Track saw question

[keith micinski]

Ok, I have read all of the people supporting track saw posts and even still have never had any interest in owning one even if they were free let alone how expensive the festool is. I have always thought the one thing I would use a track saw for is for jointing one edge of an 8 or 10 foot board and then making one pass on the jointer to make sure everything is trued up as opposed to now where jointing a long board like that with my jointer is a long, arduous and not very easy task and some times not as accurate as I would like it to be. Now that there are some cheaper options out there I could actually see myself getting one of the lesser saws and mainly using it for this purpose. If I do get one maybe someday the track saw bug will bite me and I will use it for other stuff. my question is how do you track saw guys get any kind of repeatability when making matching panels. After 15 years of doing this stuff I learned that repeatability is the most important thing in wood working. Even if your inaccurate as long as it is repeatable there is usually a work around but I have yet find a work around for panels that are different widths and lengths. I have never been able to measure something,put a mark down and hope I put the mark down exactly where I put it on the other panel and then lined up my straight edge hoping I put the straight edge exactly on the mark, that is now varying in thickness and probably running at some sort of an angle. Then if I try and use a square to make the mark straighter and more consistent I have to figure out where to hold the square to make up for the thickness of the pencil, the angle of the pencil, and the thickness of the mark I want to make. I have seen the marking knives and while that seems like it would be a better solution it still has many of the same flaws. How are you guys doing it and what am I missing.

[Ruhi Arslan]

Parallel Guide Rails with Extensions.

[keith micinski]

Don't you still have to measure, mark and then set the guides on every single piece?

[Ruhi Arslan]

Nope. All pieces will come out replicating the first cut since you line the piece against the stops for each new cut. No marking at all, not even for the first piece. There are some very nice videos illustrating how it works. You'll be a convert.

[Lee Reep]

I bought a Festool track saw specifically for breaking down sheet goods. I was ready to pull the trigger on buying a SawStop cabinet saw, and replace my contractor-style saw.

I bought the Seneca Woodworking parallel guides, which are a 3rd party alternative to the Festool parallel guides. You can easily set them and easily make repetitive cuts and never put a pencil mark on your board or piece of ply, MDF, etc.

This was my first "test" project for the track saw and guide rail -- a dog bowl stand for my daughter. I started with a tile, and everything else was sized as required to make a snug fit. I had to account for the cap trim on top and trim on the vertical edges. The box itself is covered with thin cherry-veneer MDF, but below that is 1/2" ply. All measurements of panels were withing 1mm, and overall, only a couple millimeters. I've never built anything with this accuracy and "squareness" with my table saw. (With all the adding and subtracting of measurements to make everything fit, I went to metric on this project, the fractions were killing me.)

Part of my ability to do this is the CNC-machined top on my bench. Festool sells a small (for portability) workbench called the MFT/3. I duplicated that concept in a stationary workbench. With precisely milled holes, you get a perfect square grid and so 90 degree crosscuts are simple. Part of my system is a set of rail dogs that hold the rail steady on the workbench, and bench dogs used to create stops for your lumber. Another benefit, since the holes are on a square grid, you also get exact 45 degree cuts.


dogbowl-stand.jpg

[Matt Meiser]

The Festool parallel guides have built in scales. The Seneca ones use incra track with scales which one could calibrate but I find it just as easy to use a rule with a stop. Just as easy to set as a TS fence. I've found these combined with the MFT to be a highly accurate (CNC owners would disagree) way to make cabinet box parts in a home shop.

[David Hawxhurst]

eurekazone has they're own system as well. erekazone and festool are probably the two track saw systems with the most accessories.

[Lee Reep]

The Festool parallel guides have built in scales. The Seneca ones use incra track with scales which one could calibrate but I find it just as easy to use a rule with a stop. Just as easy to set as a TS fence. I've found these combined with the MFT to be a highly accurate (CNC owners would disagree) way to make cabinet box parts in a home shop.

