Can new pressure-treated ever look like nice painted wood?

[Philip Berman]

I've been struggling with a material choice to re-build a cedar fence I have. The existing was made of white cedar, solid-stained, periodically washed and re-stained, etc., but it has rotted at ground level. Choice#1 was another Walpole fence, this one made of metal-reinforced Azek. I'm pretty sure it'll last to the end of time, but that was $310 per foot, installed. I have 70feet that needs fencing Ok, so even though I don't want to do it, I'm going to build it myself and get someone else to do the backbreaking labor of installation. My first instinct was to use black locust for the posts, but since they're 6x6 and some of the posts make up a pergola, I need 12' lengths for which the quote I got was a little over $500 per post. Yikes. I should also mention that this constitutes part of a pool enclosure, so I'm trying to build it to code(ish - I may take one small liberty re: swing of gate), must be min. 5' high. Also, the fence is white picket with decorative rails meant to match in style with a Federal-style house. My next thought would be using pressure-treated for the posts, which leads me to my question - can this material be planed/scraped/painted so it doesn't look like pressure treated and/or rustic and/or an eyesore? Periodic maintenance is not now, nor will it be in the future, an issue. Also the only issue I'm at odds over are the posts - the panels will be made of cedar and painted, which will pretty much last for however long I last since they're not in contact with water or ground and I'm almost OCD over maintenance and keeping it white.

So - bite the bullet for black locust or save a bundle and use PT? One other thought was PT boxed with Azek, which is exactly what Walpole Fence provides for posts in their 'all-Azek' fencing. I think that would still be cheaper than locust, building another house to block the entrance to the yard would be cheaper than Walpole!!!!

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences.

Philip

[Mel Fulks]

I've seen pressure treated posts used in top quality historical restorations and I've seen some locust posts come in new and sappy and partly rotted! I would use the best quality ground contact PT. You can remove the machine marks with coarse belt sanding etc. Sand blasting ?

[Philip Berman]

Thanks, Mel. I'm thinking an afternoon with a couple of sawhorses, a #4 1/2 and a #7, and a freshly-charged Ipod would be nice and more healthy - I doubt I'd inhale a shaving of pressure-treated as I would dust from the belt-sander. And I think it would excuse me from the gym that day too! Oh yeah, allowing some imperfection from hand-planing would add a very subtle but nice bit of detail too - every little bit helps when you're trying to make your 1985-built home look like a 1785-built home.

[David Helm]

I'm assuming you're not planning on planing the part of the post that goes into the ground. Since the treatement only goes in about a half inch, if you plane the ground contact part you'll be removing most of the treatment.

[ray hampton]

I'm assuming you're not planning on planing the part of the post that goes into the ground. Since the treatement only goes in about a half inch, if you plane the ground contact part you'll be removing most of the treatment.

when wood get pressure-treated, do it stop water at the surface ? will the humidity penetration reach to the center of the wood after a period of time ?

[Mel Fulks]

Interested in your comment,I know they have made changes in the chemical etc.But it still looks like the stuff goes all the way through. Long time ago we placed a special cut order for clear high quality Doug Fir beams.Heavy nice stuff. WE HAD TO GET IT PRESSURE TREATED! The treatment only penetrated about 5/16 . So far that weird order is the only time I've seen the treatment fail to penetrate,other than the bit of heartwood occasionally found in PT.

[Philip Berman]

David, think the gophers'll mind if I don't square it up? I was just going to plane the surfaces that will be seen, and even then only if they don't have a nice smooth surface. I don't believe I've ever seen a piece of PT that was finished nicely, but then in the past I've gone out of my way not to look at pt at all. I've resisted PT in the past because I want to see a nice, smooth painted surface, not wild grain poking through paint.

[Lee Schierer]

I used pressure treated wood for the wood framing around my garage doors after the original non-treated wood started to rot at the point of ground contact. The trick for painting is that you have to wait for the wood to get dry before you paint. The moisture content of pressure treated wood can be enormous, which will not allow your paint to adhere to the surface. Once the wood has dried and reached a low moisture level you can paint it and expect the paint to adhere at least as long as it would on any other wood exposed to weather. Getting your posts dry might require leaving it unpainted until the driest part of the summer and even then the area close to the ground may still peal from the moisture kept in by the soil.

