Question for the younger generation

[Adam Cruea]

During my vacation up here in Maine, my wife let me go to Lie-Nielsen Toolworks. I originally was going for a shooting plane, but since it is our anniversary, the spending limit set by the wife was fairly high (several thousand).

Anyway, as I walked in the showroom, basically we were ignored. I had the wife in tow and was explaining what things were used for, trying to pass time until the kid helping the older guy approached. He never did, but instead elected to help another group of older guy that came in after. My wife was a tad bit pissed, and the manager-type lady didn't really want to listen to her (I finally had gotten help after milling about for 30 to 40 minutes).

All said and done, I got a shooting plane and their American Hardwood sample book when I had planned to drop much more.

Now, the question for the younger guys. . .does this happen a lot to you all also? I have noticed when i walk into "serious" woodworking shops, people tend to ignore me. I am just curious if I'm alone in this, or if it is just cruddy luck.

PS: Pardon the crappy typing. I am on my phone and it sucks for stuff like this.

[Tony Wilkins]

I'm not in the younger generation anymore (42) but I remember having that problem a lot in buying suits and buying automobiles (which I've almost always paid cash for). Sorry for you experience and hopefully LN hears they lost money on the deal loud and clear.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

My experience at a LN show was that it was hard to get assisted, but mostly because a lot of other people were heck of pushy. The person at the entrance was very nice and friendly and even the guy being beset on by a bunch of folks did take the time to step aside and discuss things with me under the guise of "taking a break".

But I really think there was only 2 employees there when I was there, so no idea how large a sample set that is.

I've definitely seen the snub from a variety of retailers in a variety of interesting ways. That said, seeing how my wife gets treated in various establishments - I don't complain.

[Chris Griggs]

I can't say that I've had that issue. But that might just be because when I walk into a tool showroom, the kid with ADD inside me rears its head and starts asking all kinds of questions about everything. Last year, at the LN show at Hearne (the 1st one I'd ever gone too) I literally spent like 4 hours at the LN booth pestering Deneb. I got the feeling he was getting a little sick of me but he didn't actively show it. He very graciously answered my questions and demoed a bunch of stuff for me...and the only thing I bought was a $5 sandflex block.

I think the LN folks try to leave you alone if you look like you know what you want. They tend to approach the folks who walk around and polk at the planes like they might bite them and the folks who ask them questions.

Thinking about it more, I guess not all of the employees actively engaged me as much as Deneb, and I've seen some seem a bit disinterested from time to time, but I can't say I ever felt snubbed or anything. I'm also the kind of person who doesn't like being approached by sales people, but that said, when I do need help and can't get it its pretty frustrating....Again though, I can't say I've had that problem with a woodworking retailer.

Which shooting plane did you get No. 9 or 51 or LA jack or ??????

[Chuck Nickerson]

In my twenties (lo' those 30 years ago) I wanted a BMW 635csi.

I spent a fair amount of time being ignored at three dealers before finding a fourth who took me seriously.
I hope he bought something fun with the commission.

[bob blakeborough]

I have had this problem buying a vehicle, but never with woodworking. I had an Infiniti QX56 and when the new model came out I went to the international auto show to check it out and see if I wanted to upgrade. Well buddy working the Infiniti booth wouldn't give me the time of day. I spent 10 minutes or so checking the vehicle out thoroughly, climbing in and out of the front and back seats, checking the cargo area, under the hood, investigating the features etc...

Finally I figured I would just go walk up to him and ask some questions and just before I opened my mount, he literally pushed me aside and went up to an older couple who JUST arrived in the booth and asked them if they were interested in the QX56 and if he could help them! I was a bit shocked but at the same time, not overly surprised as they looked the part compared to me. I simply walked up and politely said "Excuse me sir... I have been waiting 10 minutes to talk to you about trading in my current QX56 in on this newer model, but unfortunately I am very disappointed with the service so I am going to go and give my $80,000 to someone else" and walked away...

In the end I went back to a much less expensive car from the big SUV and am very happy with my decision, so maybe it was a blessing in disguise, but it still does not excuse his elitist attitude. You never know who you are dealing with, no matter how expensive the suit or cheap the hoodie, and the best course of action is to always treat everyone you meet with the same high level of respect...

[mike holden]

I may be the contrary one here. I DO NOT LIKE pushy salespeople. I prefer to browse in peace. I will go to the counter when I am ready and either ask questions or help. But leave me alone until I approach YOU!

And having been on the other side of the counter, it is hard to tell when someone wants help or wants to be left alone. Judge them by how they treat you when contact is made.

Mike

[Curt Putnam]

In one sense, I'd guess probabilities are at work here. The sales folks did an instant "profile" on you. Are terrorists the blond kids from Denmark or the scruffy bearded types from the Middle East? Doesn't excuse things and I'll bet that there will shortly be some serious meetings for the sales staff at the LN store. My son works trade shows a lot. Anybody who walks in the booth is actively engaged - he claims he can tell a serious interest from lookie-loos in the 1st few sentences. I'm equally sure he can and that he makes the occasional mistake.

