Rough Sawn Lumber Break Even Point

[Rich Riddle]

What do you woodworkers think is the break-even point when dealing with rough sawn wood? I spent an entire day yesterday milling some rough sawn wood for a friend that likely was about $150 cheaper than finished cherry and maple. Guess it was an experience, but it didn't seem cost effective in the long run.

[Andy Cree]

Nothing I have yet to do in woodworking has been cost effective ! (Especially when things end up half-finished and in the burn pile...) However, I did buy about 500 board feet of S2S cherry from a guy that saved me tons of time and was for the same price as rough sawn from our local mill. That was a time/effort savings for sure. I would have to give the solid nod finding milled lumber if the cost is right.

Andy

[Judson Green]

Understand your frustration.

For me the equation works a little differently though. The lumber provider I bought most of my lumber from would not flatten (joint) boards before planing to thickness. So I couldn't count on a good yeild. Also the knives in the planers were poorly set. Was just better to do this in house, have more control over the outcome.

[John Lanciani]

... have more control over the outcome.

This is it for me. I can work to maximize my yield and minimize waste by doing it myself. I hate using wood that is 3/4" (or 13/16" if you're lucky) just because that's some industry standard. 4/4 lumber that is thoughtfully processed almost always nets to over 7/8". It's especially important if, like me, you enjoy using wide boards where they're appropriate. a 12" wide board that is truly flat is almost unheard of in a lift of S2S lumber, at least where I buy.

[Phil Thien]

Understand your frustration.

For me the equation works a little differently though. The lumber provider I bought most of my lumber from would not flatten (joint) boards before planing to thickness. So I couldn't count on a good yeild. Also the knives in the planers were poorly set. Was just better to this in house, have more control over the outcome.

My local hardwood supplier is the same deal. They don't have a jointer, but they will plane to thickness. And I see people having them do this all the time.

I asked the owner once what happens to bows and twists and he said, "oh yeah, they'd still be there when we're done."

So I do my own prep out of necessity.

OTOH, I frequently buy roughsawn lumber on craigslist. I figure my savings pay for my time preparing the lumber.

OTOOH, if I had a very large project I'd try to find someone that can deliver nice flat S2S lumber. None of my projects are that enormous.

[Judson Green]

Phil-

Kettle morine?

I'm not giving them a bad rap, KMH provides an great product, just wish they could joint boards.

[Mark Bolton]

I don't really know that any small shop or hobby shop could be profitable surfacing their own material provided there supplier will offer rough surfaced and straight lined material. It's just too many passes through a planer which is more than likely about 10x too small for the job, the quantity of chips, knives, and of course not having a straight line rip saw.

I have a small band mill so we wind up surfacing then straight lining on 9' slider and it's a ton of work but no other option.

Anything purchased is S2S @ 13/16 and straight lined one edge. Not having to deal with the chips alone is worth it.

[Willem Martins]

I only buy S2S if I am desperate and have no other choice. Otherwise everything rough sawn preferred.

Probably my process of building, but once my cut list for a piece is done, everything is sized to within a couple of thousands of on inch and after assembly need minimal finishing prior to spraying the first coat. If I use S2S, I pretty much have to do the same thing, except I end up with thinner boards.

For lathe work, I only joint two sides to get the wood square, then cut to length using the square side as a reference then directly to the lathe. My spindles always end up at least 1/4" thicker than using S2S.

For cabinet work, I joint the edge and one face, to get a perfectly flat board. Then cut to exact length, then through the thickness planer. The result is no bowed boards and exactly the same dimensions. With S2S, the boards are not always straight, the thickness is not accurate and there are normally imperfections that have to be planed out. So the process remains pretty much the same for both.

[Keith Hankins]

See I look at this very differently. To me its not about time or $$. I do not buy lumber in real small amounts either. However, if the mill or supplier has already finished it say to F2S, F3S, or F4S and it's been in his facility then when I move it to mine, it never fails to move on me. It can be small like a twist, cup, or wane. So, I'd prefer to bring it in rough let it set normalize and then start taking it down. I even do that in phases to minimize impact.

Back in my early days before I had tools to do it, I bought from a shop and paid them to mill it but only because I had to. Done it with hand tools and would rather spend that time than have someone chew off a good bit and I still have to deal with it. I remember buying 5/4 to compensate for issues. Thats not real cost effective either. TM2CW

[Rich Riddle]

Ah, this was rough lumber, none cut or ready for use, a 0S.

[lowell holmes]

Houston Hardwoods will mill rough sawn lumber purchased from them while you wait. You can take it to an operator on the floor and he will do it for you as you watch.

They will do 2s1e for a nominal fee. It was 55 cents a board foot. Then all that is left to do is rip it to width.

I use them a lot because of that service.

[Phil Thien]

Phil-

Kettle morine?

I'm not giving them a bad rap, KMH provides an great product, just wish they could joint boards.

Good guess. And I agree w/ you, I'm happy to have them as another source. I'm just surprised at the # of guys I see have KM plane the lumber.

They always offer 13/16, which I also think is odd. Seems like you may as well go right to 3/4", no sense in me bothering with the last 1/16? It isn't going to be enough material for me to remove any problems in the board, I don't think.

But I could be wrong. Maybe they have some sort of double-sided planer that actually gets boards pretty flat? I know there are such beasts out there. So maybe their pro customers have found the service offered by KM to be sufficient.

[Judson Green]

Good guess. And I agree w/ you, I'm happy to have them as another source. I'm just surprised at the # of guys I see have KM plane the lumber.

They always offer 13/16, which I also think is odd. Seems like you may as well go right to 3/4", no sense in me bothering with the last 1/16? It isn't going to be enough material for me to remove any problems in the board, I don't think.

But I could be wrong. Maybe they have some sort of double-sided planer that actually gets boards pretty flat? I know there are such beasts out there. So maybe their pro customers have found the service offered by KM to be sufficient.

Last time I poked my head behind the curtain they had two single sided planers, a straight line rip, jump saw, wide belt sander, huge band saw (with a huge blade in it). I know at one time they had a Oliver jointer (a 16", 166, I think). Many years ago I asked them to flatten a board for me on it said that they only use it for in house things, mantles. I'm sure it still there but I didn't notice it.

[Earl Rumans]

I haven't had much luck getting S4S that I didn't have to work on myself anyway. The surfaces are either not square and parallel, or the board has some cup, or twist, that requires fixing. I just buy rough cut and do it myself anymore.

[nicholas mitchell]

I couldn't imagine not milling my own lumber. Just doesn't seem right to me.