How many of you that do woodworkng for a living still enjoy it?

[phil harold]

+1 on the construction and remodeling contractor comments on regulation and competition with under the table companies
add to that all the DIY shows, box stores...
need to have the clients or sales that will support you
Start part time and see if it will blossom!

being your own boss has lots of freedom but also has many headaches...

[hank dekeyser]

I forgot to mention also, don't "pigeon hole" yourself either - diversity is the key. Through the years I've learned / taught myself how to do most of what I need to "survive" Effectively making i teasier on myself by only needing to create income for the things in life I can't do. IE: pay for tools, mortgage, insurance, etc. Being that I can and do most everything for myself, I'm not faced with the "how am I going to afford to buy a new whatever it may be. I am my own mechanic, builder, furniture maker, etc. - My shop is outfitted with most everything I migh tneed to do just about anything. (woodworking, mechanical, welding, sewing- yes sewing!, shoe repair, vehicle maintenance, home maintenence, etc.) In the end, it's not about what my end wage per hour is, since I enjoy it all, and so long as I can "pay" for the things I can't do for myself, I'm still ahead of the game. Like I said - it's a way of life, I've always got something going on in the shop. Enjoy!

[John Kali]

Thank you all for the input! I think for now, I am going to have to suck it up, and keep on keeping on. My fiance wants to go back to school, so I will remain a dental tech while she does that. I will re-evaluate my situation when she has found herself a new source of income. Not to mention just how much is already invested in the lab. Everyone keeps telling me a new business takes 5-6 years to really get going. I'm at about 3.5 right now, and we are still working out some kinks with work flow, book keeping etc.. Perhaps when things get more streamlined it will get better. I guess only time will tell...

[keith micinski]

I have a job where I get paid large amounts of money (considering I only have a high school degree), great benefits and a great pension. I work two miles from my house and I am off for 3 months out of the year in the winter. I pick up a pile of dirt and move it from point a to point b and on and on all day accomplishing nothing. I would actually consider taking as much as a 20 to 30 thousand dollar a year pay cut to do something that has some meaning and makes me happy. I do agree that there is a balance between being happy and being poor but after 11 years of hating my job I think I would like to give it a go at being poor and happy instead of well off and miserable. I moved out when I was 18 and for the first two years on my own I had macaroni and cheese for breakfast lunch and dinner because it was all I could afford. I remember having my whole life in front of me and making big plans everyday back then. Now I just try and find a way to make through another day. If what your doing now is not going to make you rich then I suggest doing something that makes you happy. Don't take this wrong way but you don't have a lot to lose if your putting 60-70 hours a week and only bringing in 18k.

[Doug Mason]

"I do agree that there is a balance between being happy and being poor but after 11 years of hating my job I think I would like to give it a go at being poor and happy instead of well off and miserable."

I love it!!!! It is a universal thought (doesn't matter what trade you're in)--a thought which most of us at some point have no doubt entertained; I certainly have. It's called "irony," and then we're all dead anyway!!!

[Dan Hintz]

I think for now, I am going to have to suck it up, and keep on keeping on. My fiance wants to go back to school, so I will remain a dental tech while she does that. I will re-evaluate my situation when she has found herself a new source of income. Not to mention just how much is already invested in the lab.

Not to be a wet rag, but I hope your relationship is strong. After your fiance allows you to help her pay her way through a degree, she could very well decide her new-found monetary security is all she needs and leave you scrambling with <$20k/yr doing the same ol' same ol'... and you still hadn't decided to try your hand at owning your own business. I certainly hope that never happens, but something to consider.

[Larry Edgerton]

Not to be a wet rag, but I hope your relationship is strong. After your fiance allows you to help her pay her way through a degree, she could very well decide her new-found monetary security is all she needs and leave you scrambling with <$20k/yr doing the same ol' same ol'... and you still hadn't decided to try your hand at owning your own business. I certainly hope that never happens, but something to consider.

I didn't want to say anything but now that that ship has sailed I can personally vouch for the truth in that statement. Kept the new house too......

[Karl Brogger]

Holy CRAP! You only work 60-70hrs a week! and you make $18k a year?!

Don't start get into woodworking..... I don't make much more than that, but the company does pay for both my vehicles.

Now, the last real full time job I had I made probably $70k as a cabinetmaker. That was working 55 hours a week for the company, and another 10-20hrs a week doing side jobs with my employers shop. I was 21 or 22 at the time.

