Has anyone made their own Tallow?

[Mike Olson]

wow, this little question certainly took off.

Next time I'm at the butcher "which isn't very often" i'm going to pick up some mutton fat and try a pound in the crockpot

I enjoyed reading the discussions.

Thanks,
Mike

[greg Forster]

Mike,

Did you see my post about Dixie Gun Works; for about $7.00 plus shipping you could get about 2 lbs of pure mutton tallow ready to try out.



p.s. Upstate or Downstate

[george wilson]

Stephen,it's always nice to hear a newbie on the forum tell us what the Neanderthal forum is all about,but you must be wearing blinders.

In your time here,haven't you noticed that most of the guys talk a
bout their LN or LV planes? The ones with 01 or A2 steel blades?

Some also use A2 chisels,and a few even use the latest powdered metal technology chisels,too. I think I've even heard mention of D2 steel blades on this forum,and,heaven forbid,HSS.

I am among those who like to use wooden planes. Made a bunch of them,too. They even had forged,bitted blades. However,I also have several infills I've made,and several LN planes,too,and the new LV art deco block plane.

What this must mean is this is a hand tool forum,not the museum forum.

It also includes endless debates on sharpening. These include many kinds of new stones,like ceramic and diamond and abrasive paper and lapping with diamond dust,too.
Hardly what our for fathers used,in many cases.

I could go on,but I think this should show you what the Neanderthal forum encompasses.

I think it includes my stand,which is to cherry pick the best of both new and old technology. The need for personal skill is not diminished,though.

But,even if Roy recommends it,I don't want to rub tallow on my tools. Don't want them greasy. Don't want my hands to smell of it later. Had enough of sheep as a kid,except to pet them.

If you think the old days were the "good old days" try reading a little Dickens. He was sent to work in a shoe polish factory as a young teenager. He packed shoe polish into jars with his hands. It affected him for the rest of his life. Lucky for him he had enough talent to become a writer. The rest of the poor devils never got out. Times were very,very hard. I read about a chair maker who got a job in a factory. He was allotted a window with oiled paper panes. If he wanted glass,he had to buy it himself. This guy was so poor he could not afford a workbench(you had to furnish your own tools,too). He had to take up the floor boards and stand upon the ground,using the floor as his workbench. Don't know what he did for a vise. Probably just stop dogs. I seriously doubt that he reflected upon the quality of his tools. I read about an old cabinet maker who burned his tools when he got too old to work,for the trouble they had caused him. That's sad. We would never do that,would we?

I was never in a union,but in the furniture factories in North Carolina in the 20's and into the 30's,you were paid as you went out the door each day. Paid just enough to buy groceries on the way home. Not enough money to begin to save any. Why? because if you got any money saved,you might quit and find a better job. That's the way it was. Henry Ford was a real pioneer in good pay. He wanted to make his workers into his customers as well.

As for "doing history",been there,done that,and probably longer than you guys will,since I did it all week,all year for many years,even in costume. My director said,though,that there was something wrong with those who wore costumes that they weren't PAID to wear.

[Stephen Shepherd]

George, this isn't about you and it isn't about me. It is about answering a question that someone asked with out the personal ad hominem attacks.

You missed the point and obviously you haven't taken a look at how long I have been on this forum.

But since you got personal, how many woodworking and historic publications have you been in and how many books have you published?

Stephen

[David Weaver]

I didn't realize this was in PWW last month - missed it in the post earlier until reading back yesterday looking to see if that was mentioned after my 9-month old daughter shredded my PWW magazine and I saw a page hanging out with stuff about using animal fat.

It strikes me as similar to running around and oiling all of the mechanical equipment around the house with animal fat and a tar bucket.

I guess it could be construed as re-enacting when you use it? A lot of tar buckets were left behind where I grew up - there was a battle of sorts there at one time in the past. Nobody uses them to lube anything today.

[george wilson]

I have been in "The Craftsman in America", put out by the National Geographic Society,and was on the cover of "Window on Williamsburg" for 12 years,and
in it. I have been featured in articles in "The Colonial Williamsburg Journal" I have a film "The Musical Instrument Maker" which you can buy from Col.Williamsburg. My staff and I am making both a spinet harpsichord and a violin in it. It is the only film of its kind. Also in "Plane Makers in America"(?) I can't recall the title as I am sick.

I have been asked to make gifts for every president since Reagan,and every major head of state in Europe. Also numerous celebrities such as David Brinkley. Even John Anderson of the group "Yes". Margaret Thatcher,Helmut Cole,Mitterand,Prince Hero of Japan,the president of Italy,president of Argentina,and lately Queen Elizabeth have my work. There are others I have forgotten about. Right now I have had pneumonia for 3 weeks,and am not real good at recollection.

I have wanted to write a book,and have been much encouraged to do so. However,there are 2 types of people,really,this is true: There are those who play at it and write books,and those who actually do the work,and just do not write books. Having met several woodworking authors,I can tell you that I much prefer to be the real craftsman. I've had several well known authors stop in. Some of them asked the most basic questions,or made the most ridiculous statements I was very surprised. One of them rankled each and every Master and journeyman in Williamsburg during a speech in a wood working forum there.

