i'm eating plenty of Apple Cracks! Help.

[Patrick Doody]

So I've been roughing out Some Apple wood that I found curbside, so far I've roughed out 2 bowls, the first one I roughed out I left fairly thick maybe 1" on a 8" bowl, figuring that I'd finish turn it at a later date. I put it in a paper bag and all was well, about a week later i opened the bag to check on it and it was getting really moldy and discolored so i removed it from the bag and the next day it was cracked beyond repair.

the second bowl, i turned a bit thinner, it's about a 8" bowl and I left the thickness about 3/8" i brought it inside to show Jessica the awesome grain on it. a few hours later i looked at it again and figured that maybe i should try to seal the end grain on this one with anchorseal to try to slow down the drying process and hopefully avoid any cracks, it looked fine, so i brought it out to the garage. when i got out to the garage there were about 8 small cracks in the bowl, not sure if the sudden change in temperature did it of if i just hadn't noticed the cracks. I put some thin CA into the cracks and covered the end grain with anchorseal, this morning there were no additional cracks that i could see.

So what's the best method of drying this stuff without it getting all moldy or cracking to heck? I've been spoiled with birch which doesn't seem finicky at all. I'm hoping that I can get some usable bowls out of this beautiful wood, I have about 5 nice sized blanks left to turn.

[Sean Hughto]

I love apple, so I've tried to turn as much of it as I can find. I remember seeing a nature show about the history of the apple once and was surprised to learn about the great variety among apple trees, and how most of them do not bear sweet fruit. That's why we have the dozen or so common varieties - because when you found a tree that made good eating fruit, you grafted that over and over to keep that fruit coming. I mention this because my expereince with apple is that the wood seems to vary a lot too. Some has little smell, and some is pungent. Some is fairly clear and some is full of pin knots. In short it's hard to generalize completely. That said, apple is known for its propensity to check up. I've had good luck turning it thin and letting it acclimate in a couple paper bags for a few weeks (see pic). I've also had good luck turning it thick - coating the whole thing in anchor seal and waiting several months before returning.

[Baxter Smith]

Hi Patrick. Welcome to apple. From my limited experience with it last winter I found the following. If you found it curbside, it might have already started to crack and some may have been present though very small. Would suggest turning away any cracks. I turned 5 or 6 pieces to 5/16 or under then left them on the concrete floor in my polebarn in bags for a month with temps in the 40's or below. Brought them into my shop and left in bags for another couple of weeks with temps 60 or below. They didn't go into the house for a couple of months. They have done well.
I also turned some thick and bagged, or anchorsealed and also bagged . Some developed spots of mildew and I became concerned. Tried washing with bleach and changing bags without much effect. After asking pretty much the same question here, I tried returning one slightly and found it was only on the surface. Quite a few of the blanks have devolped some degree of cracks. I will start finish turning some of them after Cristmas so may reach a conclusion then as to whether it was better to turn thin or leave thick and return. I have a couple of bowls of about 12 inches that I left thick but have warped so much I don't think I will be able to return.
In summation I would say, bag even the thin stuff (don't let it sit out) and don't worry about the stuff growing on the thick as long as it is in a paperbag. Good luck with it!

[Patrick Doody]

Thanks for the advice guys, i'll try some of your suggestions on the next roughouts.

here is a picture of one of the roughouts my friend turned from this tree, it's absolutely beautiful wood! I hope I'm able to get some usable bowls from this.

[George Guadiane]

Thanks for the advice guys, i'll try some of your suggestions on the next roughouts.

here is a picture of one of the roughouts my friend turned from this tree, it's absolutely beautiful wood! I hope I'm able to get some usable bowls from this.

That is ABSOLUTELY STUNNING!
Apple is great fun to turn and it smells like an old cider mill to me.

[Reed Gray]

If you are going to turn it thin, and let it dry and warp, the best way to keep it from cracking that I have found is to round over the rim, and then stretch a couple of wraps of plastic stretch film (6 inch stuff you wrap around boxes on a pallet, available at office supply places) around the rim. Really stretch it out to put some pressure on the rim. Let a little overlap into the inside of the bowl. This works far better than paper bagging. A 1/4 to 3/8 inch thick bowl will be dry in about 10 days. Start it out on the floor in your shop, or other cool dry place for a few days, then up on a wire rack or shelf for the next few days. I am not really sure why the plastic wrap works so much better than the paper bags, but it allows me to safely dry Pacific Madrone, which is the most difficult bowl wood to dry that I have ever found. A 3/8 inch thick bowl will most likely move too much to return later. If you have anchorsealed one that size, you will have a lot of trouble removing the anchorseal if you can't turn it off.

I don't do the twice turned bowls, but any sudden changes in temperature and humidity can cause cracking. The bags tend to slow the drying time down to allow the wood to slowly release stress while drying. Most of the time, just keeping them on the floor is sufficient, because the floor (especially concrete) is cooler and has higher humidity. Bagging may or may not be necessary.

Drying your bowl blanks is a science/art, and will change a lot due to local weather/seasons/indoor heating and air conditioning. You will have to experiment a lot.

