New Shop Construction Finally Underway

[Alan Schaffter]

That should be a great shop. You and family are doing a superb job. The hydronic heating should be great, too!!

One suggestion- I would take another look at your DC lines- you have too many runs with multiple right angles . A lot of folks like nice, neat looking runs that are parallel to the walls with long vertical drops, but they aren't always the best for efficiency. A main that starts right at the DC and runs diagonally directly, with no bends to the opposite corner of the shop by the bathroom with branches to the machines coming off at 45's would yield much less static pressure resistance and much better CFM. There is a lot of duct and fittings between the tools on the left side of the drawing and the DC. (It looks like there might be at least one T there as well, YIKES! ). Remember, unused drops have no effect on air flow. Too bad you couldn't have built a floor over a crawl space, then you could have run all your DC lines under the floor for shorter runs and very short drops that flow down instead of flowing up to the ceiling. It would have required the PEX be laid away from the walls by a foot or two but that really wouldn't have affected the heating.

[Alan Schaffter]

That should be a great shop. You and family are doing a superb job. The hydronic heating should be great, too!!

One suggestion- I would take another look at your DC lines- you have too many runs with multiple right angles . A lot of folks like nice, neat looking runs that are parallel to the walls with long vertical drops, but they aren't always the best for efficiency. A main that starts right at the DC and runs diagonally directly, with no bends to the opposite corner of the shop by the bathroom with branches to the machines coming off at 45's would yield much less static pressure resistance and much better CFM. There is a lot of duct and fittings between the tools on the left side of the drawing and the DC. (It looks like there might be at least one T there as well, YIKES! ). Remember, unused drops have no effect on air flow. Too bad you couldn't have built a floor over a crawl space, then you could have run all your DC lines under the floor for shorter runs and very short drops that flow down instead of flowing up to the ceiling. It would have required the PEX be laid away from the walls by a foot or two but that really wouldn't have affected the heating.

Oh, and are you going to outfit your DC system with autogates?

[Todd Crow]

What looks like a T is going to be a pants wye, I just was to lazy to try and draw that.

I built this shop with the capability of driving a vehicle into it to add to the resale value. Concrete floor was necessary for the load of a vehicle.

I am also running my ductwork in between obstacles like lights. But as always it is a design in progress. Until you start putting ductwork up you don't know for sure how it will fit.

I have my shop built autogates on my current DC system, just have to build a few more gates for this new shop.

Todd

[Alan Schaffter]

What looks like a T is going to be a pants wye, I just was to lazy to try and draw that.

I built this shop with the capability of driving a vehicle into it to add to the resale value. Concrete floor was necessary for the load of a vehicle.

I am also running my ductwork in between obstacles like lights. But as always it is a design in progress. Until you start putting ductwork up you don't know for sure how it will fit.

I have my shop built autogates on my current DC system, just have to build a few more gates for this new shop.

Todd

I figured you had a reason for the concrete floor.

Think twice about using a "pants" wye. It is essentially a low velocity HVAC fitting and has more SP friction than a standard low angle wye. I would give the DC ducting priority and then fit lighting and everything else around it so you can get more direct runs and reduce the number of high SP/CFM-robbing 90s.

It looks like you will be running 6" from the DC to all machines- good. Are you planning to wire your autogates to the machines again or use current sensor switches? Unless you replace your solenoid air valves you would need current sensor switches with the switch rated at 120V/? amps for your solenoids or use an isolation relay.

I don't know if you've seen my setup, but for my current shop I added dual acting Bimba cylinders to my old shop gates and made a few new ones. I didn't use any intermediate linkages so had to use cylinders with 7" - 8" throw (for a 6" gate). Luckily I got a bunch of new and some almost new ones on Ebay a few years ago for $6 - $7 (I have 12 auotgates so it could have been expensive otherwise.) I made a simple direct connection between the piston and gate slide, so didn't need any linkages or ball rod rods, etc. I was originally going to connect the solenoids like you did but really didn't want to wire into the machines or have an extra 120V cable/wires hanging around, besides many of my machines are 220V. Luckily I found a source on Ebay for PNP solid state torroid coil current sensor switches by (CR Magnetics 9321). They typically go for around $21 or more from CRM or DigiKey but I paid less than $10 each. They are only rated for 120 mA but the 24V SMC 2/5 solenoids only draw 65 mA which made things simple. I bought some single unit solenoids but got many of them in banks so I had to make cheek plates when I separated them. The price was right however (Ebay again). My gates have laminate inside faces and laminate slides- so move with minimal force even when the DC is running. With only 15 psi, I needed flow restrictors- without them the gates wouldn't last long- sharpen the edge of the slide and they could be renamed autoguillotines!! Luckily one bank of solenoids came with enough restrictors.

