RAS Push Cutting Myth

[John McClanahan]

Here's what happens when you use a radial arm saw all wrong. I won't argue advantages of a negative hook blade. When the subject of pull cutting vs push cutting, all kinds of warnings pop up to only cut on the pull, never push the blade into the board. Well, I have owned my RAS for 30+ years and push cut with it. A lot of folks here think I have some sort of death wish for even thinking of push cutting.

So, I set up this recently tuned-up 1961 DeWalt Power shop radial arm saw with an old 10" combination table saw blade with positive hook teeth. I am right handed, and normally control the saw with my right hand, but to keep the view clear I am using my left hand.

Hold my beer and watch this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12XQR9DxhHc


I can't figure out haw to embed the video, sorry.

John

[david brum]

Dang, I can't get youtube to play it. Is the video working for others?

[Cary Falk]

Worked for me. It's easier for me to line up the cut on the pull. That's just the way I was raised.

[Ryan Baker]

Works for me.

I don't have any problem with the push cut. It's having an aggressive positive hook blade on it that can make things get scary (whether pushing or pulling). Backing off the hook angle makes a huge difference.

I'm not sure who was complaining about push cuts. Seems like the last thread I read about the subject had people pretty much split in half about push vs pull, and many who do both at times. Seems like a good way to get more tearout on the top of the board, and it probably wouldn't be a good choice in really thick material (don't want the blade pulling up more than it is pushing against the fence). Push cutting is more controllable with a positive hook blade beacause it won't climb cut and bite in too hard. People have been doing it for a long time. If it works for you, more power to you.

[Matt Day]

I'm glad to see this post. I've always been told and read on forums that you always pull cut with a RAS. The handful of times I push cut with it I felt like I was doing something bad and someone might be watching.

And I've always felt that, even with a negative hook blade, that the saw wants to come straight back at me during the pull cut. So when I'm cutting thick stock or something like maple, I'm pulling back but I have to tense up and be ready to push back on the saw to control it. If that makes any sense...

Should a negative hook blade or positive hook blade be used when push cutting?

[Ryan Baker]

Matt, that makes perfect sense (to anyone who has used a RAS). The negative hook blade will reduce the tendency of the blade to "climb" and race out toward you. I think you would be better off with a negative hook any time you can on a RAS, but it matters more when pulling than when pushing.

[Bill ThompsonNM]

When I was in my teens I tried cross cutting a thin piece plywood with my Dad's RAS with a push cut. It flipped up as the front end lifted broke the plywood with a loud bang sending chards all over. Not as exciting as my Dad ripping and sending a 3 foot piece through the garage door but too exciting for me. I've pulled through my cuts without incident since.

[Joe Angrisani]

.....It flipped up as the front end lifted broke the plywood with a loud bang sending charades all over.....

I love playing RAS charades. But I always have trouble when I get "negative hook". How would you guys act out that one? "Hook" is pretty easy, but I have trouble getting people to understand that I mean "negative" and not "opposite" or "reverse".

[Rich Riddle]

Personally I liked the way he kept slamming the blade into the saw so hard that it made the entire saw jump up and backwards. We don't need no stinking safe or best practices. I need folks like that. My wife needs customers in the operating room. She needs to pay off that new Volvo.

[johnny means]

What's the RAS push cut myth?

[Rich Riddle]

What's the RAS push cut myth?

It's unsafe to cut wood with the push stroke with a radial arm saw instead of cutting the wood on the pull stroke. You have to insert the wood after you have pulled the blade toward you (even if the saw isn't running).

[Jeff Duncan]

I have to admit I'm puzzled by the myth....what would be the difference push cutting with a RAS vs push cutting (normal operation) with a sliding chop saw?

Now practicality wise is a different story. Push cutting with a RAS is not really all that practical or ergonomic. Not to mention you lose a good deal of capacity trying to push cut. Other than that I don't see the problem?

JeffD

[Rich Riddle]

I have to admit I'm puzzled by the myth....what would be the difference push cutting with a RAS vs push cutting (normal operation) with a sliding chop saw?

Now practicality wise is a different story. Push cutting with a RAS is not really all that practical or ergonomic. Not to mention you lose a good deal of capacity trying to push cut. Other than that I don't see the problem?

JeffD

An old debate here at SMC. Here are some of the other viewpoints:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...radial-arm-saw

Regardless of what stroke one chooses, slamming the saw to the point of moving it isn't a safe idea.

[Lee Schierer]

I don't think I would try that with thicker stock........the thicker the stock, the more the blade will tend to lift.

[eugene thomas]

In my shop i use tools however i want, but making video showing cut. Really......