Beads on bowls

[Wells Jacobson]

Good evening,
I always look with interest and some awe at posted pictures of bowls with a few nice symmetrical beads close to the rim. I still am happy to manage a reasonably nice simple bowl that completes at close to the size I initially plan. Seems so often my attempts to cut down on my sanding by fixing the last little ridge or bit of tear out results in a catch and thus a smaller bowl. At any rate, whenever I try to make a few beads near the rim I catch or get horrible looking beads and always a smaller bowl. It's hard to keep practicing and ending up with bowls the size of shot glasses.
So I was wondering if most of you talented folk use special beading tools or are just really good at using a gouge (which gouge). Thanks.
Wells

[Jeffrey J Smith]

Wells - I hear ya - I try to get the rim settled in to what it's going to be immediately after the outside of the form has been finished - well before hollowing begins in earnest to keep as much mass as possible in the piece. If the inside has moved in drying, I'll take a cut just to get everything round for the top third of the bowl. Then, if I want beads, I'll grab either a D-way beading tool or the tear drop tool to turn whatever beads or grooves i want. Almost impossible to get a catch from either one if you use it the way they were designed. Dave's got videos for both on his website - www.d-waytools.com

[John Keeton]

A huge Plus One on the D-Way beading tools and diamond tool! For larger beads, I use a spindle detail gouge, but as Jeffrey said, it is better to complete the beaded area prior to hollowing the bowl - goes much easier.

One tip - keep a spray bottle with some water and detergent mix in it to spray the wood when forming the beads - helps with any tear out tendencies.

[John Thorson]

I lay out the bead with a point tool and then cut it with a detail gouge. Take the 'back bevel' off the detail gouge as you would on a bowl gouge to keep it from marking the wood. To avoid a catch you have to keep the flute very closed and take light cuts with a very sharp tool. Richard Raffan shows detail gouge bead cutting on bowls in his Woodturning DVD (right title?). I don't know anyone who can do his 'dip the handle' technique to cut the bead but the tool and edge presentation is the same for cutting a bead the standard way for us less talented folks.

[Bob Bergstrom]

I use a pointed 3/8" spindle gouge to turn all my beaded bowls. Here are a few simple rules I follow.
1. The point of the gouge needs to be at center height when starting the cut. Above center and it will skate toward the outer rim. Too low it wants to jump back to the inside of the bowl.
2. When the point begins to penetrate the wood, be patient with a light touch, and allow the point to establish a ledge to support the bevel. Realize that the bevel is wedging the tool toward the flute side of the tool. When the cuts are right and left with the flute toward the bead a narrow bead may result because the bevel pushes the flute toward the bead. I will make two penetrating cuts like this to establish the width of the bead.
3. If I am cutting a small bead I will use a very light shear cut ( handle low) from each side to round the bead. A 1/8" bead needs very little material remove. Just a touch and some sanding is the way to go. If a larger bead, I will roll the gouge similar to turning beads on a spindle.
Make sure you have a freshly sharpened tool. Hope this help. I advise practicing on a roughed out bowl that you have just cleaned up the rim. Practicing on a hollowed out center will complicate things

[Pat Scott]

I had a hard time making beads with a spindle gouge on bowls and platters, I think mostly because I was more used to bowl gouges than spindle gouges and just needed more practice. Anyway I'd get a good catch and end up having to turn my bead into a cove. Several years ago I started using a pyramid point tool and haven't had a problem since.

[Ralph Lindberg]

A huge Plus One on the D-Way beading tools and diamond tool! For larger beads, I use a spindle detail gouge, but as Jeffrey said, it is better to complete the beaded area prior to hollowing the bowl - goes much easier....

That's my solution also

[Prashun Patel]

I only have a 1/4" detail gouge. I just turn the speed way down, and go slow. The catches used to happen at the bottom of the troughs. I have better luck with a fairly steep grind and being conscious of the bevel. Not much help; just keep practicing. Like bottom turning, it's more about sheer practice than anything.

[Garth Sheane]

I often put two beads in my bowls about an inch apart and dipple the wood between the beads. I found that doing the beads after the final turning was asking for trouble, because the bowl would be slightly out of round and the beads wouldn't be a consistent depth. So, I now turn the beads as soon as I have the top section of the bowl's outside turned. As for the chisel, I've been using a pointed scraper. Sounds like I should be looking into a proper bead chisel.

[John Keeton]

I had a hard time making beads with a spindle gouge on bowls and platters, I think mostly because I was more used to bowl gouges than spindle gouges and just needed more practice.

Pat, IMO doing beads and coves on spindle work is a whole different game than on a bowl - mostly due to the alternating grain (end and face grain vs. long grain on the spindle) and the larger diameter of spinning material with the bowl which somewhat affects the angle of attack.

[Bob Bergstrom]

Pat, IMO doing beads and coves on spindle work is a whole different game than on a bowl - mostly due to the alternating grain (end and face grain vs. long grain on the spindle) and the larger diameter of spinning material with the bowl which somewhat affects the angle of attack.

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In addition don't try to form the bead too quickly. As John says there is a lot more wood surface on a bowl. Moving the tool around the bead, if hurried, may cause the gouge to skate or be forced out of the groove. If you loose the bevel rubbing, it will run. Pushing the gouge through the cut at best leaves a rough surface.

[Curt Fuller]

Wells, I haven't read through all the replies so if this is redundant I apologize. But it's been my experience that bowls flex. The thinner the walls get, the more they flex. Add the slight pressure from the tool and they flex even more. All this flexing results in those catches and oops type things than cause your bowls to get smaller and smaller. So what I like to do is completely finish turning the outside of the bowl, beads included, right down to the sanding stage, before I start on the inside. The thicker walls prevent that flex. Even with roughed out bowls that you're doing the second turning on I find this works best.

[Mike Cruz]

Wells, I bead using a skew as a scraper. Just make sure it is very sharp. And yes, you will still have to sand.

I have the D-way beading tools, but haven't had the nerve to actually pull them out yet...

[Wells Jacobson]

What a wonderful, thoughtful and most helpful group of comments. Thank you all.
My take-away: Bead when you have as much mass and stability as possible-- early in the game. A bit of soapy water may diminish tearout. Many ways to skin this cat depending on practice and skill levels. My tool rack is too small so I now have a new "first" order of business. Better get my wife something nice for Christmas this year.
Wells

[Bob Bergstrom]

Al Stirt a nationally known turner uses a spay bottle to spritz the surface before applying beads or coves.