I trigger my DC with a special circuit my brother built that monitors the 120V input to the 24V solenoid transformer. Whenever a gate is triggered either automatically by a machine or manually by the LVC circuit I left in place, the DC turns on. It probably could also have been done with one of the PNP current sensor switches. Since I often jump from machine to machine I decided to design it so turning off the DC is manual. Also I determined that a time delay in the gate circuits was not needed- at 3000 - 4000 FPM dust gets from my farthest machine to the cyclone in less than 1/2 a second- I never turn a machine off that quickly.

I also designed and built a high dust alarm that tells me when my bag (I built my cyclone as a push-through so I use plastic trashbags instead of a bin) is full and also shuts off the DC.

Here is a link to a rather long video tour of my DC system at AWW. The section about my autogates starts at about 8 min. Everything has been working great for about three years now!

Best of luck on your new shop. It looks like you will really enjoy it! Isn't it great not having to move around every few years courtesy of Uncle Sam?!? I did 22+ in the Navy- also spent some time in SA - meetings at RSAF HQ in Riyadh and others in Dahran - my year was up and I left the day the US airstrikes began during the first war. Thank goodness for an empty C-5 that stopped in Manama Bahrain for gas before heading home- the MAC charter stranded us and left DGAR for home!!!

My original prototype autogate temporarily mounted to my jointer for testing. It was eventually relocated behind a knee wall:

[eugene thomas]

I sure wish would of took more pictures when built my shop. I have pictures of the beginning process and some while the contractor built the grage. but when started doing the interior stuff i never got the camera out again. now can only whish would of TOOK more pics.

[Todd Crow]

I have started wiring the shop. I have 14 circuits in the shop. I am reusing 6 circuits from the old shop, so I have 8 wires to pull through the garage attic to the circuit box. Just have to be careful not to step through the garage ceiling!

[Alan Schaffter]

I have started wiring the shop. I have 14 circuits in the shop. I am reusing 6 circuits from the old shop, so I have 8 wires to pull through the garage attic to the circuit box. Just have to be careful not to step through the garage ceiling!

Coming right along. It is good your last statement doesn't end with "again."

[Todd Crow]

The electrical has its rough-in inspection complete. My parents came to help for the weekend and we have started insulating. It is cold outside, 24 degrees when we started, so I had to get the wood stove hooked up first! You can't see it in the pictures but it also snowed about 5 inches during the weekend.





We have the insulation complete. In the corner is the bathroom. I will not have the shop always heated, so I am installing a small baseboard heater in the bathroom to keep it warm.





Now on to sheetrock and then painting!

[Mike Cruz]

Todd, that exhaust pipe on top of the stove looks like it is vented, well let's just say in the wrong direction.

[Todd Crow]

A friend came out today and we sheetrocked the ceiling and got started on the walls.

[Kirk Poore]

Todd, that exhaust pipe on top of the stove looks like it is vented, well let's just say in the wrong direction.

I saw that, and had to go back to the plan to see what you'd done (re-using the old chimney), which was a good plan, I think.

Looks like you're doing well with the drywall. Man, I hated that when I did my shop last year.

Kirk

[Todd Crow]

My friend came out again and we finished the hanging the drywall. On to the mudding and taping.

It has been fairly cold outside, 5 degrees for lows last night, and when i came into the shop this morning it was 45 degrees. Warmed up fast once I started the woodstove.

[Todd Crow]

Getting closer to paint! Going to be cold tonight, 20 below zero...have to fire up before I go to bed to get the mud dried!

[Alan Schaffter]

Looking good! How many sheets? 12 footers or 8? It makes the bedroom addition I'm working on look like child's play!

[Todd Crow]

I put up 23 - 12 foot sheets, and 8 - 8 foot sheets. I borrowed a Sheetrock lift from my brother who is a contractor, which made it go pretty easy. All those corners on your bedroom addition don't look like much fun!

Todd, that exhaust pipe on top of the stove looks like it is vented, well let's just say in the wrong direction.

Mike, it took me a long time to figure out what you were referring to. As Kirk has noticed, I hooked the woodstove up to the chimney that is in the garage.

Todd