Drawer box construction ?

[Dennis Hawkins]

Greetings all

I'm in the process of building a chest-of-drawers for myself and I'm at a cross road as to how I'll build the drawer boxes.
I have no skill for hand cut dovetails so I'll be using my Leigh D4 to cut the joints.
Faces will be 7/8" Butternut, sides and backs will be 5/8" Ash.
Most drawers will be 36" wide x 19" deep. 1/2" Baltic Birch bottoms rabbeted into 1/4" grooves.
My plan was to do half-blinds to the faces and through dovetails for the backs. I then realized this will require two different set-ups on the D4. So I starting thinking about using thicker ash backs for a duplicate half-blind joint as I'll be using for the fronts thus eliminating any setup change on the dovetail jig.

I was wondering if half-blinds both front and rear is a common approach to drawer box construction.?

BTW
I'm using Blum undermounts for drawer slides if that has any bearing on this.

D.

[Joe Scharle]

I've done it, but unless all 8 ends are EXACTLY 90 degrees your drawers will take on an artistic warp!
I find myself lately using a simple drawer lock in the back.

[Dave Richards]

Half blind DTs in the back isn't common but I can't see any reason you couldn't do it.

[Lee Schierer]

I do half blinds all the way around my drawer boxes. I also totally enclose the drawer bottom. I've never had a drawer box or bottom fail. You will just need to notch the backs to accommodate your under mount slides.

[Peter Quinn]

Just make sure to size the run of the drawer correctly, it's easy to make it too long. Account for the thicker back and the integral front so your slides make it to the back. I have done similarly and gotten the length wrong because I didn't reD the spec sheet clearly. The lengths on the spec sheet are for applied fronts, for integral you have to measure back of the front to the back of the back. Seems hard to screw up while discussing it.....but.....

[Dennis Hawkins]

Yes Lee
I intend to totally enclose the plywood bottom.

I'm wondering why half-blinds all the way around are not common if the joints are machine cut?

With inset integral front drawers I'm now thinking(unless there is something I'm missing) why do it any other way.

I'm guessing if the joints were hand cut then the through joint may be easier to cut and fit than half-blinds hence the reason for both joint types in a single drawer ?

[Dennis Hawkins]

Just make sure to size the run of the drawer correctly, it's easy to make it too long. Account for the thicker back and the integral front so your slides make it to the back. I have done similarly and gotten the length wrong because I didn't reD the spec sheet clearly. The lengths on the spec sheet are for applied fronts, for integral you have to measure back of the front to the back of the back. Seems hard to screw up while discussing it.....but.....

Peter
I'm actually going to cheat a little here.
I'm using 18" slides but building 20" drawers. The slides are set back about 2" so I will loose the full extension feature of the slide but gain a few inches in drawer depth. I'm going to screw the locks straight into the 1/2" plywood bottom at the required distance from the back of the drawer so it will close at the correct setback location. I chose 1/2" plywood drawer bottom material for a number of reasons. Strength ,enough material to hold the lock screws and stable enough to glue the bottom to the drawer members.
This is a frame and panel style dresser. I have the slides bottom mounted between the two leg members of the dresser sides. This allowed the slide to be recessed behind the drawer opening so I don't have to rabbet out the bottom portion of the drawer sides to overhang the slide.
The use of inset drawers with integral faces using undermount slides required some thought as to how to make it all happen. I think I have it worked out.

[Peter Quinn]

Peter
I'm actually going to cheat a little here.
I'm using 18" slides but building 20" drawers. The slides are set back about 2" so I will loose the full extension feature of the slide but gain a few inches in drawer depth. I'm going to screw the locks straight into the 1/2" plywood bottom at the required distance from the back of the drawer so it will close at the correct setback location. I chose 1/2" plywood drawer bottom material for a number of reasons. Strength ,enough material to hold the lock screws and stable enough to glue the bottom to the drawer members.
This is a frame and panel style dresser. I have the slides bottom mounted between the two leg members of the dresser sides. This allowed the slide to be recessed behind the drawer opening so I don't have to rabbet out the bottom portion of the drawer sides to overhang the slide.
The use of inset drawers with integral faces using undermount slides required some thought as to how to make it all happen. I think I have it worked out.

