Question regarding Grizzly 12" Jointer G0609X and Spiral Cutterhead

[Glen Blanchard]

I'm looking seriously at acquiring this beast, but I don't know much about spiral cutterheads. It appears to me (but I could be wrong) that although this machine comes with a spiral cutterhead, that for an additional cost one can upgrade to a Shelix spiral cutterhead. Am I seeing that correctly, or is the reference to a Shelix cutterhead there for upgrading information for those with traditional knives? Or is the Shelix an upgrade to the Grizzly spiral cutterhead? If it is, what is the advantage of the Shelix?

Thanks.

http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/2011/Main/45

[Mikail Khan]

is the reference to a Shelix cutterhead there for upgrading information for those with traditional knives?

I believe this is the case. You can call Grizzly to confirm.

Grizzly sells 2 types of spiral cutterheads - their own which comes with inserts which have straight edges and which are mounted on the cutterhead at 90 degrees to the workpiece direction and they also sell heads made by Byrd which has inserts that have a slight radius on the edges and are mounted on the head at an angle which is supposed to give less tearout on figured wood.

The 609X comes with the grizzly head. I've had mine for about 2 years and with hobbyist use I have not had to rotate the inserts as yet.

MK

[Don Bullock]

Yes, he Shelix an upgrade to the Grizzly spiral cutterhead.

The following page in the Grizzly 2011 Catalog seems to explain the differences in the cutter heads.

http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/2011/Main/48

[Van Huskey]

To make sure you understand you can NOT upgrade to a Shelix in that you can not pay extra money and get the jointer shipped to you with the Byrd head installed. You can buy it separately and install it. IF they did this (like Oliver who has 4 head choices) I would absolutely get the Byrd if nothing else a significant chunk of the overall cost of the jointer would be American made. Buying it and installing it does not make fiscal sense though since you can just get it with a knock-off head already installed.

[Mark Henshaw]

I have the 12" jointer/planer with the Grizzly spiral head and am very pleased with the results. I do confess though that I have nothing to compare to other then 30 years of woodworking with HSS knives. (no experience with the Shelix)

[Brian Kincaid]

I have a Byrd on my jointer and a Grizz spiral on my planer. Quality of head and cut are great on both. For comparisons sake I call it a wash. Byrd is made in USA. Both are lightyears better than straight blades for noise during cut. Tearout in wild grain is reduced appreciably.
-Brian

[Shiraz Balolia]

My suggestion is to buy the machine with the Grizzly head preinstalled on it, clean it and start making sawdust/chips.

I have used both, and have access to both and my 12" jointer and 20" planer at home have Grizzly cutterheads. In a "coke and pepsi" challenge, I would challenge anyone who can tell the difference on a similar piece of wood as to which one was done with which cutterhead.

[Mark Blatter]

I had the top of the line Grizzly jointer (2007 model) with the Grizzly head on it and it was incredible. We ran thousands of board feet through it over three years, all kinds of wood, but mostly cherry, maple, walnut, oak plus others, and as I recall we had only turned the cutters one turn. The equivalant planer provided the same quality of cut as well.

[Travis Porter]

I have a 20" planer (not Grizzly) and a jointer with a Shelix head, and a friend with a 24" Grizzly with their insert head. I personally cannot tell the difference between them and both are super quiet compared to machines with straight knife heads.

My only issue with either of the insert heads is that it takes a good bit of work and time to rotate the inserts, but it is worth the ease and cleaness of cuts.

PS - You can still get valleys/ripples if you feed too fast with the jointer. DAMHIKT

[Mikail Khan]

. In a "coke and pepsi" challenge, I would challenge anyone who can tell the difference on a similar piece of wood as to which one was done with which cutterhead.

I will take you up on your challenge. I have the shelix head on my planer. Because of the radius on the inserts, the shelix head leaves equally spaced grooves few thou deep along the length of the work piece. The grooves are visible if the workpiece is held up at an angle to a light. They are even more visible if the project is not sanded properly and a finish is applied. DAMHIKT.


What I would like to see is a comparison of both heads on identical planers. Points could be awarded based on:

Insert life.
Noise levels.
Finish.
Amount of sanding reqd. before a finish can be applied.
Initial cost for a complete head.
Replacement cost for a set of inserts for both heads. (I think the Shelix has more inserts).

