My second-to-last workbench - top DF vs. poplar

[Victor Robinson]

My first workbench has served me well but I have outgrown it. It is a 60" x 36" salvaged Ikea butcherblock (Beech) top on a 2x4-constructed base, with a tool cabinet underneath. However, it is time to upgrade. The main problems with the existing bench are:

1) The top isn't thick enough (~1-1/8") for hand tool work. It bounces too much and doesn't feel solid. Forget about chopping on it.
2) The top isn't and doesn't stay flat, making it useless as a reference or assembly surface. Though I've handplaned it flat several times, it goes out again within a month or so.

I've been reading bench books, drooling over bench hardware, planning a "real" workbench build for a while now. But I also came to the realization that building "the final" heirloom $$$ bench isn't in the cards right now for a number of reasons. Financially difficult, but perhaps even more importantly, a few space constraints that would require design compromises I'm not willing to make on my "final" bench. For example, my workbench is also my tablesaw's outfeed, and that's not changing while I'm in this space. And while we'll be here for a few more years at least, there's a good chance we'll be in a different home in 5-10 years. One with a larger shop space and where I'll feel more at ease about designing and undertaking building the bench I've been dreaming about.

This means that for my "second-to-last" workbench, I'm going to try to keep costs to a minimum while still getting a workbench "build" experience. The design will be a standard modern classic - front and twin end vises, probably 60" x 30" x 3.5-4" top, recycling the tool cabinet for underneath. But the priorities this time are a dead-flat, thick wood top, and making it look a bit nicer than the one I have (e.g. dovetailed end caps). I'll re-do the base simply because it's ugly (I didn't have any milling equipment when I made it).

All this brings me to my choice for top material: Doug Fir vs. poplar. I've read several threads about using DF for workbench tops via careful selection of material, either 4x4 or 2x12. Alternatively, I can get properly milled FAS 8/4 poplar at around $2.30/bdft (in contrast other acceptable woods such as soft maple would be around $4/bdft and probably push my wood costs further than I'm willing for "2nd-to-last" bench). Both woods are a little softer than ideal, getting easily dented/scratched, but I like the way poplar machines and works a little better. The greenish hue isn't my favorite for looks. The DF would be cheaper probably, but board selection would be time-consuming, lots of waste, and it may be hard to get perfectly dry material, resulting in continuous movement over time. Regardless of which wood I'd use for the bulk of the top, I'd use something harder for end caps, and edges.

Thoughts?

[John Fleming]

The "not so big bench" I've seen in Fine Woodworking mag. They are doing a video series about the build on their website.

[Victor Robinson]

Heya John - I've been watching Ed's videos. He's putting together a nice little bench. Actually his construction methods for the base and drawer cabinet are based exactly on an earlier FWW article/plan for the Essential Workbench (Lon Schleining), but with a smaller top and lacking the twin screw vise. That's exactly the design I'm going for (The Essential, not the smaller version), but just wondering if I can get away with using a softer, cheaper wood for the top, and whether poplar or Doug fir would be better.

[Richard Coers]

I suspect you can get better douglas fir in your locale than I can. Around here, it's over 19% moisture and still moves around for a while. I would never use 4x4's because they will be more likely to be wet in the middle, and check/move around as drying. I made my top from #2 common 4/4 stock (walnut actually), 2 1/2" thick. Ripping the strips oversize, and then rotating them up for lamination. I didn't have that much stock to laminate since I put a tool tray in the back, and different laminations in the front for bench dogs and end vise. My rim around the bench is from 8/4 red oak, 3 1/2" thick. Made the bench in 1985, and it's served me very well. The only change I would make is that I made doors for the base storeage. Wished I would have put in drawers. Still time to do that I guess, retirement starts next year.

[Victor Robinson]

I suspect you can get better douglas fir in your locale than I can. Around here, it's over 19% moisture and still moves around for a while. I would never use 4x4's because they will be more likely to be wet in the middle, and check/move around as drying. I made my top from #2 common 4/4 stock (walnut actually), 2 1/2" thick. Ripping the strips oversize, and then rotating them up for lamination. I didn't have that much stock to laminate since I put a tool tray in the back, and different laminations in the front for bench dogs and end vise. My rim around the bench is from 8/4 red oak, 3 1/2" thick. Made the bench in 1985, and it's served me very well. The only change I would make is that I made doors for the base storeage. Wished I would have put in drawers. Still time to do that I guess, retirement starts next year.

Thanks, Richard. So I guess I should be looking for a somewhat dry supply of 2x12s. I've not seen kiln-dried anything bigger than 2x4s at the big box stores. I suppose if I find relatively clear, tight grained green boards I should bring them home and let them dry for a few months? The FAS poplar starts looking pretty tempting at a certain point. Any thoughts on DF vs. poplar?

So we'll see which happens first - you get your drawers or I get my "second-to-last" bench done.

[David Kumm]

Dry is better here. The stiffness of DF isn't too important on a short bench and both are softer than what you will be setting on it. It might take longer than a few months to dry 19% framing lumber down to 10-12% which is high as I would go. Dave

[Victor Robinson]

Dry is better here. The stiffness of DF isn't too important on a short bench and both are softer than what you will be setting on it. It might take longer than a few months to dry 19% framing lumber down to 10-12% which is high as I would go. Dave

Good info. I'd be ready to build in late spring/early summer, if not sooner. Definitely don't want to wait much longer than that.

