Why Is Oak "Dated"?

[Jason Roehl]

No, it usually goes the other way, Julie--once you update one thing, everything else looks even more out of date.

[Steveo O'Banion]

Same thing happened to mahogany and darkly stained cherry in the 60's. In 30 years it will be in fashion again.

[Mike Schuch]

Ugh, I don't know what is worse golden stained oak or painted cabinets?

When I think of oak I think of all the pressed board furniture my friends had in college with a vinyl oak veneer. Yuck!

My current kitchen is oak. I refinished it in maple veneer. I used the original oak cabinets and veneered over the face frames as well as added some new maple ply panels to the end cabinets. No one has ever even thought that the cabinets were not maple. All of the door and drawer fronts were replaced with new solid maple raised panel doors and solid maple drawer fronts my father built for me. It turned out great. As in great from 6" away not just great from 6' away.

P.S. The lower a realtor puts your house on the market for the quicker it will sell and the less work they will have to do. Don't ever think a realtor is looking out for your best interests... they are only looking out for their own best interest.

[Jak Kelly]

Funny how through the 60's hardwood floors was what poor people had, if you had made it then you had carpeting. I think some of the ideas/popularity behind carpeting have disappeared probably because so many have realized the problems associated with it; hygiene, gasses, allergies........ We are now also dealing with a lot of people who have no idea what a well built home is, what is good cabinetry, quality work...... I have known numerous people who think the brick on their homes add structural value to the home.
Painting good quality oak cabinetry or scraping them out for Ikea is a sin to me, represents the sign of a true "idiot" and how little these people know!

A large majority of the generation coming up now can't even open a bucket of paint, much less identify quality work or materials that will last!

But, you still cannot overlook the fact of "what sells"!

[rudy de haas]

Julie:

I've watched this thread since it began and pondered the question off and on. So first a lot of the advice here about fixing the problem seems smart to me.

Second, I wonder if your agent was reacting as much to the tile as to the wood? A lot of older tile looks like a future maintenance problem.. expecially the smaller stuff used on counters. Continuous counter tops really are better (if made well and of good materials) and are certainly more popular. We went all granite here, but you may want to look at some of the pour-in-place stuff if you want things to look updated but not cost much.

If your counters are a standard size you may also want to consider replacing them, sinks, taps and all, with perfectly good products other people are taking out ( see craigslist or kijiji for starters).

Third, I think people see oak as old fashioned because oak, especially the cheaper stuff with highly visible grain, was used on so many government buildings - and who wants to be reminded of high school or traffic court while at home? Smooth, simple, colors are "in" - and, as several here have pointed out, you can refinish Oak to look that way for a few years without doing much damage to the actual wood.

[Brian Holcombe]

I'll be the devil's advocate on the update-to-move thing. The next owner is married to your choices, so unless the benefit outweighs the expense I would prefer, as a buyer, an outdated house over a house updated to move.

The owner prior to us put in granite in the kitchen. My wife loves it, I would have preferred the freedom do make my own choice (which would not have been granite)

[Jared Sankovich]

Julie,

I have to ask how long all that kitchen work took (as someone who is now in year 3 of a kitchen remodel not nearly as nice as yours)? Seems to me you must have started before your original post or you should offer classes to slowpokes like me on how to get things done

Ha, I was thinking the same thing (rounding year 2 myself)

I think I started in fall of 2013. I got most of it done over the winter. By spring 2014 I had everything done but the drawers in the cooktop cabinet and the flooring. I had to build the base cabinet and the wall cabinets at the cooktop area from scratch and I wasn't sure if I'd try to make 4 working drawers or 2 working drawers and 2 dummies. Last summer I decided and made 4 working drawers. Then I ripped out the old sheet flooring and installed Pergo XP in Koa and finished up a few odds and ends.

BUT... the ceiling work and all the electrical work and the countertop & sink were done a winter or two before. For some silly reason I thought if I updated some of the kitchen those almond cabinets would look updated too.

It looks fantastic, I was really wondering how you could have done it all in a week.

[Julie Moriarty]

The idea of updating your home to increase the sales price is certainly fraught with problems. Too many individual tastes. Everyone wants to make a home their own personal home and yet there's no shortage of buyers who want turn-key homes. In the end, I think most just want a brand new custom built home but would be clueless as to how to direct the builder to build it. People who flip houses know that pretty much all they have to do is focus on the aesthetics - throw in some cheap but in-style cabinets, fixtures, etc - and they will flip it quickly and make a profit. The uneducated buyer is their perfect customer. I can't do that and still sleep at night. Yet there's a good chance whoever buys our house will be clueless as to what went into making it what it is and that it's not the same as the flashy flipper house that looks so good on the surface. It has good bones.

I'm finished making the doors and drawer faces for the bathroom cabinets. I was able to do it all with the wood I had in stock. My only expense thus far has been hinges and a gallon of finish. But once the cabinets are done, the countertops will look out of place. So I'll have to replace those. Then I'm done. All that will be left after that is getting my SO and son to clean up their messes so we can show the home. Now that's a real challenge!

