Removing excess set in impulse hardened saws

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

I have a couple cheap, impulse hardened pullsaws I use for for cutting down sheet goods, or when I don't want to risk using my "nice" saws for something. In dialing in the set on the last saw I sharpened, it occurred to me that these saws have way too much set for my tastes. Obviously the best solution would be to use a different or better saw - but these have a fair amount of life left in them, and getting a new saw would mean tossing the handle as well, both of which seem needlessly wasteful.

Has anyone had any success in removing the excess set in these? My gut tells me a file isn't going to cut these, and trying to press them in a vise might crack the teeth, but I haven't tried either.

[Mike Henderson]

Just stone them on each side. Try your best to stone equally.

Mike

[Simon Frez-Albrecht]

Since only the very edges of the tooth are hardened, even at the base of the tooth they should be soft enough to bend. Next time I need to change the set in a saw, I'm going to try this trick:
Never-mind, can't find the video. Basically, you use a metal jawed vise. You use paper sheets on each side of the plate for the amount of set you want (ex; 1 sheet magazine paper each side for .03" each side, or however it works out). Then pinch the teeth in a vise hard. The paper won't compress, but the teeth will to an even amount.

Hope that makes sense.

[jerry nazard]

Since only the very edges of the tooth are hardened, even at the base of the tooth they should be soft enough to bend. Next time I need to change the set in a saw, I'm going to try this trick:
Never-mind, can't find the video. Basically, you use a metal jawed vise. You use paper sheets on each side of the plate for the amount of set you want (ex; 1 sheet magazine paper each side for .03" each side, or however it works out). Then pinch the teeth in a vise hard. The paper won't compress, but the teeth will to an even amount.

Hope that makes sense.

Yes, that makes a heck of a lot of sense. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you!

-Jerry

[Paul Saffold]

I saw that "trick" mentioned here on the Creek a few years ago by Harry Strasil and since then by others including the Swartz just lately.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Didn't realize that the hardening was only on the edges of the tooth. Makes sense.

[David Weaver]

I would (and have- often) use a diamond hone or a stone capable of cutting the hardened teeth. Something in the 1000 grit range, and start with one even light pass on each side. The set comes off faster than you'd expect.

You have more control on the process doing that.

[Stuart Tierney]

#1000 grit stone on either side. A light pass.

3 passes takes most of the set of a Z Saw type saw (not dozuki style) and makes a pretty average saw into a nice cutting saw. Be careful though, it might bind in some cases, and certainly more prone to binding than an untouched saw.

No real effect on tooth life or durability, since the hardening is through the tooth at the tooth tips. You will lose any surface treatment for rust or drag reduction like nickel, chromium, etc.

Been there, done it. Never tried to actually 'remove' the set. Stoning the teeth works well enough (better than that actually!) and takes but a minute. Simon is correct that the hardening is not at the base of the teeth, so the 'paper-saw-vise' method might work well. If it doesn't, stone it.

Stu.

[David Weaver]

Be in a pickle if the vise method removes too much set, though, eh?

That's why I favor the stone. Three or four strokes on a bester or a diamond hone (can't remember which) has taken what seemed like a lot of set (but really wasn't, I guess) off a gyochuko combination dozuki i had, and made it so that it is no good for cutting anything other than dovetails - it binds.

On a junk material saw, maybe the set is more - on my junk material saw, the set was a little more, but not too much more.

[Pedder Petersen]

I stone all our blades, but I use blue tape to mask the sides of the blade but not the teeth. One layer on each side for the small saws and two on the bigger. And I use Grain 600 or G 400 Sandpaper to save the stones. Works quite ok as our cutsomers report.

Cheers
Pedder

[Richard Line]

After hearing Mike Wenzloff describe and recommend the vice method for reducing set (and he uses it to get a specific amount of set), and then reading Chris's blog on the method, I've gone and re-set 2 saws. For vice inserts, I cut a couple of pieces of 2 in. angle, about 4 in. long, and then 'surfaced' them with a 220 grit water stone. I found that newsprint gives a 0.003" set (one side) and my printer paper a 0.004" set.

That actual operation was quite easy using my old mechanics' vice with the inserts. Fold the paper over the saw and then clamp it in the vice, move it 4 inches and clamp again.

I re-set an old Stanley saw with non-hardened Japanese pattern teeth, but a push saw, and a cheapo metier saw I had picked up to practice sharpening. Both saws were improved by reducing the set to 0.004" and 0.003" per side. Other than making the vice inserts, it is fast and easy to do.