BE Maple Finish - How was this done....Anyone???

[Dave Fairfax]

I have some BE that I want to work in with Walnut. I love this finish on the BE. I have taken a test piece and gotten the warm hue with an Amber Shellac, but how is the figure in the wood darkened. If anyone has any insight please chime in.

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[Shawn Pixley]

Dave, your picture is small so I could be mistaken, but that looks like maple burl framed in walnut, not birdseye. Nonetheless, i would use tung oil or BLO and then use shellac to seal with laquer over the top.

[Paul Saffold]

Be ??????????

Thanks Shawn. I should have known that one.

[sheldon pettit]

Mr Pixley is correct if what your looking for is just depth and enhancement of what exist. To bring out more contrast between the dark and light areas of the burl i would also suggest a wash of ferrous sulfate [1/8 oz. per gallon] or any smaller amount reduced as needed. This will darken the already darker areas without darkening the lighter areas hardly at all and will create a more 3D affect than oils by themselves. another offer is to use Canadian balsam instead of linseed which has a higher refractive index and will give more depth to the surface wood than linseed oil, just some thoughts based on actually using such in the past.

SAM / Chemmy

[Shawn Pixley]

Thanks Sheldon -I'll try the ferrous sulfate trick myself.

[sheldon pettit]

Hey Shawn, if you do don't make it so strong that it turns the wood grey, just strong enough to turn the dark areas darker, what i wrote above is a good starting point, it will need to be adjusted to most likely a smaller amount od FS. If you want you can also add small amounts of water dye like yellow or amber ect., and kill tow birds with one stone.................................err......... ..i mean cut a possible 2nd step out all together

[Dave Fairfax]

Thank you very much guys. I could swear up and down that it is burl as well. However, I pulled the picture from the Lumberjocks.com forum and the builder said it was BE. But he could be wrong, because it sure does look like burl. Nevertheless you guys are spot on when it comes to what I am trying to achieve. I have both shellac and 100% tung oil on hand.

Sheldon - I would like to get it just like the picture with a strong warm amber and brown. It almost looks like fire. I love that look. I have a test piece that i used amber shellac on. it started to get that warm amber color but I would like to try a few different approaches. I am very interested in the FS. Could you go into more detail with that and some tips or things to stay away from, like the graying of the wood. Also, would I do that and then hit it will a numerous coats of amber shellac to bring the light parts to the color I am looking for.

Please, anyone else please chime in as well

Again, thank you very much. These forums are great and I appreciate all of the feedback.

[sheldon pettit]

Thank you very much guys. I could swear up and down that it is burl as well. However, I pulled the picture from the Lumberjocks.com forum and the builder said it was BE. But he could be wrong, because it sure does look like burl. Nevertheless you guys are spot on when it comes to what I am trying to achieve. I have both shellac and 100% tung oil on hand.

Sheldon - I would like to get it just like the picture with a strong warm amber and brown. It almost looks like fire. I love that look. I have a test piece that i used amber shellac on. it started to get that warm amber color but I would like to try a few different approaches. I am very interested in the FS. Could you go into more detail with that and some tips or things to stay away from, like the graying of the wood. Also, would I do that and then hit it will a numerous coats of amber shellac to bring the light parts to the color I am looking for.

Please, anyone else please chime in as well

Again, thank you very much. These forums are great and I appreciate all of the feedback.

LOL!!!

Well..... let me put it like this, in almost 50 years of wood finishing, i have never seen Birdseye maple look like what is in your pic. Yet I've seen tons of burl that has looked like this, Hmmmm...... I leave it up to you or others to decide ok?

As to coloration, i would suggest you first make your own amber color dye to your personal liking. I say that only because i have yet to see an amber dye by others that really imitated the amber colors of lacquers/shellacs/or varnishes very well. That includes homesteads transtints or transfast colors, or even major dye makers. With just one oz. of the main 3 primaries [red/blue/and yellow, water dyes, you can make any amber color you desire. It's also good to make almost all colors as well - dark or light. More on this if needed later.

Ferrous sulfate [FS] as stated has the ability to darken the dark parts darker giving a more pronounced look. This is true on all cuts of figured maple, not just burls or Birdseye. On plain sawn maple or other plain cuts, you would not even know it was used, when applied in very diluted amounts, there is nothing for it to react with, so nothing is gained by using it. If used stronger, it will turn all maple a grey color, as well as other light woods, the stronger, the darker. In your case, you do-not want a grey cast so you will have to use only a very small amount, maybe as little as gram or less depending on how much your making up ok? What your looking for is the "sweet spot" where it does what i stated without turning the wood grey, That Said, if the grey is only slight, first seal it in, i have found that a very light grey disappeared to a large degree after sealing it, this is even more true if your adding water dye to it in a one step process, but it's best to find out the SS before doing additional thinning ok?

As to the "amber" shellac, here again, i would try not to use many coats of shellac to get the look, you would be better of using a light amber dye first as suggested to get close and then finish it off with french polishing with a 1/2-1lb cut. To achieve the best look i would also sand the wood to a minimum of 320 grit, personally i go to 600 minimum, but I'm anal retentive

[Dave Fairfax]

PM sent.