So what's the downside to poplar then? Just the lightness? I'm going for a top that's ~3.5" thick all the way through so perhaps that would compensate for poplar's lower weight. Seems like the construction lumber isn't going to be THAT much cheaper when the waste is factored in.

[David Kumm]

If you are suing stretchers the only downside might be the dog holes loosening up but that is pretty nit picky. If you are anal about that you could use a harder wood in that area. 3.5" isn't likely to cause splitting if you pick the wood correctly for the alternate species. Dave

[Chris Fite]

I built my previous workbench out of Douglas Fir, 2x4. I picked the ones I wanted and laminated them with through all-thread. The damage that occurred to the top was never a problem for me. Once planed flat, it stayed that way.

I kept it waxed so that spills did not accumulate. It was sturdy for whatever pounding, clamping, or other abuse came its way.

Unfortunately, we had to make a low-budget move; and I gave it to a new woodworker. I could not justify the expense of moving and storing it.

I was satisfied with the Douglas Fir. I have another workbench on the horizon, so local wood will be a focus of interest along with the Jack-Bench adjustable bench idea.

[Jeff Duncan]

I'm not a fan of either of those woods for a bench top as they are relatively soft. Maybe soft maple could be a good substitute, pretty hard and fairly inexpensive.....in my area anyway. If you call around sometimes you can even find deals on shorts or stuff that's just not very pretty to look at. Construction lumber is very wet and I wouldn't want that either. Wood moves when it dries so you may end up with some headaches when that lumber slowly dries out!

Alternatively if your on a really tight budget but have time and a planer there is another option. How about collecting old pallets for free and tearing them apart? They're generally made out of hardwoods like maple or oak. You could plane both faces and glue the pieces up face to face bowling alley style. It would be a good amount of effort and wouldn't look very pretty.....but may not be all that crazy

good luck,
JeffD

[Victor Robinson]

Thanks Jeff. Yeah, I know...not ideal woods at all, but as I mentioned, this isn't the dream bench so I won't be shelling out $4+/bdft for soft maple, beech, ash, etc. Definitely on the next one, but not this one. That's why the budget is tightened - I need something better than my current benchtop but not ready for the big plunge just yet. Unfortunately I'd be looking at a step down in terms of softness of wood (currently beech), but the thickness and flatness of the bench will be so much nicer.

Ok, now this pallet thing, Jeff. I don't know where all you guys live (well, I do know...in all the places where wood is cheap and plenty!!), but in my neck of the woods, I have never ever ever seen a pallet made out of any decent wood. It's always bandsawn 2x4s or pine. I've received probably ~15 pallets over the last several years from various vendors and never, ever, ever was there a hardwood involved. Am I just unlucky?

I'm not a fan of either of those woods for a bench top as they are relatively soft. Maybe soft maple could be a good substitute, pretty hard and fairly inexpensive.....in my area anyway. If you call around sometimes you can even find deals on shorts or stuff that's just not very pretty to look at. Construction lumber is very wet and I wouldn't want that either. Wood moves when it dries so you may end up with some headaches when that lumber slowly dries out!

Alternatively if your on a really tight budget but have time and a planer there is another option. How about collecting old pallets for free and tearing them apart? They're generally made out of hardwoods like maple or oak. You could plane both faces and glue the pieces up face to face bowling alley style. It would be a good amount of effort and wouldn't look very pretty.....but may not be all that crazy

good luck,
JeffD

[Chris Padilla]

Build your top with "2x4s" and make the actual top replaceable...like a piece of hardboard or melamine or MDF...perhaps with formica laminated.

[Kurt Cady]

Borg lumber, even when wasting the center 3" of a 2x12 is well under a $1/bf. Can't beat it. In ATL we have SYP. Look for "premium" label. The stamp on the lumber will likey have "KD" which mean kiln dried. Could be 19% but likely will be less

[jim gossage]

How about ash? It is fairly hard, straight grained, and can be had for $2-3/ bf.

[Paul Saffold]

Victor,
Just a few comments. Poplar may be green when you mill it, but as it ages it will turn a nondescript brown. I'd rather have a bench get dented than whatever project I'm working on getting dented. So softish wood is OK with me. I bought DF 4x4 at the borgs. I have 5 within a 20 mile radius and would check each as I was in their area. It worked out all right but I wish I had been a little more selective. I didn't have a moisture meter at the time so I weighed each 4x4 when I brought it home then again every week or so. Some of them were actually pretty dry when I bought them. But then I bought them in late December. They had probably been in the stores for awhile. A store with faster turnover means fresher, and therefore wetter stock. All of my stock had reached a steady weight by 10 weeks in my semi-heated basement (50-60 deg in winter). You need to decide what you want in a workbench, not what someone else says you should have. There have been quite a few absolutely beautiful workbenches built by members here. On the other hand, perfectly functional benches can be made without the beautiful woods and meticulous joinery. Whatever you build, have fun doing it and post a few pictures. We all like the pictures.
Paul