Table Saw Guarding questions from a newbie

[Tony Roun]

Hello all. I am relatively new to woodworking and certainly to this forum. I have found it to be a great resource of information so far, and hope to contibute to it as well. My experiences relative to woodworking have been more on rough carpentry, and now I have built a dedicated woodshop in hopes of creating more furniture-grade pieces as well as some wood-strip canoes at some point.

My question today involves Table Saws. I had a friend recently experience a significant table saw accident while ripping some hardwood without a guard over the blade (typically he would just have a riving knife on it). He is extremely experienced and I would consider him to be relatively safety focused as well. He still does not know exactly what transpired, but it served as a wake up call for me to ensure that I have a fail-safe method of using a table saw safely if I am to include it in my future wood shop. I have a green light from my wife to purchase a Saw-stop down the road after saving for it if I want to go that route. My current table saw is a Crafstman 'hybrid' saw, something between a cabinet saw and a contractor saw.

Is there an effective way to guard a table saw blade 100% of the time? My plan would be to use my 18" bandsaw for hardwood rip cuts, so I imagine that my table saw will primarily be for plywood work, crosscuts, dado cuts, and beveled cuts. I apologize if this seems like an ignorant question because I haven't had enough experience with different types of cutting operations I will likely need in a table saw to know if there is a way to always have a good guard over the blade. Most videos I watch to learn different techniques show folks not using a blade guard, and I can't figure out if it is because the guards are a pain to deal with, or if it is physically impossible to guard t he blade durng certain cuts. I am willing to spend the money to put an aftermarket guard on the saw, but I am curious to understand if folks have found a way to always have the blade guarded? I have seen cross-cut sleds that had a blade guard built right into it, which seemed interesting. Are the over-arm guards like the Excalibur more fail-safe than traditional guards?

Anyway, I appreciate in advance anyone's thoughts on this subject. I am new enough that I can build 'good' habits and overkill habits in the name of safety. I am just trying to get the right equipment in place, and avoid having to spend a ton of money on a Sawstop if there are alternative ways to fail-safe the table saw guarding.

Thanks!

[Roger Pozzi]

Just my opinion. If you are truly afraid, don't do it. Table saws are relatively safe if used for their intended purpose so, never do something that just seems to be unsafe. The guards in a lot of videos are removed for the ability to show the actual procedure and that is usually stated somewhere in the video or ensuing write up.
I, for one, usually set my blade a little higher than recommended to increase the downforce of the blade and always use a sharp, clean blade with a splitter or riving knife, depending on the needed cut.

[John Lanciani]

Is there an effective way to guard a table saw blade 100% of the time?
Thanks!

In a word, yes. I use a modified cantilever style (over arm) Brett guard (in addition to a true riving knife when applicable) on my saw and my personal rule is that if I can't make the cut with the guard in place I don't use the table saw, period. The Brett guard works with standard blades, a dado stack, and the moulding head that I use from time to time with no hindrance to my speed or accuracy. There is really no good excuse to use an unguarded table saw.

[Jeff Ramsey]

I've never hurt myself on a saw, and have been using my Unisaw for over 30 years. I don't have a guard or anything else that would obscure vision, and never did. I use push sticks, don't use long sleeves, use ear/eye protection and feel perfectly safe. If a piece kicks back, it's a problem with technique or something else (I don't get kick-back). I think if you're not afraid of the tool, it's best to have complete vision of what's going on. At least that's worked for me.

(update) See Jim's post below. You might want to start with some sort of guard/riving knife/anti-kickback and see how it goes. If you feel comfortable having the piece not be in total view as it proceeds through the cut, but with the safety features installed, then use them. After experience you may remove some or all of them, or you may get a slider like Jim mentioned and never have to worry about it again.

[Jim Becker]

Use of a true riving knife (to help eliminate binding/kickback) with an easily adjustable overarm guard is about as good as it gets for "protection", but there is no 100% solution. Accidents happen. Accidents happen less when folks take their time and don't rush, carefully consider each cut and use the best safety techniques to make that cut. Technology can help increase safety, but it still comes back to the actions of the "mark-one human operator" to insure that all efforts are made to work safely.

One of the things I like about my slider is that other than narrow rips, my hands are never near the blade and quite often, the workpiece is clamped down through the cut. And my working position is very much out of the "line of fire" for typical kickbacks, too.