Nice looking bowl in the pic. That is one that will tend to develop cracks. You have the pith/log center in two places, and some wild and curvy grain. May take some super glue.

robo hippy

[Bernie Weishapl]

Patrick there are several woods that will crack almost immediately with a sudden change in temp. Cedar, apple or plum that I have turned did this. I rough turn them using the 10% guide. Also I round the rim and that seems to help with the cracking. Immediately upon removing from the lathe I do as Mike Mahoney said at his demo. He coats the whole bowl with anchorseal and stores them cool place with not much air movement. I have a room that stays around 68 deg no air movement and store them at floor level. Knock on wood (pun intended) so far no cracks.

[Jake Helmboldt]

As Reed noted there are multiple piths (looks like 3 actually). The closer to the rim the more likley to wreak havoc. Is you cracking occurring at the pith? If at/near the edge turn/cut it away completely. If in the middle or more internal you can try using CA or epoxy to stabilize it, but it may still crack.

I have been going through the same frustrating process with beech, another crack-prone wood. Even when it seems to be stable, you turn it some more and it starts moving like a bellydancer.

[Patrick Doody]

all great info, Ill look into getting some of that fancy saran wrap, sounds like a good time for experimentation, though i wish i had this worked out before all of this beautiful wood landed in my lap. I'll do my best to make some crack free bowls out of this batch. I'll keep you guys updated I'm sure. sadly that beautiful bowl that's pictured above cracked yesterday. we're 3 for 3 woo hoo.

Robo, I also enjoy turning to final thickness and then drying, usually that's what I try to do, but i was trying something different with these.

Bernie, I'll try keeping them on the floor in my basement to dry, seems like a perfect spot.

Again thanks guys, it's pretty frustrating right now, but i think I'll gain some valuable knowledge when this wood has all been turned.

[Leo Van Der Loo]

all great info, Ill look into getting some of that fancy saran wrap, sounds like a good time for experimentation, though i wish i had this worked out before all of this beautiful wood landed in my lap. I'll do my best to make some crack free bowls out of this batch. I'll keep you guys updated I'm sure. sadly that beautiful bowl that's pictured above cracked yesterday. we're 3 for 3 woo hoo.

Robo, I also enjoy turning to final thickness and then drying, usually that's what I try to do, but i was trying something different with these.

Bernie, I'll try keeping them on the floor in my basement to dry, seems like a perfect spot.

Again thanks guys, it's pretty frustrating right now, but i think I'll gain some valuable knowledge when this wood has all been turned.

Pat with Apple (and other prone to split wood (fruit wood)) I will take a very thin slice off of the end of the bowl blank, and bend it carefully, if any splits are in the wood it will show right away, I will keep cutting till past the split, so I'm sure to start with wood that does not have a split to start off with.
Then I will turn the bowl, not a bit today and some more tomorrow , and I also use a recess rather than a tenon, wall will be 10% at the rim and getting thinner going down towards the base.
When turned the piece goes into a brown paper bag right away and gets placed in a spot that is cool and has no draft, I will check my pieces a couple of times the first week or two, if any mildew I'll just wipe it off and sometimes place the bowl into a dry bag if it seems more than normally wet.
I have done this for many years, exactly as I say I do, and have very few splits appear in my turnings.

There is one thing I always do, as wood very often has issues like small knots or irregularities, and I will put CA on it before placing it in the bag, even at the pith area I will put often some thin CA, just in case I say, as it is the area that is more prone to split than any other area, HTH

I'll add a couple of pictures of Applewood bowls, kind of proof of what I'm telling you, or else it could be just hot air (BS )
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Dry Apple wood bowls.jpg Dry Applewood bowl .jpg Dry handled Applewood bowl.jpg Dry Apple wood bowl.jpg Dry spalted Applewood bowls.jpg

[Kim Ford]

Leo;

I was given a very large apple tree and have turned several bowls from it. I lost the first few using the paper bag method so I tried the DNA soak.

I am not a big fan of DNA but it seemed to give me a higher success ratio with the apple than the paper bag and shavings method.

Good luck, apple can be a very striking and colorful wood.

Kim

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Leo;

I was given a very large apple tree and have turned several bowls from it. I lost the first few using the paper bag method so I tried the DNA soak.

I am not a big fan of DNA but it seemed to give me a higher success ratio with the apple than the paper bag and shavings method.

Good luck, apple can be a very striking and colorful wood.

Kim

I'm not talking higher, but basically no splitting at all, I guess you done something different if yours splt after turning the wood and having it in a brown paper bag and placed it like I say in a cool place with not draft, (that includes AC or heating)

[Mark Levitski]

If you coat the entire piece w/ Anchorseal it will hardly dry at all, and when you do open it back up to finish turn (thinking it is really dry) it will crack. In this case, Anchorseal is too good.

I agree w/ Leo-- make sure no cracks exist to begin with, bag it right away, and don't worry about any mold or mildew. I sometimes use some CA in the gnarly grain areas. But usually I apply some Anchorseal there to equalize drying (knots, endgrain, and such).

I have had pretty good results with a tenon rather than a recess, but the principle is to maintain equal thickness.

[Kim Ford]

Leo and Patrick,

I looked incorreclty at the menu page and thought this was Leo's post and addressed my reply to him after reading only what I now realize was Patrick's original post. My error and apology I wasn't trying to cut in on anyones thread.

IMHO, I really like the finished product when turning apple. I still have a couple of the logs I originally got, about 24" in diameter and 6' long in one of my barns. It just seems to me that the cracking I experienced with this apple was more severe that any of the other woods I have turned and the DNA method seemed to yield better results.

I think I will take the chainsaw out this weekend and try it again hopefully with better luck.