Behlen Rockhard for Gun Stock?

[Jon Middleton]

I have reshaped the forend on my Beretta Silver Pigeon V, as it had what Beretta calls a beavertail forend and a straight grip stock. You can see the finger grooves it shouldn't have in this photo.:



Straight grip buttstocks really should have a thinner forend, or what they call an English style. The reshaping is done, but the wood looked kiln-dried, that greyish brown color. I just finished staining it with Minwax "Walnut" stain, and am ready to finish it. I bought some Rockhard, hoping the phenolic resin would look nice. I have some tung oil also, and am considering making my own oil/varnish blend using 2 parts Rockhard to 1 part tung. Any thoughts? Should I just use pure Rockhard, a sealer coat of 1:1 with MS followed by top coats? Thanks in advance.

[Jerry Bruette]

I don't have any experience withe the Behlens, but I do with Waterlox. I think the waterlox would be better suited for a gun stock. I don't know how it would match the finish on your buttstock though.

Jerry

[Jon Middleton]

It doesn't need to match, as I stripped and sanded both the buttstock and forend. If I remember correctly, Waterlox is an oil/varnish blend. I want to make my own.

[Henry Ambrose]

The only problem with making your own is what if you make something that's not-so-good? Be sure to test what ever concoction you come up with before you finish your nice shotgun. I'm a fan of single material finishes for most things.

[george wilson]

I spent years making my own varnish as musical instrument maker in Williamsburg. I often spoke with a chemist at Behlen. I had noticed that their"Rock Hard" varnish wasn't very hard AT ALL. He told me they named it rock hard because it was alcohol resistant. That explanation never made any sense to me at all.

I have found that Tru Oil gunstock finish is a deep looking,beautiful finish AS LONG as you don't put too many coats on!! I tried finishing a violin with it,and the violin was hanging up for months before I got around to stringing it up. LOTS of drying time. Several months later,I noticed that the feet of the violin's bridge had sunk down clear to the bare wood!! That made me very leary of it. However,I have finished gunstocks with it that never gave me any trouble. I just used fewer coats. I recommend Tru Oil for its beautiful depth and advise you to just not use many coats.

[Scott Holmes]

Waterlox is varnish, made from tung oil and phenolic resin. Rockhard is varnish made from phenolic resin and linseed oil.

Waterlox will be a bit better at waterproofing and mosture resistence. Because it's varnish made from tung oil, which is tung oil's only true "claim to fame" it makes a more waterproof varnish than linseed oil or soya oil.

[Jon Middleton]

Thanks, guys. I thought phenolic resin varnishes were quite hard. Also, the water repellent properties of tung oil vs linseed don't really apply once they are made into varnish, do they? Tru Oil is a varnish, I'm pretty sure, it's truly not an oil. Many stockmakers use Pro Custom Oil, which is an oil/varnish blend marketed through Brownell's. There is another product made in Wisconsin, but I forget the name.

[Scott Holmes]

Actually Tru Oil is NOT varnish, per the MSDS it is linseed oil 11%, and a proprietary modified oil 33%, (this part might be varnish) the rest is mineral spirits. If the proprietary modified oil is varnish, then Tru Oil is an oil/varnish blend.

Tung oil is not more waterproof than BLO; it's true claim to fame is when VARNISH is made from Tung oil instead of linseed oil the varnish is more waterproof.

Homer Formby has made millions of dollars and millions of people believe that tung oil is an excellent finish by itself. It is NOT. Formby's "Tung oil Finish" is an alkyd resin/soya oil varnish thinned 80% with mineral spirits. So yeah, it is a great film forming finish that is very waterproof (no finish is completely water or water vapor proof) BECAUSE it's VARNISH. The only "tung oil" is the words printed on the label.

[Howard Acheson]

Thanks, guys. I thought phenolic resin varnishes were quite hard. Also, the water repellent properties of tung oil vs linseed don't really apply once they are made into varnish, do they? Tru Oil is a varnish, I'm pretty sure, it's truly not an oil. Many stockmakers use Pro Custom Oil, which is an oil/varnish blend marketed through Brownell's. There is another product made in Wisconsin, but I forget the name.

In spite of what the Behlan guy said, Both Waterlox Original and Behlen Rockhard are "harder" than other non-poly varnishes and quite a bit harder than almost all poly varnishes. In fact, Waterlox Original was originally called "Gym Floor Finish". Both are made with phenolic resin. The oil used to make Rockhard is linseed oil while Waterlox Original is made with tung oil. Both require 3-4 weeks to fully cure and develop their full protective qualities. The tung oil has somewhat better water and water vapor resistant properties which ARE imparted to the resulting varnish. That's the reason most true marine varnishes are made with tung oil.

Tru-Oil is an oil/varnish mixture made with linseed oil. They are located in Minnesota. I don't know of a finish maker in Wisconsin.

[george wilson]

Unless they changed the formula for Rock Hard since the 70's,I could easily push a fingernail into it months after it was dry. Haven't tried Waterlox. So the Behlen chemist was wrong????? He helped develop Rock Hard.

[Jon Middleton]

Thanks again, guys. I was thinking of Velvit Oil:

http://www.velvitproducts.com/details_velvitoil.html

I think it's an oil/varnish blend, but am not sure. Many stockmakers like the oil/varnish blends, but per Flexner, a pure varnish sounds better for a gunstock. I may experiment with blending the Rockhard and pure tung oil, but will try it on scrap first.

[Howard Acheson]

I'm not saying that the chemist was wrong, but based on may experience Rockhard was harder than alkyd varnishes I also used. The so called "fingernail" test for hardness is not very reliable. The ability to "dent" the finish is mostly dependent on the hardness of the wood underneath. One can easily leave an impression in pine no mater what finish is on the surface.