[John TenEyck]

Guards were developed for good reason so please use the ones on your saw, or find an aftermarket one if you don't like the OE one. I am constantly amazed that people do not use guards; some don't even use a splitter. Many have never had an accident, but that doesn't make it safe. Woodworking shows and magazines rarely show TS's with the guards in place; a real disservice to the general public and especially to folks like yourself who are just starting out.

My crosscut sled has a guard on it - something I almost never see on other's. It just seemed like the right thing to do. With a little thought you can use a guard on any cut.

Also, don't think that you can't get seriously hurt on a band saw. While they will not cause kick back, they can take off a finger or worse as fast as a table saw. Use caution with anything that has a moving blade - and please use the guards.

John

[Robert Engel]

Everyone is responsible for their own safety, so the guys (like me) who basically have gone "commando" for 20-30 years and not gotten hurt are probably the ones you *shouldn't* be listening to!!

But that being said, IME hand on the blade is the worst injury, but not the most common on a TS. Kickbacks and getting hit by a flying knot are far more numerous.

Use your guards if you want, but when plowing a groove or dadoing you can't use one because you have to hold the board down tight to the top.

I think safety starts between the ears, and by this I mean looking for loose knots, checking boards for warping before ripping, not forcing a cut, wearing eye protection, etc. etc. You'll prevent alot more (albeit less severe) injuries doing this.

BTW, if you're ripping wood on a bandsaw, you're using a far more dangerous machine than a TS, IMHO (let's not even talk about radial arms). The lesson is still the same - THINK first!

Happy ww'ing!!

[Hoang N Nguyen]

I own a saw stop so if your wife gave you the green light for it, do it! I love it and knowing I have the added protection of the break system makes me sleep better at night. That's not to say that you shouldn't practice good safety handling of your saw. Even with the saw stop, I still use everything I have to help keep my hands away from the blade. I push sticks for cuts less then 6", push blocks for cuts larger. I always have my blade guard on when I'm making cuts larger then 3", at that width I can have my guard on and still have room to use my push stick/pad without it hitting the fence or guard. I haven't come across a cut on my table saw that I can't do without either of what I mentioned. There should be NO NO NO reason why you can't use either the blade guard the riving knife on the saw stop other then dado cuts. The riving knife moves up and down with the blade and will allow you to make non-thru cuts with the riving knife attached. I'm building a table for my big green egg right now and had to make a few notch cut outs on the corners of a 4x4 post which requires non-thru cuts and have no problem doing so with my riving knife attached.

As Robert said above, there are people that have gone commando their entire life and never had an accident, but that's not to say you won't lose a finger on your first cut. I'm an engineer by day, woodworker by night so I need my fingers. Not to mention I'm quite attached to them.

[John Lanciani]

Use your guards if you want, but when plowing a groove or dadoing you can't use one because you have to hold the board down tight to the top.

BTW, if you're ripping wood on a bandsaw, you're using a far more dangerous machine than a TS, IMHO (let's not even talk about radial arms). The lesson is still the same - THINK first!

Happy ww'ing!!

I groove and dado on my saw with the guard in place all the time and quite successfully, so you're absolutely wrong that it cant be done safely, quickly, and accurately.

As far as the bandsaw being more dangerous that an unguarded tablesaw you've got to be kidding, right? The bandsaw by design forces the stock being cut down onto the table and has absolutely no ability to cause a kickback; please explain how that makes it more dangerous than a tablesaw. If you doubt me try this experiment; start cutting a board on your bandsaw and just let go of it and watch what happens (absolutely nothing, it just sits there). Try that on your tablesaw and let us know how it works out.

[Chris Merriam]

I'm also in the camp of using the guard whenever possible. I only take it off when the cut is less than 2 or 3 inches. I also keep an eye on the offcut behind the blade and see if it's bowing out or pinching in. If I see that I will normally stop the cut and turn the saw off and finish on the bandsaw. As an FYI, I've only had one kickback, and it was on a narrow bevel cut. It felt wrong to do it, I was thinking the narrow offcut would get stuck in the wide factory table insert, and sure enough it did and it got thrown. The weird thing is I have a left tilt blade, yet the offcut was thrown behind me and to the right somehow.

[glenn bradley]

First a big plus one on the myth that bandsaws are safer than tablesaws; just ask anyone who's tangled with one.