MK

[Josh Rudolph]

I have the same jointer with the Grizzly cutterhead in my shop. It is my buddies, but I have the space. Lucky me! It is a great machine...we have ran quite a bit of board feet through it...I would guess close to a thousand board feet. No real signs of the cutterheads needing rotated yet either. My 20" planer however has straight blades and has been needing a sharpening for a little bit now. It has seen about the same amount of wood as the jointer but needed a sharpening a little while ago. So rather than the $60 investment in sharpening and the $100 plus investment for a 2nd set of knives, I went ahead and ordered the 20" spiral cutterhead. hhhmmm...some type of logic there . I have been wanting it for a time now based upon the finish that is provided on figured wood, so I have been waiting on the first needed sharpening before I replaced it. I just scraped the funds together to purchase it last week. Hopefully I will be installing tonight.

Back to your jointer decision...go ahead and make the investment now and you will quickly realize the benefit. I certainly wish I would have made the investment when I bought the planer. It is costing me more now.

[Greg Portland]

I will take you up on your challenge. I have the shelix head on my planer. Because of the radius on the inserts, the shelix head leaves equally spaced grooves few thou deep along the length of the work piece. The grooves are visible if the workpiece is held up at an angle to a light. They are even more visible if the project is not sanded properly and a finish is applied. DAMHIKT.

Mikail, you have described the surface left by the Shelix cutter. However, how does it compare to a different cutter head (the "pepsi challenge")? I don't think anyone is going to claim that you can skip sanding a planed surface (regardless of cutter technology). You seem to not have a favorable impression of the Shelix cutter, what head do you think does a better job?

[Jim Andrew]

I have the GO609 jointer with the Byrd cutterhead. The jointer came with a 3 blade cutterhead and I had to install the Byrd. PITA. Had to take off the infeed table. Once I had that done, took out the cutterhead and replaced it with the Byrd, then reinstalled the infeed table. When I called Griz, they said to remove both infeed and outfeed, but I managed to do it with just the one table removed. Only downside to the cutter I can see, is instead of a 12" jointer, you have a 11 3/4. And you can't use it for rabbeting.

[Van Huskey]

And you can't use it for rabbeting.

Does anyone use a jointer to rabbet anymore?

[Mikail Khan]

Mikail, you have described the surface left by the Shelix cutter. However, how does it compare to a different cutter head (the "pepsi challenge")? I don't think anyone is going to claim that you can skip sanding a planed surface (regardless of cutter technology). You seem to not have a favorable impression of the Shelix cutter, what head do you think does a better job?

The shelix is an exellent head, but I am not sure I would pay more for it.

At the time I purchased my planer I did not know who made the head. All I knew and cared about was that it was a carbide head. Same situation with the jointer.

Beacuse I have the heads mounted in different machines I can't make a fair comparison to say one is better than the other. In my opinion both are far superior to straight knives. My planer (byrd head) is 3 years old while the jointer is 2 years old (grizz head).

I am guesstimating that I take twice as many passes with my planer (with heavier cuts) than my jointer. The jointer is 12" and the planer is 20" so the work is spread over more cutters on the planer.

Both heads have 4 rows of inserts and turn at around 5000rpm.

I have not rotated the inserts on either machine. Because of my location, most of the wood I use is teak and mahogany.

My perception is (I have never measured it) that for the same width of board my jointer makes more noise than my planer even though I take lighter cuts with my jointer. This difference may be as a result of how the machines are constructed as well as how close I am to the cutterhead during jointing operations.


Because of the grooves from the curved inserts, boards from the planer (byrd) definitely require more sanding than from the jointer (grizzly) or from a planer with straight knives. I do all my sanding with a random orbit sander. For people with a drum or wide belt sander the grooves will not be an issue.

A few weeks ago I found that I was getting more tearout from the jointer than the planer. Recently, i've found that the amount of tearout is about the same even though I have not rotated the inserts on either machine.

Apart from the grooves left by the byrd inserts I cannot tell the difference in surface finish between the byrd and grizz heads .

Apart from the physical differences in the heads the quality of the carbide used to make the inserts may be different which could mean that inserts from one manufacturer could outlast the inserts from another.

Because of the number of variables involved I think a side by side comparision would have to be done before anyone can say brand X is better.

I mentioned above that I probably would not pay more for a Byrd head. However because I do my woodwork in a garage in a residential area noise levels are important to me. Both the byrd and the grizzly heads are supposed to be quieter than straight knives, but i've never seen a noise level comparison done for both heads. If the noise levels with the Byrd head are significantly lower than with the grizzly I would consider paying extra for it even though I might have to spend extra time sanding.

MK