Jet DC cone tech - WHY NO RETROFIT????

[Dan Hintz]

I've been meaning to post my latest "design", which somewhat implements what Alan is talking about. I have the pics, but for whatever reason my favorite program (Paint.NET) is having issues installing on my new Win7-64 machine. When I get that resolved, I'll start a new thread.

[David Lame]

Sean, same problem, same conclusion and I too will look else where for my future purchases.

[Sean Hughto]

Been much happier with this:

[Jeff Nicol]

Sean, For about $35 I bet you could go to any sheetmetal shop and tell them what you need and you would have one in your hand when you left. I did it for 25 plus years and a cone like that is one of the first things we learn to lay out in apprentice school. I think if you had a scoop or dust director put on where the pipe enters the center band that would direct the dust down and with a turn in to start it spinning it would do the same thing. It could be as simple as a flat piece of metal that starts above the inlet and then curves around the center band and stops at the bottom of the band. This will start the vortex and thow the bigger particles to the outside of the bag and settle out a lot of the smaller dust. I built a few cyclones and worked on some that were 20' around and 30' tall and they all have a baffle to start the spinning action and then the big ones have a big multi bag "Baghouse" filter for the small stuff.

I have some ideas so send me a PM and I will do some sketchs for you, just need the diameter of the center band. I hate to see guys in a lurch and upset over a simple fix, or should I say simple in my mixed up over thinking brain!

Willing to help,

Jeff

[Jeff Monson]

Sean, For about $35 I bet you could go to any sheetmetal shop and tell them what you need and you would have one in your hand when you left. I did it for 25 plus years and a cone like that is one of the first things we learn to lay out in apprentice school. I think if you had a scoop or dust director put on where the pipe enters the center band that would direct the dust down and with a turn in to start it spinning it would do the same thing. It could be as simple as a flat piece of metal that starts above the inlet and then curves around the center band and stops at the bottom of the band. This will start the vortex and thow the bigger particles to the outside of the bag and settle out a lot of the smaller dust. I built a few cyclones and worked on some that were 20' around and 30' tall and they all have a baffle to start the spinning action and then the big ones have a big multi bag "Baghouse" filter for the small stuff.

I have some ideas so send me a PM and I will do some sketchs for you, just need the diameter of the center band. I hate to see guys in a lurch and upset over a simple fix, or should I say simple in my mixed up over thinking brain!

Willing to help,

Jeff

Jeff, I think Sean bought a super dust deputy so he wont be needing the cone. Thats my take on his follow up. Sean do you get much fine dust in the cartridge after adding the deputy?? I made my own cone as Jeff suggested shortly after Sean started this thread, its been a couple months, I get at least 60% less fine dust up to the cartridge since I did this simple mod.

[Sean Hughto]

Thank you, Jeff and Jeff, or Jeffs, if you prefer. ;-)

Mr. Nichol, love your metal work, as you know. Mr. Monson is right that I went the dust deputy route, so I'm not worried about the cone.

Mr. Monson, the Deputy works GREAT! Very little dust reaches the bag - I've had the same bag on for months, and it still only has tiny bit of debris in it. The filter only gets very fine dust - unlike the old days where shavings and everything would lodge in it immediately. The filter is easy to clean out with the air hose spraying from the outside, unlike the old days where I had a disgusting and long shop vac job to do to reclaim the filter from the muck and yuck that were lodged in it.

[Ted Baca]

I too have a DC1100 with the canister. And I saw this cone fo the first time at the WW Show last november. I looked at WoodCraft again tonight and took a few pictures. I think that it can be made fairly easily, but I was hoping buy searching this thread that maybe by now somewone had come up with a production accessory. I do understand why Jet won't sell it as an upgrade, but I would think Penn State, Woodline or someone like that would have a similar accessory that wouldn't cross patent lines. I think the best solution maybe as mentioned above a sheet metal shop to make one. My concern is the one on the Jet or Powermatic seem to be more substancial metal than tin. Does anyone know if it needs to be hollow underneath? I wonder if one made of wood would work as effectively? Anyone have experience?

[Bruce Wrenn]

Why not just add a "Thien Baffle" into your DC? Go over to Thien's web site and check out installs on similar units.

[Ted Baca]

I have never heard of this before I found a website cgallery.com, is that thiens website? It seems to be quite a solution, however I have limited shop space and if I could add the Vortex cone to my DC it would save space. But from what I am seeing on the Thien is that I could pretty much eliminate the collection bag.

[Daniel Berlin]

I have never heard of this before I found a website cgallery.com, is that thiens website? It seems to be quite a solution, however I have limited shop space and if I could add the Vortex cone to my DC it would save space. But from what I am seeing on the Thien is that I could pretty much eliminate the collection bag.

You can put the baffle right in the DC, it works great.

Note that Phil says he tried the vortex cone design early on, and found it worse than the design you see on his website.

Phil has a number of patent applications on the baffle designs, and I expect Jet felt the vortex was a workaround of Phil's patents, rather than "the best they could do".

[Steve Costa]

I just ordered the Super Dust Deputy & HEPA Media Filter Kit from Oneida to add to my Steel City dust collector. After reading the FWW article on dust collection I decided this is the best solution for me. These items are expensive but anytime I can buy from a US company that is what I do. The HEPA filter replaces the dust bag & the Super Dust Deputy will capture a 90+% of the larger particles. I am very fond of my lungs and believe this set up will go a long way to keeping them working well!!!

[Bruce Wrenn]

Thien baffle can most likely be added to your DC, inside the ring.

[Matt McColley]

found this old thread during a search and thought I'd bump it....

I'm looking to update my G0548Z with a Thien plate or cone and came across this guys site.... where he does a combo of the two ideas ...... here's the link

and here's a quick pic....
tin hat.jpg

If Phil Thien could comment this, I'd be interested in his thoughts.

having read this thread from begining to end, I'll add my $.02 (worth what your paying to read it :^)

I totally agree with Sean.... that Jet is poking their loyal customers who purchased over priced 1100 series DCs in the eye.

As far as the reasonable expectation to recoup the cost of design developement.... how much does it cost to copy an older version of some one elses idea (as opposed to the best version that is in the process of being patented) and send it to Asia to have a $5 cone and a bent metal bracket added?

and as far as "which is better"....

Coke, Briefs and Ford (because they didn't stiff their investors and suck on the gub'ment teet)

[Phil Thien]

If Phil Thien could comment this, I'd be interested in his thoughts.

The cone is actually counter-productive. The cone actually serves as a sort of ramp which pushes the airstream (turbulence) down into the bag.

Certainly, the added "brim" (I think he calls it) helps.

If you read my comments here and elsewhere, you will see I have tested nearly every imaginable shape. I have published the one that works best.

[Joseph Tarantino]

if the cone is counterproductive, phil, then what do these pics of a jet DC owner added a cone say?

http://ary.com/WoodWorking/Shop/Jet/index.html

i am a fan of your work and have constructed two 5 gallon pail separators, so i know the baffle works. the added cones or salad bowls or wok/wok lids just seem to significantly increase the effectiveness of these single stage collectors so easily that it makes it a very tempting modification.

if a baffle were to be added instead, what are your thoughts on how to mount it within the dust collector drum? when i built my 5 gallon separators, the baffle was suspended from the bucket lid with 3 long bolts. any thoughts on how to mount the baffle to the DC drum?