Second, as to

Is there an effective way to guard a table saw blade 100% of the time?

this is done by the operator. I have a sign in my shop that many here are familiar with:

These machines have no brain; use yours.

Granted there are always unforeseen possibilities, that's why we call them accidents. If your friend recalls carefully he will realize what happened or he has been doing something unsafe all this time and it finally just got him.

I know we've all read or heard the sage words of some old timer that goes something like "I've been doin' this for 40 years without a tablesaw guard and have never had an accident". Some people smoke till age 90 or survive car wrecks without wearing a seat belt too. These are the rare exceptions and I do not think I will follow their example as a rule of good behavior.

I had a C-man 22124 and used my own shop made ZCI's and Micro-Jig MJ Splitters with great success. I also had an overarm guard and have one for my current saw as well.

There are many operations that are safer without the guard in place but, I use it whenever feasible. For all operations I try to stay very focused on safety and technique. If I am in too much of a hurry to do things safely I should leave the shop ;-)

Splitters and riving knives protect against stress releases in material, poor feed path control and in the case of the riving knife; small cutoffs getting launched by the rear of the blade. This along with good push blocks, feather boards, stock support and other safety procedures should keep you safer than the average tablesaw operator (if statistics tell anything).

Hmmm, I must've had too much coffee. I am rambling.

[Al Launier]

I also am in the camp of using a splitter and/or riving knife. However, I'd like to add that the use of good safety goggles and a good face shield (together & especially when ripping stock) as the last defence against what may fly at you. There has been much written about recommended goggles & face shield on this forum that you can check out.

[Jim Andrew]

Did your friend cut himself on the blade, or did he experience a kickback? You commented you plan to do crosscutting on the TS, makes me think you should look at a sliding table tablesaw. Grizzly has a short stroke, and a 78" stroke slider, think one is in the summer sale catalog.

[John K Jordan]

Also, don't think that you can't get seriously hurt on a band saw. While they will not cause kick back, they can take off a finger or worse as fast as a table saw.
John

Although bandsaws are incredibly safe compared to circular saws, I agree, they can still hurt you fast and bad. (I use 5 bandsaws here.) I have a Woodmizer sawmill behind the barn - when researching I came across statistics about how much safer the sawmill industry got when they went from circular saws to band saws. Imagine the kickback from a 4' blade - it can throw a slab at you.

The biggest danger with bandsaws is cutting unsupported wood such as a round or something that can tilt. I once had a perfectly supported piece suddenly become unsupported when an inner void gave way. Slammed the wood into the table, bent the blade, and ripped up the insert. No injury other than to the saw.

Some good advice for bandsaws (and other tools): Imagine what would happen to your fingers if the wood suddenly disappeared. This is especially relevant when applying force by pushing with your hands, perhaps with a dulling blade.

I often rip with my larger bandsaw but there is nothing like a table saw for precision. My table saw (PM66) safety improved by adding a sliding table (Robland) and an Excaliber over-arm guard/dust pickup. I use a splitter and Grr-ippers when appropriate. That said, if the task allows, the bandsaw is my first choice.

JKJ

[John Sincerbeaux]

I bought my first table saw when I was 16. I learned basic woodworking in high school. To this day I employ the same principles of safely using a tablesaw that I learned in HS. Ironically there were NO Guards on their huge table saws. Almost 40 years of cutting on a table saw, I have never had a kickback, or accident of any kind and I have never used a guard or splitter. The kind of work I do on my TS makes it impossible to use either...or at least for 75% of my work. I do however use a lot of push sticks, feather boards, and sliding jigs.
My tips on TS safety:
1). Get some basic instruction how to properly feed wood into a table saw.
2). Better the saw, the safer!
3). Set the blade height above the wood to as deep as you want to cut yourself by.
4). Set your fence alignment correctly.
5). Use only quality SHARP blades.... kinda like everything in woodworking😊
6). Believe every time you turn on your saw, can be the time you destroy your hands.
7). Make really good push sticks. Mine are about 12" long with a handle a few inches from the end.
8). If things start getting ugly, like a board strangling the blade causing burning and or binding, or the wood is creeping away from the fence, just Freeze, hit the stop switch while holding everything still. Let the blade stop, and reassess and recut.
9). If you have kids, always unplug or lock the saw start switch. I would never cut with my kids behind me.
10). 6)