Advice on 2x4 Shop Plans

[Ray Newman]

"I mean, think about it--honestly, the only reason to put 45 degree cuts on a shop shelf is because of some misguided attempt at including style to the thing." (Italics added RCN)
--Dave MacArthur

I think you have it right....

[Don Dorn]

"I mean, think about it--honestly, the only reason to put 45 degree cuts on a shop shelf is because of some misguided attempt at including style to the thing." (Italics added RCN)
--Dave MacArthur

I think you have it right....

Just difference of opinion - I think he should do it to plan so he can practice a skill. While I'm not a stickler for plans to the end, I think that shop furniture allows practice without major risk. If he doesn't, he may always look at it and be reminded that he chose not to take the chance. At least that is how I'd look at it but realize there are different personalities.

As an example, all the drawers in my shop have hand cut dovetails. It wasn't for any other reason than for me to practice when I was learning the skill. They aren't perfect by any means, but every time I see them, I'm glad I went for it and know that they helped me eventually get on top of the skill.

[Ryan Dyer]

I appreciate all your guys thoughts and advice!

Probably intending you skip the plans entirely for that complicated leg, and make a 90 degree 2-board corner for each leg. They're very strong and stable, plenty for the shelf your plans show.

I mean, think about it--honestly, the only reason to put 45 degree cuts on a shop shelf is because of some misguided attempt at including style to the thing. It's not as strong or as stiff as a square cross section, you've just wasted away a large portion of the member. Doesn't make any difference for glue and screw strength, to speak of. The only conceivable reason to do that is if you start with a 2x10 and slice multiple sticks out of it, and even then you don't get more than squares would give. If I was looking to use shop furniture to practice various techniques (a common and very useful thing), I sure wouldn't put any time in on ripping 45 degrees on warped and reactionary 2x material. I'd rather practice pocket screws, and maybe some mortises, in this case I'd laminate 3 strips of plywood together for the legs and leave gaps in the center strip to provide mortises.

Sorry to pound on your plan, man! If you build it I'm sure it will look nice, but IMO shop furniture is not the place to add complication, wastage, and reduced strength.

(added pic of my PM66 extension table support legs, 2 strips of ply at 90 degrees with some trussing. Extremely stable and strong, and super light weight. For shelving and support, think LIGHT, think bridges)

I didnt make the plan hehe, i just purchased it. I wish i could post the whole plans but im sure since i had to pay for it (it was cheap) its copyrighted and i could get in trouble for posting it. But if you watch the video on the original post, it pretty much explains everything.

I wish i could work with strictly MDF or plywood. I enjoy that much better then 2x4s. However, with that said, i really like the way these plans look and work. The plans are very flexible since everything is built from the same components and concepts. Even the workbench and cart is same idea. They all look uniform which is important to me since i want my "man cave" to look nice. It also uses cheap materials, so if i do mess up that 2x4, which i know i'll mess up at least 4 since it takes me 4 tries to do anything, im only out $2.05 a try Anyway, thats the run down on why i choose those plans.

Let me ask you this, assuming i stick with these plans, would it be worthwhile to invest in a jointer to straighten up the edge of my 2x4 prior to ripping? Cause i will have to rip quite a few.

Just difference of opinion - I think he should do it to plan so he can practice a skill. While I'm not a stickler for plans to the end, I think that shop furniture allows practice without major risk. If he doesn't, he may always look at it and be reminded that he chose not to take the chance. At least that is how I'd look at it but realize there are different personalities.

As an example, all the drawers in my shop have hand cut dovetails. It wasn't for any other reason than for me to practice when I was learning the skill. They aren't perfect by any means, but every time I see them, I'm glad I went for it and know that they helped me eventually get on top of the skill.

This is exactly why i haven't redesigned the posts to just use a 2x4 with nothing ripped out of it. Its a challenge. I have learned a ton just from trying to figure out the best way to rip these 2x4's.

[Dave MacArthur]

If I was looking to use shop furniture to practice various techniques (a common and very useful thing), I sure wouldn't put any time in on ripping 45 degrees on warped and reactionary 2x material. I'd rather practice pocket screws, and maybe some mortises

I'm right there with you on practicing techniques on shop furniture, as I said above. But when I saw you had questions on this about dimensions and how it could be achieved and if it was important, I just wanted to point out that it wasn't really too important... I'm just saying, don't let being overly concerned with that angle and the dimensions around it stop you from getting started hey? And of course, as Ron says above (who doesn't really have a different opinion as it turns out ), practicing dovetails is a great use of shop furniture time. Also, you're right, it's a nice unified look if doing the whole shop.

Jointer-- yes, you need a jointer. Ripping 2x material is one of the more risky cuts, in that they are generally warped or curved (causes pinching/kickback), they tend to move after being cut more than other boards (pinching/kickback). I think it's quite important when ripping 2x material to have a good flat edge to start, and a splitter or riving knife--DON'T do it on a saw with the splitter removed.

Good luck!

