Couple used planes

[Mike Holbrook]

I like wood planes but I want a couple old used metal planes for rough work. I would like to try something corrugated and something with a plain flat bottom in a 5, 5 1/4, 5 1/2, -6 size plane. I have been checking auction sites and I am a little lost with the plane manufactures other than Stanley, Miller Falls, LV & LN. I find Lakeside, Deiance, and Sargent for example, are these decent planes too? I want to start with a plane set up with medium camber, not a scrub, as I am currently using more "finished" lumber.

[Andrew Fleck]

Lakeside and Defiance are lower grade planes. The others you mentioned are good planes if you get the right years of manufacture with the exception of LV/LN. Those two have been making good planes as long as they have been in business as far as I know. For example an older Stanley plane IMO is much better than a new one. It's subject to opinion, but that is mine. Take it for what it's worth. Others will be able to tell you what type, etc... of plane you should look for. My older planes are all Stanleys that were made prior to WWII and they all work great. Some of them needed some help, but they all do what they are supposed to now.

It sounds like a #5 would suit what you are looking for. Those can be found cheaper at yard sales and antique shops than they can be on the auction site for the most part, plus you get the added benefit of being able to inspect it in person.

[Sean Hughto]

Many of the off brands are very close to Stanleys, and some guys like the subtle differences in MF and Sargent planes even better than Stanley. In all events, go vintage - pre-1940. There are so many Stanleys that are good and cheap, I probably would start there. You should be able to get a great user 5 for no more than $35 and a 5 1/2 for no more than $60. 6's don't seem to be very popular generally, and often really cheap too.

[Mike Holbrook]

Thanks for the input guys. I am finding decent looking prospects I can just buy for $25 and bids starting much lower. Good to know which are normally a little lesser plane. I am finding a large number of the Sargent planes, some have an autoset feature, which uses an entirely different adjustment mechanism, any opinions on them? I was/am a little hesitant to buy an older plane model that I might have trouble getting parts for. However, I have actually found blades for both types of Sargent planes, and significant numbers of other replacement parts too.

Now I have to figure out which are the older pre WWII models. I found an actual web site for Sargent plane models and I know there are ones for Stanley too.

[Sean Hughto]

http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/

https://home.comcast.net/~rexmill/pl...ing/typing.htm

[Jim Koepke]

My biggest point for sticking with Stanley is finding parts is easy. Some of the other do use standard hardware. Don't ask me which.

My opinion is to also stay away from most Stanley planes made after WW II. I have a #5 from then that is mostly okay. It would cost more to ship it than what it is worth in my opinion.

jtk

[Mike Holbrook]

Great links Sean, I have some reading to do. Then maybe I will be able to tell the pre WWII planes. I appreciate the help. I was leaning towards the older planes anyway,. They look more solid and well made, like many of the older hand tools. Now I have dates to work with.

Any thoughts on Keen Kutter? I see a fair number of them. I know Keen Kutter has a good rep, in other hand tools. They look like Stanley copies. I wonder if many of the Stanley/Bailey look alike planes were actually made by Stanley or some large other company?

[Jim Koepke]

I wonder if many of the Stanley/Bailey look alike planes were actually made by Stanley or some large other company?

Here is a link to identity by lateral lever. Lie-Nielsen uses the Stanley type lateral adjuster. Not sure if anyone else copied it. It likely costs a bit more to make in this fashion.

http://www.brasscityrecords.com/tool...lane%20id.html

Here is a link to a post of mine that has some information:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...ne-information

It and others are archived in the Neanderthal wisdom/FAQs.

jtk

[steven c newman]

Hmmm, I might, just might mind you, know a thing or two about older planes.....LOL

Have a DE6c (rebuilt) that most of the original parts were by Union Tool Co. Pre-1920s

Have a Sargent #414c This is a #5 sized Jack plane. About mid 40s ( $17 shipped, too)

Have Type 19 #5-1/2 Stanley. NOT a bad plane, actually. Been taking it to some rough sawn red oak lately

Don't over look one off brand by stanley. The Four Square line. These are all branded with that SW. No other markings. Mine is a 5-1/4 size. VERY GOOD junior jack!