I enjoy parts of it, mainly being getting paid. The rest of it is just another job. I do hate most of it, but parts are okay now and again. I'd do something else if I had any other tangible skills, or anything above a 10th grade education. I'm relying on the lottery at this point, my investment guy says I should try something a bit less speculative though....

[David Prince]

For $18,000 a year working 60 to 70 hours a week you are getting the short end of the stick!

[Tony Bilello]

If you are only making $18,000 a year working 60 to 70 hours a week THIS is the best time to start your own business. This is the time you have literally nothing to lose. At you current job you are making less than a store clerk at minimum wage.
When it is all said and done, it's not the things we did in life but the things we didn't do that we will regret the most. It is better to have tried and failed than to have not done it at all. When I made the jump at age 40, I was an Electronics Engr. working for SW Bell. It was one of the best paying jobs in Arkansas at the time.

[James White]

Two things about this. Is the 18K off the books? Because 18k cash is not the same as 18K gross. The other thing is. He mentioned investing in the buisness. That to me means borrowing money that will = equity in the future. So there goes some of his pay in the form of a nest egg. Just a thought.

If you are only making $18,000 a year working 60 to 70 hours a week THIS is the best time to start your own business. This is the time you have literally nothing to lose. At you current job you are making less than a store clerk at minimum wage.
When it is all said and done, it's not the things we did in life but the things we didn't do that we will regret the most. It is better to have tried and failed than to have not done it at all. When I made the jump at age 40, I was an Electronics Engr. working for SW Bell. It was one of the best paying jobs in Arkansas at the time.

[Dan Hintz]

Two things about this. Is the 18K off the books? Because 18k cash is not the same as 18K gross.

Even off the books, that's not much at all... less than most teachers. He's saving, what, maybe $4-5k off of the books?

[Chris Fournier]

This has been a very interesting thread. I think that some folks have offered advice and others have offered personal experiences for you to consider. In both cases you are still left wondering what you should do.

I left a decent paying corporate job in my early thirties to woodwork full time. Was it the right choice? I'll never know, but what I did know at the time was that getting out of bed to go and do the same meaningless job for the rest of my life was no longer an option for me. I took a MASSIVE pay cut, lost all my benefits and stared uncertainty in the eye long enough to still be uncertain!

By the books, I made a gross error! No matter, I had reached my tipping point and I personally could no longer wear the suit and tie and do the job I was being paid to do. You will likely know when its time for you to move on as well, whether you do or not has everything to do with your personal value system.

One word of caution (read advice). Woodworking is just that when its your hobby. When it is your business it involves sales, bookeeping etc. Not many of us woodworkers really want to sign up for that stuff - but if you don't you'll be very unhappy with woodworking as a career.

I'm sure that you'll sort it all out with time. And if you choose to help your gal through school then do so. I did and it was the best "investment" that I've ever made. I'm fortunate I guess.

[Sean Nagle]

I see three aspects to John's predicament.

One aspect that no one has commented about is that he OWNS [or co-owns] this business with his father and possibly his fiance. Does John have any capital investment in this business or is it his father alone. What is the plan for this business? The business obviously is generating revenue, is that in line with the plan? Is it expected to grow? Can John just walk away from the business or does his father depend on John's participation for the ultimate success of the business?

The second aspect is whether John enjoys this kind of work, not necessarily what he is doing right now. As an owner of a business, crappy work might need to be done by the owner until the owner feels they can hire someone to do that work. Again, what is the long term plan for the business?

The final aspect is financial. Here again, is the business struggling that John is making the small amount he is making right now? Or is it that his job is at an inefficient stage right now and efficiencies will be found as they get the right processes, pricing and business model in place? John might be doing the job that he could hire someone for minimum wage to do when all the cost structures are working to plan?

Making a living woodworking still involves running a business. Those aspects might not be too different from his current situation.

[Lloyd McKinlay]

Meanwhile I bid a job using their technics, and explained to the homeowner the costs of lead containment. They promptly went out and hired a scab contractor to do the job who will do it without the EPA precautions. I could turn in that fellow, but he is just trying to make a living, and I am not a stooley.

This is what I don't understand. Why not report him? The guy is breaking the law. He has already proven he doesn't care about doing things properly so how many other corners is he cutting? Are his employees properly protected from the long term effects of lead? What about the homeowner and their children? The negative effects of even a minuscule amount of lead in children are to numerous to list, yet they are now exposed to the dangers.

Unlicensed contractors steal from those who register, comply with the rules, and operate ethically. I'm sure you would report someone stealing from your neighbor, why not from you?