For those who remember,he's the one who told me that he'd had the same planer blades on his thickness planer for 20 years. I mean,you DO have to use them to wear them out!! He writes an article every time he makes a night stand.

You are making a fool of yourself asking about my qualifications. Had you been in this forum for long,you would know better.

Every thing I have cited is factual concerning historical woodworking,tools,and the nature of hand tools used by the forum members.

David Weaver,just above,is also a long standing expert on this forum.

You need to be careful who you attack. If you want to be some kind of historical woodworker,fine. You can even wear a costume while you do it.

Now,what are your qualifications for making the sweeping statements you have made?

[Dave Anderson NH]

Back things off a bit people.

[David Weaver]

Expert is a bit far, I'm not a George Wilson, just a hobbyist with a tool fascination and a want to find what works best and not get lumped into a group that by defintion has to follow certain traditions or regard this over that. I have played with and tried anything that I mention, though.

I once troubled George a long time ago before I got booted off an overmoderated competing forum, because I thought he was probably just another professional woodworker who gets on here and troubles all of the newbies and hobbyists (there is plenty of that going around), and I didn't know the pre-existing dynamic between him and someone else that added fuel to the fire.

Boy was I wrong about who he was and his intentions, though. A google of "george wilson tool maker" turns up all kinds of interesting stuff.

I understand, though, the desire to re-enact - I grew up in a place where people put on wool underwear, wool pants and long sleeves for three days at the beginning of july every year, and they do it for *fun*. I just hope that people who want to either play with their tools or make things don't get the sense that everything that's newer isn't just a "faster, cheaper and lazier" way of doing something that was once done more effectively. No wool underwear in my shop.

[george wilson]

I don't remember you "troubling" me,David. Actually,it's "George Wilson,guitar maker." I'll have to google what you suggest,though,and see what pops up.

I,too,wore long underwear in Alaska,and don't much care for it either! It was several years of real pioneering,mostly without electricity or insulation. We bathed in a 2' galvanized tub in front of the open oven. The ice box was an orange crate nailed up high on the outside of the house so the bears couldn't reach it.

I wasn't allowed to have a gun,but at 13 I was setting dynamite!

P.S.,just googled it. Didn't know what was there. The 2 making a spinet in Mack's shop are my old journeymen,Marcus and Ed.

There is a video on that FWW site where Jon Laubach and I are showing how we cut the throats of the wooden planes we made. It wasn't done by hand,no,but our job was behind the scenes as toolmakers. It was to make tools for 80 craftsmen,and others such as conservators,costume makers,etc.. We had to devise ways to do the work as efficiently as possible. We were not demonstrating to the public at that time,though we both did for 16 years. Jon was a gunsmith,one of the handful in the country who can forge weld,bore,and rifle a wrought iron rifle barrel by hand. I was Master Musical Instrument Maker.

If you see the picture on the FWW site where we are standing over a long workbench,you can see a batch of saws we had made. The handles were hand made,except for band sawing their shapes out,since the contours of the handles changed in different areas. The saws were hand sharpened. We had a foley,but it was NEVER RELIABLE.

[David Weaver]

I don't remember you "troubling" me,David. Actually,it's "George Wilson,guitar maker."

I have seen some of the guitars and lute work that's sprinkled on the internet. They look as good as anything that I have ever seen, especially the inlay work. Superb detail and still tasteful, something that seems harder to find now that inlay work is available from anyone with a laser.

I don't know anything about instruments other than guitars, but I'm sure given the work you've done elsewhere, that the voicing of the guitars is as good as the looks.

Figured I wouldn't mention the guitars, because probably not that many folks on here are fanatical about stringed instruments.

[Frank Drew]

However,there are 2 types of people,really,this is true: There are those who play at it and write books,and those who actually do the work,and just do not write books.

Not true, actually, at least not true across the board; here's just one example (among many) to the contrary: Alan Peters.

[george wilson]

Nothing is ever true across the board. i don't know him.

David, highly inlaid instruments are something I did as a challenge,and as orders I got. Personally,I prefer plainer instruments. The thing I like mostly about ornamentation is designing it.

[Frank Drew]

Alan Peters:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Peters

His book, Cabinetmaking, The Professional Approach, is a clear-headed and IMO very accurate description of the myriad of things that go into setting up a professional woodworking shop and business.

His woodworking speaks for itself.

[george wilson]

I recall him now. Just not a fan of Arts and Crafts movement.

[Frank Drew]

Well, through his apprenticeship and training there was a link to the arts and crafts movement in England*, but neither Edward Barnsley's, where he apprenticed, nor Peters' own furniture were in that style.

*Ernest and Sidney Barnsley were Arts and Crafts movement furniture designers and makers associated with Ernest Gimson in the early years of the 20th Century; Edward Barnsley, with whom Peters apprenticed in the Fifties, was Sidney's son, but Edward's own designs were more in what could be called high style.