Now a question for you. Understanding that it is your money and you can react however you wish, does it not seem that you blew a great opportunity to grab the stuff you wanted by not being a little more assertive?

[Paul McGaha]

I feel kind of bad for you Adam. I've never once been to LN so it would have been really significant for me to get to go. Sorry they didn't treat you better. It probably comes down to the quality of the salespeople that happened to be at work when you got there. Everything I've seen about LN is they are very customer service oriented. I find that I get treated ok at woodworking places. At our local Woodcraft (Leesburg, VA) for example the staff is really good. I'm 55 by the way.

[Chris Hachet]

I am an electrician by trade, I know a fellow electrician who is African American and works for a company that works for utilities after a major storm or power outage. He was working down near New Orleans after Katrina...walked into a Dodge dealership where he was pretty much ignored. Finally an old black man came out and waited on him. His first words were "I'm going to be down here for nine months working on Utility work, and my company needs twelve new Dodge Ram trucks, I need the one ton variety, don't care about colors or options. I just need them today and I am paying cash." Would have loved to see the looks on the faces of the guys who lost their commission because they didn't want to wait on someone based on skin color.

[Adam Cruea]

I can't say that I've had that issue. But that might just be because when I walk into a tool showroom, the kid with ADD inside me rears its head and starts asking all kinds of questions about everything. Last year, at the LN show at Hearne (the 1st one I'd ever gone too) I literally spent like 4 hours at the LN booth pestering Deneb. I got the feeling he was getting a little sick of me but he didn't actively show it. He very graciously answered my questions and demoed a bunch of stuff for me...and the only thing I bought was a $5 sandflex block.

I think the LN folks try to leave you alone if you look like you know what you want. They tend to approach the folks who walk around and polk at the planes like they might bite them and the folks who ask them questions.

Thinking about it more, I guess not all of the employees actively engaged me as much as Deneb, and I've seen some seem a bit disinterested from time to time, but I can't say I ever felt snubbed or anything. I'm also the kind of person who doesn't like being approached by sales people, but that said, when I do need help and can't get it its pretty frustrating....Again though, I can't say I've had that problem with a woodworking retailer.

Which shooting plane did you get No. 9 or 51 or LA jack or ??????

No. 51. The thing is a beast, and when I used the one in the showroom, it made some nice curls from maple endgrain.

I was hoping to pick up a rip panel saw and some other "want" toys like a LA jointer, but oh well. I will start bugging Mark from BadAxe for a panel saw, and LV carries LA jointers.

[Ryan Baker]

I'm with Mike on this one. I really hate being accosted by pushy salespeople as soon as I walk into a store. Most of the time, I know more about what I want than the person behind the counter, and I will ask for assistance when I am ready for it. Probably most of the people going through the LN showroom are there more to browse than to buy anyway. Not to mention that you vlearly knew what you were looking at, as you were pointing it all out to your wife. The kid may have figured you didn't need any help. We don't know what was going on.

But if you wanted help and didn't get it, why didn't you ask for help? Getting upset and not buying what you wanted doesn't make any sense.

[Adam Cruea]

To answer a few questions: I used to be in retail. You can gauge people quickly by how they carry themselves and observations. I didn't even get a simple "hello", which is what pisses my wife off and annoyed me.

When I finally approached the bench, the kid seemed highly disinterested, which was pretty annoying.

[David Weaver]

No. 51. The thing is a beast, and when I used the one in the showroom, it made some nice curls from maple endgrain.

I was hoping to pick up a rip panel saw and some other "want" toys like a LA jointer, but oh well. I will start bugging Mark from BadAxe for a panel saw, and LV carries LA jointers.

Personally, I think you did well not to get either of those. Can't speak for the 51, I'm sure it's a nice plane.

The same level of performance as the rip panel saw is available all over the internet in the form of an old saw that needs to be filed. If you haven't filed saws, there's little easier to do than small rip teeth on a 22-24 inch saw. A small rip panel saw is something that always screams to me as wanting more length, anyway, unless what's being ripped is in a vise and extremely small.

Also, personally, I think you would find as you go along, you will prefer a bevel down jointer to the bevel up.

Nobody has ever ignored me in a woodworking store because there really aren't any here except rockler, and the folks at rockler here are friendly and attentive as can be for the most part.....I don't get much there, though. There's not a lot there for a hand tooler.

The seemingly inconsistent treatment at the store might be more of a maine thing than a LN thing. Wife and I went through there a couple of years ago (except not the LN factory) and people are just different there than here. I'd think in a lot of cases, the last thing they want to do is seem salesy.

[David Weaver]

You weren't wearing any NY Yankees stuff, were you? Probably not, because they probably would've lit your shoes on fire instead of selling you anything.