Using Pocket Holes

[John Adank]

I like to use pocket holes in some of my wood working but one thing that always frustrates me is how you can torque your alignment out of square when tightening your pocket screws. Case in point, I was was butt joining some drawers the other night with my Kreg jig and no matter what I tried the drawer parts would misalign or not be flush from the canting of the pocket hole screws. I used two of the vise grip style clamps but it still misaligned the drawer. I finally just switched over to butt joining the drawers with my Dowelmax. Not as quick but so much better alignment. I'm assuming this canting or torquing issue is just a drawback of using pocket holes.

[Lee Schierer]

I've not had this problem. Make sure your depth of cut is set right for your wood thickness. The tip of the screw should exit the board with the angled hole exactly in the center of the end. You also need to have the ends cut perfectly square, any angle will result in angle joints.

[Chris Padilla]

The key to pocket holes to make sure the mating pieces are secure when drilling the pockets. If not well secured, they can slip/creep slightly and give you the misalignment you are fighting and, yeah, no amount of clamping will fix the misdrilled joint.

[Dave Novak]

I use pocket screws a lot. Never when visible, but very frequently when they're hidden. I used to have the same problem until I realized how important Lee's suggestions above are as well as how to properly clamp/support the joint while tightening the screws.

[Peter Quinn]

For things like drawer boxes you can pop a few 18 ga brads to keep things in line too, or staples even. They are blind ultimately, the screws provide the holding power. I've also learned not to rely on the kreg clamps 100% and will often use traditional clamping methods to hold an assembly together before screwing it together. Clamps tend not to budge. For face frames the clamps work well enough, better still I've found is to make a right angle assembly jig like the one in the kreg literature using the clamp with the flush mounting plate. When assembling cabinet carcasses I definetly rely on k bodies more than the kreg right angle clamps, the vice grip type things just don't spread the holding force over a wide enough area to be affective. And once the screw is in the wrong place, fixing it is difficult for sure. So you are not alone on that learning curve , it is surmountable though.

[Bas Pluim]

Are you using an impact driver? I had the same issues with the pieces getting out of alignment, despite clamping the sap out of the wood. I then switched to using a regular drill/ driver, at a lower gear/ speed. This allows the screw to "drill" into the mating piece. That solved the problem for me.

[John Adank]

I'm using a regular drill driver. I will check the depth but I'm pretty sure I have it set to 3/4" thickness. I'm screwing together 3/4" plywood. Lee, can you expand on the screw placement comment? I don't understand how the screw should exit the board with the angled hole exactly in the center of the end. The board ends are square. I love cutting the ends on my new Festool Kapex miter saw.
thanks,
john

[Stephen Cherry]

I'm using a regular drill driver. I will check the depth but I'm pretty sure I have it set to 3/4" thickness. I'm screwing together 3/4" plywood. Lee, can you expand on the screw placement comment? I don't understand how the screw should exit the board with the angled hole exactly in the center of the end. The board ends are square. I love cutting the ends on my new Festool Kapex miter saw.
thanks,
john

I'll chime in with the setup, if that's OK. Basically, the kreg jig has three settings.

The first is related to the thickness of the board that is drilled. Basicaly, the little stops on the side of the jig are set to match this thickness, so that the drill bit center comes out of at the center.

The second and third settings are related to the thickness of the other board (the one not drilled). The idea is to set the collar on the side of the bit for good penetration into the other board, while maintaining a pocket that is not too deep. As the pocket gets too deep, a longer screw can be used.

Not very complex- the kreg website has a chart, and 1 1/4 works great for 3/4 stock.

[Phil Thien]

You really have to clamp the snot out of the two pieces when running the screw in. I'm not sure how much pressure those Kreg clamps apply, but I just use one or two bar clamps and don't have any problems with parts shifting.

[Paul Steiner]

+1 for clamping the snot out of things. I think I have at least one of every kreg clamp they make and use them all depending on the item. Especially when alignment is key I find myself using scrap wood for spacers and clamps to hold things. Which is ironic because if you have ever seen the Kreg infomericial on late night or early morning TV it says the Kreg screws eliminate the need for clamps. For face frames I high recommend using a bench mount or bench plate. Currently my favorite way to build case work with pocket holes is to make a shallow dado/rabbet (1/8, 1/4) and use micro pocket holes, this almost eliminates the need for the kreg clamps.

[Danny Thompson]

The point of the clamping discussion is this. The screw is exiting the end and penetrating the cross-piece at an angle. So, if a tiny gap is created during the drilling process (e.g., the screw is allowed to push the cross-piece before it penetrates) then the screw entry hole will be a little too far outboard (to the side away from pocket hole). Then, when the screw snugs up, the crosspiece will be drawn inboard as the exit hole and the entry hole mate up. This is not an issue when a screw is drilled into a normal countersunk hole, because the entry hole in the cross-piece is aligned with the screw.

Said a different way, a pocket hole screw pulls the cross-piece in 2 dimensions, while a normal screw pulls the target board in only one. Therefore, pocket screws have a greater potential for skew. To prevent this, make sure the target board stays snug to the board with the pocket holes, and drill slowly so the screw immediately bites into the target.

[Phil Erup]

I haven't experienced the problem, but I saw a custom cabinet build under construction a few months ago where the cabinet maker had made very shallow dado's to ensure that the box sides did not shift during assembly. This was a $75k remodel.

[Sam Murdoch]

Yes to good clamping. I use pocket screws mostly to assemble face frames and I tolerate no shifting. The Kreg quick clamps are just a start - I add whatever clamp(s) I can to hold my pieces tight to each other and/or to my work table. This no matter what I am using to drive the screws and wether coarse or fine thread. I do agree with Danny T that a slow start speed as you begin to drive the screw is very helpful. Otherwise - I love the pocket screws

[Todd Brewer]

I've not had this problem. Make sure your depth of cut is set right for your wood thickness. The tip of the screw should exit the board with the angled hole exactly in the center of the end. You also need to have the ends cut perfectly square, any angle will result in angle joints.

I bought my first Kreg jig about two weeks ago, Kreg Toolbox Master. I made a test joint with a 3/4" piece of poplar into a 3/4 inch piece of plywood. Jig set to 3/4", drill bit set to 3/4" at the shoulder. Screwed it together with 1 1/4" screw. Then tried to break it. It was pretty tough but did break (only one screw). Looking at the end of the poplar the screw was not exiting out the center of the wood, it was approximately 2/3rd of the way across, meaning it was entering the plywood near the outside edge. I ended up using 5/8" setting on the jig and setting the bit to 5/8" at the shoulder. The screw now exits out the center of the wood. I talked to the salesman about this but he admitted to never taking a joint apart to inspect the screw. Can't imagine I have a defective jig, they are pretty simple devices. Anyone else seen this?

Downside to using 5/8" setting on 3/4 material; the pre-made wood fillers are too long, unless they are meant to be.

And I agree, maintaining alignment is challenging!

[Charles McKinley]

The premade fillers are made to be trimmed to fit.