Why I won't be around here any more.....

[ray hampton]

Paul, may I thank you for standing with us

[paul cottingham]

Hmmm. Sarcasm?

[Larry Frank]

I think that it is unfortunate that some people have to brand a particular group of people ( contractors, engineers, roofers, lawyers, etc) as all being the same. There are some very good and some very worthless in every group.

The one thing that I do know is that people are always trying to get something at the lowest cost and expect the best job. With contractors, you kind of get what you pay for. Good work is not cheap as it takes time and good materials. With any kind of contractor, one needs to shop around and talk with other people who have used the contractor.

I like using contractors which are established in my area for a long time and have a reputation that they want to keep up. I have had a couple of major renovations and additions done in the last ten years and have used the same contractor with the same great results. He is certainly not the cheapest but is the best and makes everything right.

People who hire a contractor without checking on him are playing with fire.

[Mike Archambeau]

Larry I hope you will hang with us. We need a voice of reason from Northern MI. Besides, when I do return home to MI how else will I track you down?

[Ryan Mooney]

Remember Popular Mechanics magazine? People used to actually read that.

It also used to have more stuff worth reading in it Admittedly there is still some useful stuff, but somewhere along the line it became mostly a combination of rather rarefied information and thinly disguised ads (yeah yeah I'm not being totally fair, but its not like it was way back when... I bought the "boy mechanic" series when lee valley had them on reprints - now THAT was good reading - and then I bought a set for my Dad). Nowadays I get Make Magazine instead

[Ed Hazel]

Larry

I understand exactly whee you are coming from. I was an auto adjuster for an insurance company, so I have heard forever how insurance adjuster are out to screw everyone which is far from the truth. Then I ran an auto repair facility for 10 years. I know I was not out to rip off anyone just trying to do a good job. You just can not take it personal. There are those bad apples in every profession. For some reason people are always quicker to complain then they are to praise.

[ray hampton]

Larry

I understand exactly whee you are coming from. I was an auto adjuster for an insurance company, so I have heard forever how insurance adjuster are out to screw everyone which is far from the truth. Then I ran an auto repair facility for 10 years. I know I was not out to rip off anyone just trying to do a good job. You just can not take it personal. There are those bad apples in every profession. For some reason people are always quicker to complain then they are to praise.

this could be because of the con-man approach, praising someone go hand-in-hand with conning them out of something

[David Helm]

Larry; hang in. In terms of Holmes (self described expert) I am a two time loser. Spent 30 years as a contractor and now 7 years as a home inspector. If I took anything he says as real I would become a basket case. Heck, people are constantly hiring home inspectors based on price. That's just as wrong as hiring a builder based on price. Yes there are bad ones in every industry. They are the ones that get the recognition. All of us who really care about what we are doing just go about it quietly.

[David Cramer]

Dan

You are right, I should not be so thin skinned. Everyone has off days, and yesterday was one of mine. Actually yesterday I lost a nice house to one of the contractors that you discribe, great talker with no talent, nice office with pretty pictures but no tools or the knowledge or experiance to use them. So yes I was in a bad mood.

The thing is in the thread in question, both you and the OP are mistaken. There is much more to ventilating a roof that the simple law of thermodynamics that "Heat Rises". You have to create a continous blanket of air that starts by pulling in relitively cool air at the bottom and in as close to a sheet as can be flows to the top picking up heat on its way until it is expelled by whatever means employed. More than one exit creates confusion in the air flow and does indeed cause hot spots. More is not always more.

In this case the second contractor that brought this up was correct. For his efforts to make a system that works he is belittled on the internet by someone that has done no research on the subject other than knowing that hot air rises.

I do enjoy waking up in the morning with my coffee and reading what others are doing, helping when I can, and getting others take on tools that I do not own. I have noticed an absense of pros lately, and I really miss their input as these are the guys I learn from. This is not my hobby, this is how I make a living. I have spent my whole life building beautiful things that will be around long after I am gone, things that I like to think will be restored rather than replaced.

Some contractors do that......

Larry

I thoroughly enjoy your posts Larry and can always tell that you know what you're talking about (very few things beat experience). Honestly, when I see a post from you I always click on it so please don't take that away from me....not to mention that I am from Michigan too I don't live as far up as you but I'm a tad younger and actually avoid the snow whenever possible, which has been an easy thing to do this year. Please, let it go or do what Todd did, take a break.

Thanks,

David (down in the tri-county area)

[Larry Edgerton]

Well of course I had to see how my rant was taken, and I have to say I am surprised and a bit touched by the responses. I really didn't think anyone paid any attention and would not be missed.

I hate all generalizations, be they about race, creed, wealth, or profession, even lawyers. And being as this one was aimed at me.....

I have friends from CEO's to a fellow that rents port-a-johns, good people one and all. I don't see what job you have being directly related to intelligence, some people just choose to not use their god given talents for cash. But nothing I say will ever change anything, so I need to just ignore such things. I'll give it a try.

Thank you to one and all.

Larry

[Pat Barry]

Don't sweat it Larry. Fact is everyone likes to stereotype everyone else.

[Bill ThompsonNM]

Glad to see you are still with us Larry, your posts are one of the set of people I'm sure to read. But stop thinking of yourself as just a contractor, you are truly an artist from what I can tell. Just like everytime I stop to look at the work of a prominent stair builder on this forum, your work always sounds magnificent and inspiring and I'm sorry that you don't work near me since I could have used quality inspired work in recent years. I'm sure your clients appreciate your work and we appreciate your posts. Bill Thompson

[Jeff Nicol]

Larry, I rarely bounce around on the other forums from the Turners, but I do check out the lumber yard, off topic, tools and shops. I was a commercial heating and AC fabricator installer for almost 30 years and have been a builder, welder, artist/designer etc on many projects because it comes with the territory. Doing things with my hands and using my brain to do the job better go together and there will always be the "TALKERS" and the "DOERS". I love to yak but if I have no knowledge of the topic, I zip it and pay attention, but if I see or hear the talker doing their best to convince someone that they are the best of the best.......well most times the fast talkers are not cut from the "DOER" cloth, and I will give the potential "MARK" a look, hint or something to seek other and more input. Some folks are afraid to speak up when an expert is at hand, even when the "Talker" is making the customer nervous, but we all have to be our own watchdogs, but like you and many others we are always looking out for those who are preyed upon by the "TALKERS", I feel obligated to do this as it is the way my Dad, Grandfather and Uncles taught me. Being honest and proud is much easier than being dishonest and manipulating. For when we tell the truth we never have to remember if we told some fib or not, so it is much less stressful!

Laugh at the foolish, smile at the guilible, and help those who ask for it with true needs, all others will just end up bitter and miserable with no friends or business. Actions speak louder than words still holds true today.

Great thread and it does bring out the true thoughts of those who care,

Keep on smiling,

Jeff

[Belinda Barfield]

I'm glad you are staying Larry. I was really going to miss you.

[Brian Elfert]

The guy who built my house in 2001 is an excellent contractor. He did hardly any of the work himself, but he has selected a very good group of subcontractors and suppliers. His attention to detail is great. He mostly built $750,000+ plus homes and my home was the least expensive he had ever built.

A contractor I selected to drywall some unfinished space in my home did a terrible job. He didn't use enough compound on the horizontal joints to bring them level. When he taped the garage he didn't even run his knife over the joints after applying the compound and tape. I could have done a way better job in the garage. This contractor came highly recommended from a co-worker and my co-worker is very picky about work done for him.