etc. So double the number and you have a fantastic shop. That would be a shop you could start in and over the years we all would add things but you could at least start a hobby with a nice setup for less than $10K.

Granted, I'm talking about a hobbyist shop. All comments above are null and void in reference to a commercial endeavor.