Lots of "off brand" planes come through my little shop. Only the best will stay, though.

There is actually TWO types of Defiance brand planes. The second version looks like a regular run of the mill hand plane cheapo. The FIRST version, without the "normal" frog, is VERY light weight, large mouth, and made for Joe handyman to abuse and toss into the tool box. And still do the work every day after. Had a #4 of these. Iron is an older style Stanley iron, and very good.

Best of both worlds? Try the Transitional planes. I happen to have a Stanley #31. Same iron width as a #7, but at 24" long, it is a long jointerIMAG0040.jpgIMAG0041.jpg tuned up, and sharp. Makes some nice heavy curlie thingies...

[Mark Engel]

I have found many Sargent planes that are as good or better than vintage Stanleys.

Millers Falls planes can also be a good value. Look for the hinged, three point lever cap.

I stay away from most of the 'economy' brands, Fulton, Dunlap, Defiance, Four Square, etc. They usually sell at close to the same prices as vintage Stanley, Sargent, Millers Falls, etc. so why buy them. My FIL was fond of saying, "For 10 cents more you go first class."

[don wilwol]

Here is my site which will help with dating sergeants. http://www.timetestedtools.com/typei...ch-planes.html

The older fultons were made buy Sargent as well and were good planes. My Fulton info is still on my blog, http://www.timetestedtools.com/typei...ch-planes.html

[Mike Holbrook]

I have noticed that many front knobs on these planes are cracked. The info. I am reading indicates that this was a problem until they started using a raised metal ring, cast into the body, to house the wood base of these knobs. I am wondering if this is a significant problem with the earlier bodies? If I am calculating the dates correctly there are pre WWII planes with this feature. Are planes in this time frame good prospects to search for? Maybe there is a work around for this issue that would eliminate it from consideration?

I am thinking a jack or fore type plane will see heavy use which may stress the base of these knobs on these relatively heavy planes?

[Jim Koepke]

There is likely a few different reasons for knobs to crack. The early tall knobs did provide more leverage to the base of the knob.

I like short knobs and no ring.

jtk

[Mike Holbrook]

So Jim, I believe the short knobs pre-date the taller knobs which in turn pre-date the bodies that have a place molded in them for these knobs. So if I understand what I am reading Jim likes the earlier model planes. Since I believe Jim has a wealth of experience with these type planes I am thinking it is safe to assume that even the early plane knobs were reasonably reliable. I know they made lots of them so they must have worked reasonably well, from what I read quite a few "new features" Stanley came up with were more for marketing reasons and not necessarily because they made the tools work better. I read that some people felt the lower knobs were a little hard for them to grip but since I have medium size, wide hands I think I too might like the wider, shorter knob.

[Judson Green]

A number of my working planes do not have the raised ring casting and work just fine, some knobs are chipped at the bottom. Guess I'd prefer to have the raised ring casting, but wouldn't dismiss a good looking plane without the raised ring.

I prefer short knobs on small planes, like 3 and 4. On larger planes I don't really think about knob height. My Stanley 8 is really old (pre-frog adjuster) and I don't even think about the shorter knob on it. Even though I just said what I did, at times the short knob on a 3 size plane can seem a little crowded for my digits.

Also prefer the smaller iron adjuster (brass knob) on the 3, do not like smaller adjusters on larger planes. Have the smaller one on my 8 and need to swap it out.

And I don't have any problem with the planes after the war, roman ogee at the top of the frog. I have a 4 from this era and its one of best smoothers, of course I've tuned it up, still complety stock.

And a vote for the lowly frankenplane, they need loving too. One of my favorite 5's is a frankenplane.