Can you give your opinion on this french polishing technique http://woodworking.about.com/od/fini...hPolishing.htm , does it sound like a sound plan based on your experience. also, I am not sure what you mean by the 1/2 - 1lb. cut. I assume I would use a clear shellac for the the french polishing, since the dye will get the amber color. Thanks, i really appreciate the helping hand.

Lastly, when you say seal it up, are you referring to a sanding sealer?

[sheldon pettit]

PM sent.

Can you give your opinion on this french polishing technique http://woodworking.about.com/od/fini...hPolishing.htm , does it sound like a sound plan based on your experience. also, I am not sure what you mean by the 1/2 - 1lb. cut. I assume I would use a clear shellac for the the french polishing, since the dye will get the amber color. Thanks, i really appreciate the helping hand.

Lastly, when you say seal it up, are you referring to a sanding sealer?

The french polishing article will be fine for you to learn how to basically polish, we can discuss museum quality polishing after you have the technique down to a science. I would suggest however that you use light mineral oil [baby oil] for the needed lubrication of the pad and only 1 drop not three. apply the drop to your finger and lightly apply all over the surface of the pad after loading the pad with alcohol and pounding it flat on the palm of your hand. Do this every time you re-charge the pad ok? Also do this on scrap till you get it down pat, not the burl.

Half pound cut refers to how much dry shellac to a gallon of alcohol. It will be necessary to make it from scratch, not already dissolved in a can. 8 oz. of shellac to 1 gal. of denatures alcohol, is a 1/2 lb. cut. 4 oz. to a gallon would be a 1/4 lb. cut etc. Since this is a small project, unless you have other things you want to polish, i would advise you to just make up a pint since you will not need alot and the excess can be used for learning and practicing the technique till you get it down ok? And yes, i would personally use a lighter shellac either platinum or super blonde.

Any time you coat the wood with a clear film forming agent you are sealing it up. it is no longer just bare wood. This is done with the first coat and remaining coats of the shellac in your case.

When you have the techniques down and are ready to polish the actual piece of burl, let me know and we can discuss changes to be made in the over-all polishing process ok?

Sam / Chemmy

[Dave Fairfax]

Chemmy-

I guess know would be a good time to discuss my project. I am in the process of building a dedicated Home Theater. All finish work will be hard wood. Walnut pretty much throughout. Where the Burl comes into play will be the insets on the wainscoting panels running the perimeter of the room. Each inset will be about 14" x 20". I am going to use veneer for this. All Walnut will be solid stock. I just go three 8 x 10" samples of veneer in the mail today. I can get more for testing if needed. I dont know how much good it will do me but I have a ton of oak around the shop to test on if needed.
Thanks for the explanation on the cuts, makes complete sense now.

What would be your suggestion on the mix of FS. And how would you approach the three test sheets. I assume I can practice the polishing on oak, right?

I am online now looking to buy some powdered dyes, FS, and shellac flakes. I am open to anything you want to advise. I sent you my email address in a PM. Thanks.

-Dave

[sheldon pettit]

Hi Dave, you have my reply and i hope it helps you alot ok?

[Dave Fairfax]

Yes, it helps very much. I ordered the dyes, FS, and blonde shellac flakes. I hope I can fire some more questions once I get started. Thank you for your help.

[Dave Fairfax]

Chemmy-

I got the FS in the mail today. I know you mentioned a 1/8 oz per gallon, is the FS mixed with water (I use purified water, right. Or is it denatured Alcohol) I do not need a lot at all for these 3 test sheets of veneer. Also, how do I apply, can I wipe on or does it need to be brushed or sprayed? Thanks again for all of your help.

Dave

[sheldon pettit]

Chemmy-

I got the FS in the mail today. I know you mentioned a 1/8 oz per gallon, is the FS mixed with water (I use purified water, right. Or is it denatured Alcohol) I do not need a lot at all for these 3 test sheets of veneer. Also, how do I apply, can I wipe on or does it need to be brushed or sprayed? Thanks again for all of your help.

Dave

Hey Dave, The FS is dissolved in distilled water ok? The shellac in alcohol denatured. Even though you don't need much to use or practice with you have to keep in mind the actual project and how much it may need also. If the project is only a few square feet or so, then a pint will be plenty, if say 100 sq. ft. or more than a quart or more of the FS will be necessary. The 1/8th oz. is only a guide, it's necessary, like i told Mr Pixley, to experiment to find out how much will give the dark light appearance without turning it gray alright? The shellac will be in good shape for a month so unless it takes you more time to get to it, i would not concern myself with how much you make up. its easy to duplicate and new a new batch as needed.

Fs Is best applied with a brush or if you have spray equipment even better. My personal methods is to have two brushes [decent white china bristle] one to apply it warm with and the other to brush it out. If you budget wont allow then use a good clean lint free cotton rag to apply or sea sponge and keep working it into the wood for a few minutes and then wipe off all the excess ok? Let dry overnight, and lightly sand 600 grit or finer to knock any fuzz down and apply the french polish

By the way FS will keep for long periods of time so don't worry about it loosing it's strength to any degree, if you only purchased an oz. i would personally just make up a saturated solution and use that to add small amounts to the D water till you get the desired affect wanted ok?