[John M Wilson]

I used pressure treated wood for the wood framing around my garage doors after the original non-treated wood started to rot at the point of ground contact. The trick for painting is that you have to wait for the wood to get dry before you paint.

I have done this as well for several sections of railing on my front porch. I picked through the pile at the Borg for the drier boards, cut & machined them to match the rest of the porch rail, then installed them with no paint. After a few weeks of summer heat, they appeared dry enough to take a coat of paint. I primed & painted them, and even the ones I have done several years ago still look great.

As Lee said, I think the trick is to let it dry thoroughly. I was lucky enough to have an installation that has no ground contact. If you have the time, you could let it dry out using more conventional methods before machining, assembly, and installation.

Good luck!

[Philip Berman]

Thanks everyone for your input. Seems like PT is the way to go (without spending a fortune). If I can somehow prevent the existing fence from falling over, would drying the posts in the garage over the winter be of significant benefit, and then build/install in the spring?

Thanks again

Philip

[Peter Quinn]

Like Lee said, you can't paint it right away, it arrives soaking wet and will shed whatever you put on it. It takes maybe a year or better, by which time it has been UV damaged, and thus won't hold paint as well. See wherein going with this? Good thing you are OCD about painting it, because you will be repainting it forever.

My favorite solution is white resin post covers. They fit tightly over a 4X4, they come in 9' lengths (which can be cut into 3 pieces to wrap deck posts from the floor up), they are cheaper and easier than azek wraps , they come in a bright white factory finish. They do not rot at ground level. I don't know a brand name but the sell them at my local quality lumber yard. If you need that 6X6 look they won't do it, they are only about 1/4" thick each face plus a little gap to fit around the posts. They can be painted immediately if required or left white.

Ps I've tried drying Pt, it often twists to the point of being useless, but maybe if you stack some weight on it and go slowly, seal the ends etc? Maybe.

[Philip Berman]

Thanks, Peter. I really wanted 8x8 posts, so the compromise at 6x6 is as small as I'm willing to go. I had thought of wrapping the posts in Azek - what do you suppose is going to happen with the moisture that will then be trapped inside the azek barrier? I know that Walpole uses Azek-wrapped PT posts for their top-of-the-line product, perhaps they're running it through a kiln first? Would be costly, but then for what they're charging you'd think these things were gold-plated. As far as painting, I generally use a solid stain for exterior stuff like this - I wonder if, with less solids than paint, I'd be able to stain it sooner knowing that the film left will allow the moisture to escape as the wood comes to equilibrium AND providing protection from the UV that causes the cracking, splintering, all that other stuff that renders it butt-ugly.

Philip

[Peter Quinn]

I wrapped my porch columns (6X6) in Kleer, similar to Azek, really a nice way to go. I left the applied plinths 1/8" off the floor, left a similar gap at the top, added PT lath to each side of the posts running vertical, creates a gap to dry out the posts slowly. 7 years later, still looks like the day it went in. Not sure how to accomplish this air gap with a fence post, maybe at the cap.?. The cost was higher than other options but I only had 4 posts to do. They make thinner polyurathane material in a sheet format, might be more cost effective for making post caps. It glues very easily with low odor PVC cement, easy to fabricate what ever you need. IME PT will always look terrible in the short to mid term and must be covered for a decent look, plus I don't want my kids touching the stuff.

[Mike Wilkins]

Here's what I did for a replacement mailbox that a visitor knocked to the ground with her vehicle. I used pressure treated 4X4 and bandsawed a decorative bracket for the mail box holder. The post was treated with 2 coats of exterior primer; then the part that is buried in the ground was covered with 15# felt to slow contact with the surrounding soil. After it was firmly in the ground, I used a good quality exterior paint for the post. Pressure treater lumber can be painted as long as it is dry. You may have to sticker your building stock inside a closed building for a few weeks with air circulation all around to get to a dry state, but it can be done. Mine has lasted for over 5 years with only an occasional cleaning to get rid of the bird poop.

[Ole Anderson]

A while ago there was a thread about kiln dried PT wood. If you could locate some, the water issue goes away and what you see is what you get as far as twist and warp. As previously stated, make sure it is rated for ground contact. I think most is now, but some is even more seriously pressure treated. Standard ground contact PT used to be 0.4 pounds per cubic foot, while the really good stuff was 0.6 pounds per cubic foot. Way back, non-ground contact was something like 0.24 pounds per cubic foot. Don't know how all that changed when they dropped arsenic from the formula.