I'm confused. I've never seen blum slide clips that allowed you to screw up into the drawer bottom, they all toe screw forward into the drawer face. This can easily be over come just by putting a 2" spacer block behind the actual front glued to the drawer bottom into which you can screw the clips. I suppose you could modify the clips to screw up into the drawer bottom, but I see no need? Not sure how important it is on a chest of drawers but the clips allow quick removal of drawers for cleaning which is handy in a kitchen.

The part about rabbiting out the drawer bottom? You need 1/2" clearance between the bottom of the drawer sides lower edge and the actual bottom panel, you need a 1 1/4" X 1/2" plow on each side at the back to allow the drawer runners to go through, and you need holes at the specified locations at the back. Failure to meet these conditions will make the slides visible in the open position, they are meant to be invisible. Its a simple matter of making your dado for the drawer bottom at the proper location, and if using 1/2" bottoms you either have to lay out your tails and pins carefully or make stop dados in the front and back.

I'm not sure whats meant by "bottom mounted"? They are designed to be side mounted, thats the only place with screw holes. If you have a web frame internally they can certainly rest on the frame for support, or I suppose you can drill holes to screw down, I usually just add packing to the inside of the case between legs so you have something to screw into sideways but not hit the panel. Maybe I'm misunderstanding whats happening?

[Dennis Hawkins]

Peter
Here are a few photos for clarification.IMG_2102.jpgIMG_2092.jpgIMG_2093.jpg
The lock that you see here is intended to mount to the bottom front edge of a drawer box(not the drawer face itself) which will have a false front applied. All I did is remove the vanilla colored portion which is held on with one screw from the underside.The result is photo #2 which reveals two additional holes for straight through mounting as well as the toe in mount.

The slide itself has holes available for bottom mounting. If you look closely in front of the white plastic part there is a truss head screw into the web frame. One in the rear as well.
Also you can see the "L" fixed portion of the slide is tucked in behind the leg. This hides the slide so I don't have to rabbet out the bottom portion of the drawer side to overhang it in order to keep it hidden like you would if it was side mounted.

I built a mock drawer to get the exact measurements for the drawer depth. I installed the slide to the mock drawer then set the lock in place which gave me my dimension for lock placement which in my case is 17.5" from the back side of the drawer to the front edge of the lock.
So in a nutshell I'll have a 19.5" drawer with 18" of travel.

[Lee Schierer]

Yes Lee
I'm wondering why half-blinds all the way around are not common if the joints are machine cut?

With inset integral front drawers I'm now thinking(unless there is something I'm missing) why do it any other way.

I'm guessing if the joints were hand cut then the through joint may be easier to cut and fit than half-blinds hence the reason for both joint types in a single drawer ?

I usually build drawer boxes out of 1/2" poplar and then attach a 3/4" thick drawer front of the cabinet wood to the front of the drawer box with screws.

[Peter Quinn]

Peter
Here are a few photos for clarification.IMG_2102.jpgIMG_2092.jpgIMG_2093.jpg
The lock that you see here is intended to mount to the bottom front edge of a drawer box(not the drawer face itself) which will have a false front applied. All I did is remove the vanilla colored portion which is held on with one screw from the underside.The result is photo #2 which reveals two additional holes for straight through mounting as well as the toe in mount.

The slide itself has holes available for bottom mounting. If you look closely in front of the white plastic part there is a truss head screw into the web frame. One in the rear as well.
Also you can see the "L" fixed portion of the slide is tucked in behind the leg. This hides the slide so I don't have to rabbet out the bottom portion of the drawer side to overhang it in order to keep it hidden like you would if it was side mounted.

I built a mock drawer to get the exact measurements for the drawer depth. I installed the slide to the mock drawer then set the lock in place which gave me my dimension for lock placement which in my case is 17.5" from the back side of the drawer to the front edge of the lock.
So in a nutshell I'll have a 19.5" drawer with 18" of travel.

Thanks for those photos, clears it all up and I learned something ! I've never used blums that way, didn't realize it were possible. Looks great. Peter

[Dennis Hawkins]

I usually build drawer boxes out of 1/2" poplar and then attach a 3/4" thick drawer front of the cabinet wood to the front of the drawer box with screws.

Lee
I gave this some consideration however I already had the ash stock on hand so economics had a role in the decision to do integrated fronts.

I was originally going to build through dovetails to mimic box joints as in a Greene & Greene design but eventually decided against that approach.
It would have been much easier to install the slides further into the opening then apply false fronts like you suggested but I wanted the drawer to be more like a traditional furniture piece rather than a kitchen drawer (even though I'm using undermount slides).