[Ryan Dyer]

I'm right there with you on practicing techniques on shop furniture, as I said above. But when I saw you had questions on this about dimensions and how it could be achieved and if it was important, I just wanted to point out that it wasn't really too important... I'm just saying, don't let being overly concerned with that angle and the dimensions around it stop you from getting started hey? And of course, as Ron says above (who doesn't really have a different opinion as it turns out ), practicing dovetails is a great use of shop furniture time. Also, you're right, it's a nice unified look if doing the whole shop.

Jointer-- yes, you need a jointer. Ripping 2x material is one of the more risky cuts, in that they are generally warped or curved (causes pinching/kickback), they tend to move after being cut more than other boards (pinching/kickback). I think it's quite important when ripping 2x material to have a good flat edge to start, and a splitter or riving knife--DON'T do it on a saw with the splitter removed.

Good luck!

Yeah, i am glad you brought that up about it not having to be exact because after you mentioned it i started looking at it and your right. A large carriage bolt draws the posts into the shelf framework on each shelf, worse thing that would happen is my post wont be exactly flush with the shelf frame. Not a big deal. It wont effect its function one bit.

Hopefully i can start in the next few weeks. I got the 2x4's "seasoning" in my garage and a table saw safety kit from rockler on its way. Going to order the hardware i need next. Also going to look for a jointer now

[Zac Vasilinda]

I think I'll try these plans out too. Thanks for posting here and passing along the ideas! I'm going to see if I can do it with just the eurekazone track saw table / powerbench table and accessories. We'll see.

[Ryan Dyer]

So i picked up a Ridgid Jointer and got it mounted on a mobile base. I have run into a bit of another snag though...in the plans its calls for some 1" x 5 1/2" x 96" lumber. Now the plans say all lumber is construction lumber, mdf and plywood which can be easily found. Well i looked all over the place in lowes and HD and can't find any true 1" thick boards. The plans don't mean 3/4" wood either, they mean literally 1" thick. So, i realize i can rip a 2x4 to give me that, but before i started ripping, is 1" thick d-fir available somewhere?

[Erik France]

Not in available Construction grade lumber that I know of.

What parts is it for? I've got the Shopnotes #97 in front of me to see if using a 3/4" thickness would make an impact. I don't redily see where a piece that size goes.

[Rod Sheridan]

I'm with Dave, to paraphrase Tage Frid "congratulations, you've discovered the most complicated way to make shop storage units".

I also would go with stips of plywood glued together to make angle iron shapes for the uprights.

Must be some reason why Dexion is so popular

Regards, Rod.

P.S. About the only thing I use dimensional lumber for is construction, the stuff around here is just crap.

[Ryan Dyer]

Not in available Construction grade lumber that I know of.

What parts is it for? I've got the Shopnotes #97 in front of me to see if using a 3/4" thickness would make an impact. I don't redily see where a piece that size goes.

Its for all the corner pieces. The little triangle shaped pieces. It makes a difference because after you drill a 1/2" hole in 3/4" thick wood for the carriage bolts, your not left with much meat on each side

[Erik France]

OK, I see it now.

Wow, I think 1/2" carriage bolts are a bit much. I'd go with 5/16" or 1/4" bolts and use a 1x6 for the corner blocks. Unless you're loading those shelves with gold bricks four 1/4" bolts would handle plenty.

[Ryan Dyer]

Yeah...lil late now...i already ordered 100 of them

[Ryan Dyer]

I'm with Dave, to paraphrase Tage Frid "congratulations, you've discovered the most complicated way to make shop storage units".

I also would go with stips of plywood glued together to make angle iron shapes for the uprights.

Must be some reason why Dexion is so popular

Regards, Rod.

P.S. About the only thing I use dimensional lumber for is construction, the stuff around here is just crap.

Doesn't anyone around here enjoy a challenge?

I considered doing angle pieces, its a lot easier. Thing is, i also have to spend time designing a bunch of stuff. Which i am trying to avoid.
I really liked these plans as they look nice, its easy to customize, did i mention they look really nice? I also am a newb and lack experience. So i liked the fact that the plans held my hand and the design is obviously proven. I can then use the same techniques to customize it. For instance, if you look at the link in my OP, Where the miter saw is, im going to put my RAS there, and build out another bench to the right so i have a huge in/out feed setup for it.
I realize i could just redesign the posts to use angle plywood, but i wanted to follow the plans and i think the angled 2x4 looks nicer.

[Erik France]

Hehe, I figured that would be the case.

You could take an 1/4" off each face of a 2x6 on your jointer to get there. You'd get some good practice on face jointing in the process.(and a big pile of chips) Might be a good enough of an excuse to get a thickness planer.

[Rod Sheridan]

That was good Ryan, yes I like a challenge, sometimes too much for my own good.

The problem with dimensional lumber is that it's never dry or straight, so it's a frustrating material to work with.

That's why plywood has been mentioned a couple of times.

I did once buy rough 2 X4 material from the saw mill I deal with and they were great.

I was able to joint and plane them into nice material.

Let your dimensional lumber acclimate to your shop for a few weeks before you begin doing anything, or stick it together immediately in the hopes that it won't twist like a pretzel. I'm still voting that it will twist, your shelves don't have any method of constraining movement.

regards, Rod.