Preparation for Staining Maple

[Dave Kirby]

Hello! I am building a Maple cabinet, with raised panel doors, which is to be stained with a dark stain (Rust Oleum Ultimate stain, specifically). This is the first Maple I've stained; so I was wondering is there any specific prep I need to do after sanding to ensure it will take the stain well (Is 220 grit an ok finish sand or should I stop at 150 or 180 grit)? Do I need to clean the surface with something after sanding? Is a tack cloth ok to use (I've heard they can actually hinder some finishes)? Should I use a pre-stain conditioner (like Minwax's) or a sealer of some kind? The Rust Oleum can says that their product doesn't require a pre stain conditioner but I want to be sure and get some advice of some folks with experience. Sorry for the barrage of questions. I'd appreciate any advice or tips you could give.

[Leo Graywacz]

Different stains will react differently. I wouldn't use MinWax on maple. I use WoodSong II, but that's a pro stain and you might not have access to it. I am really unsure what else is out there for the hobbyist.

If you are going for dark stay at 150 grit. The one exception would be the end grain of the panels and if you are adventurous the end grain of the stiles of the doors, sand them to 220 grit.

Most stains will have a natural stain. This is a stain without pigments. You can use this as a conditioner. You would apply it just like you would do a stain. Watch for areas that dry up and add more of the stain until they stay wet. After you achieve this wipe it down and then let it dry. This will fill the wood cells with the stain material and keep them from acting like a sponge. The areas that were getting dry are the blotchy areas.

After it is dry you can stain it. If you are ragging it on wipe it off quickly so it doesn't have a lot of time to soak into the wood. Blotching is caused by uneven absorption of the stain. The longer you leave it on the more it can soak into the areas that are willing to absorb more stain. Most stains you can do another coat and get it darker. With the WoodSong II stain it's the opposite, it'll rip the color off and make it lighter.

Other ways to slow blotching down is a washcoat. That is using a finish that has been thinned down between 5 and 10% solids. Apply the washcoat on everything and then wait for it to dry. Then scuff sand it with 220 to 320. Then you apply your stain. Again this seals the wood so it limits the absorption of the stain. I find this is much more labor intensive then the natural stain (conditioner) way.

[Dave Kirby]

Different stains will react differently. I wouldn't use MinWax on maple. I use WoodSong II, but that's a pro stain and you might not have access to it. I am really unsure what else is out there for the hobbyist.

If you are going for dark stay at 150 grit. The one exception would be the end grain of the panels and if you are adventurous the end grain of the stiles of the doors, sand them to 220 grit.

Most stains will have a natural stain. This is a stain without pigments. You can use this as a conditioner. You would apply it just like you would do a stain. Watch for areas that dry up and add more of the stain until they stay wet. After you achieve this wipe it down and then let it dry. This will fill the wood cells with the stain material and keep them from acting like a sponge. The areas that were getting dry are the blotchy areas.

After it is dry you can stain it. If you are ragging it on wipe it off quickly so it doesn't have a lot of time to soak into the wood. Blotching is caused by uneven absorption of the stain. The longer you leave it on the more it can soak into the areas that are willing to absorb more stain. Most stains you can do another coat and get it darker. With the WoodSong II stain it's the opposite, it'll rip the color off and make it lighter.

Other ways to slow blotching down is a washcoat. That is using a finish that has been thinned down between 5 and 10% solids. Apply the washcoat on everything and then wait for it to dry. Then scuff sand it with 220 to 320. Then you apply your stain. Again this seals the wood so it limits the absorption of the stain. I find this is much more labor intensive then the natural stain (conditioner) way.

Here is the info on the stain. Doesn't look as if they offer a "Natural" color. And it does say "No wood conditioner required". http://www.rustoleum.com/en/product-...ate-wood-stain

[Scott Holmes]

Natural stain or pre stain conditioners actually (somewhat) seal the wood; so getting a dark color is going to be more difficult. Stopping the sanding at 150 will help. You would get a more even color and can get as dark as you want using dye instead of pigment stain. Your best bet may be dye the wood to get your base color, then stain over the dye. Dyes do not seal the wood; stains do. Pigment stains will hide the grain; dyes don't.

When I need a dark walnut color on maple (I can't count how many jobs I've done where they couldn't get the color they wanted with stains) I use dye then seal it with de-waxed garnet shellac, then add toners and/or a glaze to get to the color I need.

[Dave Kirby]

Natural stain or pre stain conditioners actually (somewhat) seal the wood; so getting a dark color is going to be more difficult. Stopping the sanding at 150 will help. You would get a more even color and can get as dark as you want using dye instead of pigment stain. Your best bet may be dye the wood to get your base color, then stain over the dye. Dyes do not seal the wood; stains do. Pigment stains will hide the grain; dyes don't.

When I need a dark walnut color on maple (I can't count how many jobs I've done where they couldn't get the color they wanted with stains) I use dye then seal it with de-waxed garnet shellac, then add toners and/or a glaze to get to the color I need.

Thanks for the info Scott! What Dye would you recommend in this case?

[Scott Holmes]

Color is your choice... as for brands; TransTint, Lockwood or TransFast are all very good.

[George Bokros]

Maple will blotch even with dye, I know because I made some test samples for the project I am now finishing. I used Charles Neil blotch control with great success and TransTint dye mixed in water. You will not be able to follow with a coat of shellac unless you spray the shellac because you can also mix TransTint with alcohol. I am using oil based top coat so there is not fear of the top coat dissolving / lifting the dye.

What are you using for your top coat?

[Dave Kirby]

Maple will blotch even with dye, I know because I made some test samples for the project I am now finishing. I used Charles Neil blotch control with great success and TransTint dye mixed in water. You will not be able to follow with a coat of shellac unless you spray the shellac because you can also mix TransTint with alcohol. I am using oil based top coat so there is not fear of the top coat dissolving / lifting the dye.

What are you using for your top coat?

I plan to use the Rust Oleum Polyurethane as a topcoat.

[George Bokros]

I plan to use the Rust Oleum Polyurethane as a topcoat.

I believe you should not have any issues with dye lifting using a poly top coat. The shellac step can be omitted.