[Jason Roehl]

I think you're dead-on with that assessment, Julie. On top of that is the Realtor, who works on commission. Seven percent of $250,000 is more than seven percent of $200,000, and all they have to do is tell their seller to "update" various parts of their house--they have no skin in the game if they tell someone to do the updates before a listing agreement is signed.

[Chris Friesen]

Personally I love the look of solid-wood trim, but I just can't justify the cost.

I've got crappy builder-grade oak cabinets from the 80s in my kitchen. The drawers are particleboard stapled together but with solid oak fronts, the cabinet boxes are plywood and particleboard. I can't justify just throwing them out since they still do the job, but I'll probably paint them in the next year or two. I've replaced the cutlery drawer with one I made from baltic birch, but I couldn't use Blum undermount slides because the face frames took up too much space, making the drawer too shallow. (I really like the undermount slides, the soft-close side-mount slides just aren't as smooth.)

As part of a minor remodel in the kitchen I added a run of white Ikea cabinets with Blum soft-close slides integrated into the drawer sides. I got the painted MDF doors/drawer fronts. (Stay away from the thermofoil, it's not repairable.) Sure, they don't look as nice as solid wood, but they look okay and they work really well. I customized the top door of the pantry cabinet to open upwards rather than to the side. I think it looks better, and it's certainly stronger that way.

[rudy de haas]

I agree - in that I too would prefer, if buying a house, not to have it cheaply updated by the seller. Our house here in sunny Lethridge (where it is currently snowing and at -17C) was like that: the previous owners had it for 26 years and did nothing. Great! However.. most buyers disagree with us

[Rod Sheridan]

OH Oh!

I'm presently building a red oak fireplace mantel for an electric fireplace, and it will be light oak to match the other furmiture..............

Funny thing is, it's exactly what Diann wanted as she provided the sketch of what it was to look like.

Should I tell her that her tastes are out of date? aybe this could ba a "Dear Abby" type question................Rod.

[Julie Moriarty]

I think you're dead-on with that assessment, Julie. On top of that is the Realtor, who works on commission. Seven percent of $250,000 is more than seven percent of $200,000, and all they have to do is tell their seller to "update" various parts of their house--they have no skin in the game if they tell someone to do the updates before a listing agreement is signed.

Oh yeah. Realtors pick a price point that maximizes their profit while increasing the chance of a quick sale. They take the cost of advertising, showing the house, etc and place it against potential profits at a given list price. Then they produce "proof" your interests are best served by listing at their price. Maybe it's just me, but people who come into your house to sell something need to be approached with caution.

[Julie Moriarty]

Those "functionally obsolete" awful oak doors will soon be ushered out and thrown out into the cruel world. Too much drama? I agree...

But I'm actually inspired by how the new doors and drawer fronts are going. I admit I was a reluctant warrior but now I'm seeing light at the end of the tunnel.

For some reason I haven't had luck with dyeing African mahogany. It's been like staining pine. So I'm doing the natural approach and it's not bad. When I did the kitchen I used Honduras mahogany and it was too light to go natural. But the AM rails and stiles seem to go well with the sapele panels.

One coat Enduro-Var (brushed) on the left. Bare wood on the right

And I've had those two characters who never shut up, one on each shoulder, telling me what to do. "Hey! You'll never enjoy this. Don't fret the details! Just slap it together!" While the other says, "Why listen to that mope? Has he ever done you right?" So there I am, making sure everything is perfect while the other character is telling me I'm an idiot. At least I'll sleep well.

FWIW, here is where the rails and stiles began:

It's 8/4x13x96+ AM. I bought it about three years ago and didn't have a clue what I'd ever do with it. But it had this straight grain and I envisioned lots of things. None ever happened. Now that beautiful piece of wood has sunk to the lowly world of utility cabinetry. I should be shot.

[Richard Barker]

Those "functionally obsolete" awful oak doors will soon be ushered out and thrown out into the cruel world. Too much drama? I agree...

But I'm actually inspired by how the new doors and drawer fronts are going. I admit I was a reluctant warrior but now I'm seeing light at the end of the tunnel.

For some reason I haven't had luck with dyeing African mahogany. It's been like staining pine. So I'm doing the natural approach and it's not bad. When I did the kitchen I used Honduras mahogany and it was too light to go natural. But the AM rails and stiles seem to go well with the sapele panels.

One coat Enduro-Var (brushed) on the left. Bare wood on the right

And I've had those two characters who never shut up, one on each shoulder, telling me what to do. "Hey! You'll never enjoy this. Don't fret the details! Just slap it together!" While the other says, "Why listen to that mope? Has he ever done you right?" So there I am, making sure everything is perfect while the other character is telling me I'm an idiot. At least I'll sleep well.

FWIW, here is where the rails and stiles began:

It's 8/4x13x96+ AM. I bought it about three years ago and didn't have a clue what I'd ever do with it. But it had this straight grain and I envisioned lots of things. None ever happened. Now that beautiful piece of wood has sunk to the lowly world of utility cabinetry. I should be shot.

perhaps you should try some potassium chromate to age the AM before the Enduro-Var and watch the grain pop.