Stacking tires on Band Saw wheels

[Mike Cruz]

Okay, I know this sounds crazy. Believe me, I know. And I'm sure I'm gonna get some head tilts, eye rolls, and head shakes. But here it goes...

I got a 1958 Delta/Rockwell 20" band saw a few months back. I've got her running really nicely, but with one issue... When I replaced the tires with Carter urethane tires (blue ones), the blade moved closer to the body of the saw (just under the table) because the replacement tires are about 1/2 the thickness of the old tires. The blade runs between a 1/16 and an 1/8 of an inch form the metal saw body. If there is any vibration of the blade, 1/2 the teeth would get dull instantly.

So, I'm wondering if anyone has had this problem and came up with a fix for it. One of my thoughts is to get another set of urethane tires and put them on, too. Thus increasing the overall tire thickness, and getting the blade another 1/16"+ away from the metal body. Any thoughts?

[Gary Herrmann]

Is the blade a standard length? Does your blade fall outside of the recommended length maybe?

If it were me, I'd measure that and consider buying a different length or even custom sized. Although I don't know how many blades you'd need to replace.

Personally I don't like the idea of an additional set of tires. Especially if it's running as smoothly as you say.

[Andrew Kertesz]

Are the wheels/tires crowned or flat? If they are crowned personally I wouldn't trust it, flat might be worth a try.

[Michael Peet]

Is the blade a standard length? Does your blade fall outside of the recommended length maybe?

I think the issue is that the thinner tires make the overall wheel diameter smaller. Blade length would not have an effect.

I don't have a solution though.

Mike

[John McClanahan]

If you can't come up with a better idea, I would give it a try. Worst case, you would have to carefully cut the second tire off. Anything else will require getting the new tires off somehow.

John

[Chris Parks]

Take a grinder to the table and create the clearance?

[Mike Cruz]

Yes, Michael, you got it right. But to answer Gary's question, it does not take standard sizes. Well, it will take them, but the upper wheel is almost at its limit...puting the wheel almost up against the upper casing. And I just got my two new blades in.

Andrew, yes they are flat. The original tires were crowned, but these are flat.

John, I don't really mind trying it, but at $36 a tire (and I already have two on) if the second set of tires doesn't work and I ruin both sets, thats an easy $150 out the window. Rather not waste the money if I don't have to. But if it'll work...

[Myk Rian]

I think you got better advice on OWWM.

[Mike Cruz]

Saw that did ya, Myk? I thought I'd ask in both places. Funny how the answers differed. But I expect that. Many there are purists and probalby don't even know what those funky blue tires are anyway. But then again, those guys wouldn't be in my position right now 'cause they would have bought factory replacement tires that would fit just right...

The folks at Carter say that they've heard of people putting two layers on, but can't actually recommend it. That's why I thought I'd ask. To see if anyone's tried it, and if so, to what extent of success or failure.

[John McClanahan]

I hear ya on the cost! But you already have a new set mounted on the wheels. Could you even reuse the tires if you could remove them? In order to increase the overall diameter of the wheels to get the clearance where you need it, there seems to be few choices. I'm guessing a blade cost almost as much as a tire. As you said, if the blade scuffs the frame, it will be damaged.

I use a smaller specialty band saw at work that has the opposite problem. It is as if the wheels are a bit too big. The blade guides are are adjusted over to their limits as a result. I have done some frame trimming to allow clearance, but I dread doing it. Once the metal is removed, it can't be put back.

John

[Myk Rian]

I think the pressure and release cycles of stacked tires would lead to them separating from the wheels in short order, if not immediately.
As one stated on OWWM, Woodworkers tool works has 1/4" tires. I would go that route.
Even machine restorers use the urethane tires. I did.

By the way, they do need to be crowned. Any band saw with flat wheels needs it. If the saw has crowned wheels, such as a Delta 14", you don't need to do it. It needs to be done for the same reasons flat belt pulleys have a crown. It keeps a flat blade running true. The ridges in the wheels are for the cement, if used.
For a vintage saw, the last thing you want to do is grind the table for clearance.

[Lee Schierer]

Havve you checked to see if other manufacturers make thicker tires? I'm not familiar with the "blue ones", but as I recall, teh orange tires I obtained from Suffolk Machine for my Dad's 18" saw were about 1/4" thick.

[Salvatore Buscemi]

John, I don't really mind trying it, but at $36 a tire (and I already have two on) if the second set of tires doesn't work and I ruin both sets, thats an easy $150 out the window. Rather not waste the money if I don't have to. But if it'll work...

Take the first set off, I would imagine they haven't had much use, right? Since they weren't glued on, you should be able to re-sell them to someone who can use those tires, and then go buy the correct tires for that saw.

[Norman Hitt]

I think the pressure and release cycles of stacked tires would lead to them separating from the wheels in short order, if not immediately.
As one stated on OWWM, Woodworkers tool works has 1/4" tires. I would go that route.
Even machine restorers use the urethane tires. I did.

By the way, they do need to be crowned. Any band saw with flat wheels needs it. If the saw has crowned wheels, such as a Delta 14", you don't need to do it. It needs to be done for the same reasons flat belt pulleys have a crown. It keeps a flat blade running true. The ridges in the wheels are for the cement, if used.
For a vintage saw, the last thing you want to do is grind the table for clearance.

That isn't exactly correct, because NONE of the MiniMax bandsaws have either crowned wheels OR tires, and the tires are not glued to the wheels either. I "think" most of the Italian Bandsaws are the same as the MiniMax Saws in regard to being flat.

Note: I have no idea if the crowned tires are absolutely essential on his Delta Saw though, but he does need thicker tires, and I would be a little skeptical as to whether glue would hold two urethane tires together or not.

[Mike Cruz]

Again, thanks to all for the comments and suggestions. Here's where I stand:

No the tires are not glued down, so yes, they can be and will be resold to someone that can use them. I found a set of tires from Sulpher Grove (they have an Ebay store). Each set comes with an upper and lower tire (orange, thicker than the blue ones) and a set of very thin tires (actually more like a narrow band) that goes into the grove of the wheel. This band is slightly thicker than the groove is deep. So, when you put the tire on, it creates a crown. The price is quite reasonable...even free shipping. I'm going to try these. If this doesn't work, I'll sell these, too, and just spend the money for OEM tires.