Sawstop, Which Version Industrial or Professional

[Steve Kohn]

In the last several months my wife has come aware (not thru me) of three tablesaw accidents. Two of these accidents resulted in amputations of thumbs, and the third resulted in a minor scratch because the Sawstop worked. So last night my wife laid the lumber on me. No more new tools until my perfectly good, well dialed in, and fully tricked out PM66 is replaced by a Sawstop.

I have recently retired from my former full time employment (not wordworking) and now am primarily a hobbiest. I have done some work for pay, but generally find that to be less fun than finding my own projects.

So today I went to the local merchant for aforesaid Sawstop company and learned there are two versions, the Industrial and the Professional. I have been told the Industrial is the original Sawstop design, while the Professional was introduced to compete with the PM2000 and that class of saw. The pricing I got was for the Industrial at $4500 and the Professional was $3500. I am looking at the 3HP version with 52 inch rip fence. These prices are also inclusive of an extra cartridge, an 8 inch dado cartridge, another insert for the dado, delivery fees, and sales tax (8%).

I did notice that the Industrial model has a larger table size than my PM66, while the Professional has a slightly smaller table size. Does this make any difference to anyone? Does anyone have and use the Professional and will they comment on it?

I understand the Industrial is much heavier duty but is this worth $1000? I can afford either saw, but don't wish to spend unnecessarily or alternatively be kicking myself next year for not getting the saw I really needed.

[Mike Heidrick]

$1000 will not add the larger table (3" additional depth), heavier trunnions and bearings, or the overall extra mass and weight of industrial saw to the PCS at a later date.

[David Hawxhurst]

for that kinda of money i would look one of the euro type sliding saw. i think they are a lot nicer and safer then cabinet style saws. just my 2 cents.

[Mike Henderson]

I have the professional and have never found it wanting. I think I paid less than $3K for mine. But whatever I paid, it's worth it. Let's say I paid $1K more than I would have paid for another brand - I look at that $1K as a one time insurance payment that will keep me from damaging my hands. And I don't have to make an insurance payment every year, like I would for life or medical insurance - it's paid up.

Oh, yeah, and it's a very good saw.

Mike

[mreza Salav]

I have the industrial version and very happy with it. I have looked at the PCS version and it is very nice too. I think the bigger table is the only major difference of the two (beefier guts shouldn't matter to a hobby shop). So if you think it's not worth the extra $1000 I'd say go with the PCS version. If you are not a production shop that runs this machine 10 hours a day every day it won't make a difference.

[David Malicky]

We have the Industrial at work and I've found it to be overall an excellent saw, with some minor flaws. On the table size, note that once you add an outfeed table, that 3" difference gets a lot smaller: the PCS and ICS are only 3/4" different from the front of the table to the front of the blade. Behind the blade, it's 2 1/4" of cast iron vs another 2 1/4" of outfeed table. Yes, that 3/4" is still nice.

Sawstop's specs say the main bearings are the same sizes for PCS and ICS.

Note I've found some minor flaws in ours (2010 model): the blade elevation screw "groans" unless it is greased weekly, the power cord at the lower back is just the right height to be squeezed by a push broom, and the clear blade guard didn't ride over boards smoothly (some polishing fixed it). The phenolic blade insert has two flaws when ripping thin stock: it has a large cutout for the blade guard/riving knife that can swallow thin stock, and it tends to tip/flex disturbingly (some JB weld strategically placed at the rear stabilized it). Overall it's still an excellent saw, but for top $ I was expecting closer to perfect. I don't know if the new ICS or PCS are any better on those.

[Tom Hintz]

I have the PCS and while I was very impressed with it right out of the box, that has grown now with experience using it. This is a really well made saw that performs very well in every way I have been able to use it. I have a review with photos and video and maybe some more details at the link below. Incidentally, if you make the T to include the blade guard dust control the PCS is as close to 100-per-cent as I have seen. I still have to dust the top off a little after cutting a bunch of wood but that is about it!

I would easily go for the PCS again if I had to. VERY nice piece and one that will keep on working for a very long time if you can avoid hitting it with Buicks or something.

http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/sawstoprv.html

[johnny means]

I have an ICS in my shop and am really happy with it. I disagree with the previous poster about the throat plate. IMO, it is very well designed and when someone bothers to use all the available adjustments it is rock solid and will stay put for years. Also, when removed and reinstalled it aligns perfectly without any fiddling. The quick lock lever is also a treat.

I like the extra solid feel of the larger ICS, but I can't honestly say that it performs any better than the smaller Unisaws and PMs thst I've worked with.

[Prashun Patel]

I have the PCS. I think it's fine for any hobbyist. I've never found it lacking. 3hp is pretty darn strong.

[Victor Robinson]

Also have the PCS and can vouch for never needing/wanting more. The larger table is attractive, especially if it adds several inches in front of the blade (not sure how many), but if I were doing it over again I'd still pocket the extra grand and spend it on something else, like a bigger bandsaw.

[David Malicky]

I disagree with the previous poster about the throat plate. IMO, it is very well designed and when someone bothers to use all the available adjustments it is rock solid and will stay put for years. Also, when removed and reinstalled it aligns perfectly without any fiddling. The quick lock lever is also a treat.

It wasn't an adjustment issue; that was done, of course. When using a push block or Grr-ripper on a narrow rip like 1/4", the phenolic under the push block flexed downward on ours, which can cause the work to hit the rear of the cast iron opening. Unlike most tablesaw blade inserts, the blade cutout extends all the way to the rear--that is, the left and right halves are not connected except at the front. That does make it convenient to pull the insert out, but it also leaves the inner edge of the right half unsupported, especially at the rear. Ours needed some JBW on the inside of the cast iron to support that rear inner corner. Other than that and the large cutout, it works well, as does the riving knife lock.

[Salem Ganzhorn]

I bought an ICS used. My saw before it was a G0691 which only cost a little more then the difference between the PCS and the ICS new .

As another poster said the elevation wheel starts to grumble if you dont keep the innards waxed. Also although the table is a little larger then my old saw the distance from the front of the table to the blade is inches less!

That is about it for negatives.

One thing that has not been mentioned is the mobile base is excellent. Don't forget to factor that into the price. The fence is pretty nice too. I have a Wixey digital scale on mine and the combo is great.

As for which saw to buy I am cheap and would pocket the 1k difference. But I was happy with my G0691 (except for he throat insert!!).
Good luck!
Salem

[Peter Aeschliman]

I haven't used the ICS, but I have the PCS. It does everything I need it to do. I haven't once thought I needed more power or weight. As a previous poster said, I don't understand the advantage of the larger cast iron table since most of it sits behind the blade. If it was in front of the blade, I would understand since it would allow you to use your miter gauge with wider stock. But once you attach an outfeed table, it's a difference that makes no difference.

Also the larger ICS table makes it harder to find an off the shelf router table extension. I don't know of any cast iron versions that would fit the ICS.

I have no doubt the ICS is a nicer saw, but I don't know that it would be worth another $1k for a hobbiest.

[Mike Heidrick]

Peter, you mean mounting the RT on the right of the ICS or the left?

[Roger Feeley]

I have a Sawstop and agree with you generally but I try to avoid absolute faith in the safety system. I am convinced that somehow, some way, someday the system will fail and there will be a serious accident. That said, I still like my odds. In part, I force myself to remain skeptical so that I don't get careless.