Matt,

Good point about MFT (and track saw use) vs. CNC. Certainly an ideal situation for me would be to have a monster-sized shop with a full-size CNC machine. Unless I start buying lottery tickets again, it is most likely not going to happen. The track saw is an ideal solution for many DIY'ers and professionals alike. I am fortunate to have access to a shop with a ShopBot that handles 4X8 sheets, so I made my workbench top there, but I do not want to run to the shop (and it is 30 miles from home) to cut plywood for every project.

[keith micinski]

I must admit I am the crazy one because spending 500 dollars for accessories to be able to make repeatable cuts that appear to take quite a bit if time to setup from some of the reviews I read really doesn't appeal to me. I read a really nice right up where the guy wanted to make 36" panels and the guides don't go that big so he just cut a "little less then a foot off of a piece of plywood". I don't think anymore needs to be said about that. I think I am still going to get one of the cheaper ones like that grizzly for edge jointing and one off cuts here and there where I am just looking for a straight edge or just one panel.

[Erik Christensen]

repeatable cuts can be done with a basic guide rail setup. cut a piece of scrap to the desired rip width - a story stick. position one end of story stick at plywood edge and put a single blade razor on its tip at the other end - slide guide rail till it just contacts the razor blades - put your saw on the track - remove blades and cut. if it adds any time vs parallel guides it is not more than a few seconds per cut, it is just as accurate and costs basically nothing

[Lee Reep]

Keith,

With the Seneca parallel guides, your cut capacity is only limited by the length of the Incra T-Track Plus you use. You can add about 6-7" to the track length for determining your maximum rip capacity. I use 24" track, so I get a little over 30". I could add 36" or 48" track. Yes, the initial setup takes a little more effort, but it is smooth sailing afterward for all cutting at that length, so multiple panels are cut very quickly. I am not doing marathon builds, I'm retired. So I'll take the extra time and not be overly concerned.

Regarding price, with my track saw, extra guide rail, and all the accessories I have, I'm in for over $1000, maybe $1500 with the workbench and all the bench dogs and clamps. But I look at it this way -- my first project, that dog bowl stand for my daughter, was the most expensive gift I have made, and she really likes it. All my future projects will cost next to nothing. The saw and accessories are paid for ... basically just the cost of the wood. Pretty inexpensive in my mind. My wife would say this is twisted logic. Perhaps, but it works for me ...

Only you can decide if spending the money is a waste. I've been doing this for hobby for 45 years or more, and at the point in my life that I want the best I can buy, and enjoy the feeling I get using an incredibly nice tool. If I were to consider this years ago, I might have thought it was crazy. But it is pretty amazing to read about all the Festoolians out there that think their purchases were money well spent. Once you try one, you cannot say "No".

[Matt Meiser]

The Seneca guides more than one of us told you are easy to use are <$200 plus whatever length Incra track you want, up to 48".

Are you trying to learn something here or just call people stupid?

[Earl McLain]

Keith,

Regarding price, with my track saw, extra guide rail, and all the accessories I have, I'm in for over $1000, maybe $1500 with the workbench and all the bench dogs and clamps. But I look at it this way -- my first project, that dog bowl stand for my daughter, was the most expensive gift I have made, and she really likes it. All my future projects will cost next to nothing. The saw and accessories are paid for ... basically just the cost of the wood. Pretty inexpensive in my mind. My wife would say this is twisted logic. Perhaps, but it works for me ...

In YOUR case Lee--i have to agree with your wife. In MY case...i'm going to try that on my wife!!

earl

[Andrew Pitonyak]

I love the track saw for making that first straight cut along a board.

If I needed to cut parallel to the first cut, and I did not want to toss it onto the table saw, I would cut some spacers to act like a story stick (should only need two) so that I could set the track against them (rather than measuring).

[keith micinski]

I saw a guy throw down a couple pieces of rigid styrofoam and rip straight edges on a bunch of 8 foot boards and not even use the jointer at all. Now he was using a festool and from what I have read the grizzly is no festool but it is close enough that I could see this use making it worth while for me. I never realized how much time I spent trying to edge joint some of my longer boards till I actually started thinking about my process recently.