Dewaxing Bullseye Shellac

[Prashun Patel]

I need some dewaxed shellac and Borg was out of Sealcoat in quarts. So I am going to try to dewax a quart of bullseye blonde.

I left the can stationary in my cold car for a couple hours and then ladled off the top layer into a jar. I poured the remainder in a second jar. The left jar has the bottom layer. The right jar has the top layer. You can see that a lot of the work is already done.

I placed both jars in the freezer overnight. The cold should help the wax precipitate and decrease the alcohol's solvency. Let's see what happens tomorrow.

[Scott Holmes]

You should buy some flakes and then you have it whenever you need it

[Prashun Patel]

I do normally. I am out of flakes, need it fast, and didnt want to wait. Also, i have been wanting to try this for a while

[John TenEyck]

Prashun, that's pretty interesting. I look forward to how it turns out. It's getting harder to find Sealcoat lately, but I always see the Blonde, so it would be great if your experiments work out satisfactorily. Looking good so far.

John

[Kent A Bathurst]

You should buy some flakes and then you have it whenever you need it

No Foolin. For my basic stuff - super blonde dewaxed - when I open my last 1 # bag, I order another. Store them in the freezer [downstairs with the shop - convenient].

NOt worth my trouble to run out, and the inventory cost is not that huge, compared to the price I pay for wood, or the gadgets with sharp blades I have hanging all over th ewall.

Prashun, that's pretty interesting. I look forward to how it turns out. It's getting harder to find Sealcoat lately, but I always see the Blonde, so it would be great if your experiments work out satisfactorily. Looking good so far.

John

Me to - interested in results.

J-10: Getcha some flakes and you aren't on the hook to local stores smerchandising decisions. And, if you are lucky, you can find a small coffee grinder at a yard sale or flea market for a few bucks - that makes the flakes dissolve faster.

[Scott Holmes]

I store mine in the shop refrigerator. Some have been there a long time no issues mixing up a fresh batch.

[John TenEyck]

Kent, I find that SealCoat shellac meets all my needs. I use it to finish drawers, straight from the can by wiping. For most other uses I spray it. I can make any color I want by adding Transtint dye to it. I see no need or reason to buy a bunch of different shellacs, grind the stuff, and then buy alcohol to dissolve it in. The cost would likely be higher and it would be more work for no apparent gain. My only frustration with SealCoat is that sometimes it will corrode the can and leak out. I've gotten around that by storing it separate glass bottles. I normally go through a gallon in less than 6 months, but have used some nearly two years old w/o issues. It works for me.

John

[Kent A Bathurst]

Kent, I find that SealCoat shellac meets all my needs. I see no need or reason to buy a bunch of different shellacs, grind the stuff, and then buy alcohol to dissolve it in.

I am with John about the Sealcoat. It's ready, it's relatively fresh, it's blonde enough, it's amber enough, BORG still carries it in gallons. .

You fellers are simply no fun at all. Bah !! Humbug !!

[Prashun Patel]

I understand that flakes are easier and better and smarter to stock.

This is an experiment more for curiosity. I have always been curious how much 'wax' is in bullseye vs. Sealcoat. I have also just been curious how easy it is to separate it. This may be the last time I ever do it.

After a night in the freezer, there was no separation. I know from other work that the way to drive separation of a solution/blend/emulsion is to increase the density and polarity disparity between the two desired layers. So, I thinned the waxy side with 50% ethanol. I then heated the mixture. You can see that the phases are beginning to separate in the second picture.

Even the 'clear' shellac (yet uncut) has some residual wax that has begun to settle.

[Kent A Bathurst]

This is an experiment more for curiosity. I have always been curious how much 'wax' is in bullseye vs. Sealcoat. I have also just been curious how easy it is to separate it. This may be the last time I ever do it.

After a night in the freezer, there was no separation. I know from other work that the way to drive separation of a solution/blend/emulsion is to increase the density and polarity disparity between the two desired layers. So, I thinned the waxy side with 50% ethanol. I then heated the mixture. You can see that the phases are beginning to separate in the second picture.

Even the 'clear' shellac (yet uncut) has some residual wax that has begun to settle.

Resident mad scientist, eh? I have been curious as well, but unwilling to do the research.

May I assume that you are going to keep track of volumes? Interesting to know if there is a price advantage to dewaxing your own - - I doubt it, but an interesting question.

[Prashun Patel]

I can tell you that there will be a significant amount of weight wasted in wax.

Also, I can already see that measuring precisely is difficult. It's impossible to to know how much shellac/wax/ethanol is going to be in the residual waste.

Fortunately, I usually mix my shellac pretty thin, between 1 and 1.5#, and have never found the need to be very precise. Good enough for my purposes of general sealing and blotch proofing. (I'm working with a piece of sycamore now that needs it.)

[Mike Null]

Prashun

Thanks for posting this. Now I'll know never to try it.

[Prashun Patel]

By Crackie, I am going to finish this. But I can tell you three days in that this freezing/thawing is not as easy as I anticipated. The wax does separate, but it re-dissolves pretty quickly. So, as you decant, you inevitably get little tiny swirls of wax that contaminate the final product. I highly doubt a small amount of wax will be an issue, though. I mean, it's not that hard to get the product about 95% clean.

If I had to do this again, I think I'd just let the factory can sit still for a day at room temperature, then pour off the top half as I did Day 1, then thin that portion by 50% with Ethanol.

I am with John about the Sealcoat. It's ready, it's relatively fresh, it's blonde enough, it's amber enough, BORG still carries it in gallons. Maybe I'll have to start buying in gallons like you John. I bet if it were decanted into smaller, sealed vessels it'd keep fairly well.

[roger wiegand]

Just spin it in a refrigerated centrifuge and you should get very good separation. (a yet more exotic new tool to acquire!-- also useful for molecular gastronomy experiments) It wouldn't be the strangest woodworking I've done in the lab.

[Jim Becker]

I wonder if doing your separation in a "gravy separator" would provide a more thorough way to do the deed...