G0766 - Banjo upgrade experiment

[Roger Chandler]

Well with all the talk about the banjo on the 0766, I decided to do an experiment. Now the stock banjo works fine for most bowl turning , and it is just if one wants to turn a long cylinder that is as big as the 22" diameter swing that the stock banjo is a little short in the distance from the center

I talked to the folks at Oneway about the 0766 and which banjo would be right for it. Interesting! The banjo for the 20" amd 24" Oneway's have a too tall post supports cast into them to be usable on the G0766.......they are just too tall.

However, the one they make for the 16" lathe was designed for use with their outboard bed extension, and will allow for a 24" diameter piece, which would be 12" away from the center line of the lathe, and is for a 1" post and you can get the clamp plate for 1.5" gap between the ways. The post support is shorter than the ones on the 20 and 24" banjos, so that should work. The part number is H0082.

I ordered one to try it out, and if for some reason it does not work, I can send it back for a full refund. I will report back once I get it in and set up on my G0766, and let you know if this aftermarket option takes this 0766 up towards an ideal level.

Back at the beginning when I first ordered the 0766, I had been thinking about upgrading the banjo. I had watched a video of Bob Hamilton, where he used a oneway banjo on his Nova DVR, and had taken note of the extra length he could get on that, so it has been in my mind for a good while....even back when I had my 0698.........I think this will be a great addition to the 0766 arsenal.

Stay tuned for an update on this........it will likely be the end of next week before it arrives.

[Roger Chandler]

Optimization - I look at upgrading my lathe like this............. When I bought my pickup truck some years ago, I did not think back then about pulling a trailer. Since I got that truck I have now acquired two trailers and use them quite regularly, so that fact has necessitated that I upgrade my truck for that purpose. I put on a class IV trailer hitch back some years ago and also had a heavy duty clutch installed as well.....one that is optimal for towing and hauling heavy loads.

I think that it would have been wrong of me to buy a truck that had none of those features on it, and then expect that they should have had them installed, unless I paid for a towing package........which on my next truck will be one of the items that I will make sure is on the vehicle and of course will pay for that feature.

Adding accessories to suit our uses and purposes is a fairly standard thing with anything........including wood working equipment. On my former table saw, I made several upgrades to make it a better performing machine, and when I got my present table saw, I went for a premium Biesmeyer fence system, etc......all that adds to the cost.

Adding an accessory to optimize my lathe is in the same category in my thinking...........If I wanted many possible accessories included, then I would have to pay for those, so thankfully, they are available as aftermarket options, and I can tweak my lathe and optimize it for those purposes that suit my uses as I go along!

If I had wanted all the bells and whistles of a top of the line truck back then, I would have had to pay more than I did to get all those accessories.........the same holds true with our lathes......I believe I got a really good lathe with the basics as far a a package for far less $$$ than the higher end lathes out there.......and for those very substantial savings, I will be glad to add a little tweak here and there to optimize it, and customize it to my own liking!

Your $0.02?

[James Conrad]

Well, I was thinking about getting a second banjo anyway... I have a couple of Oneway inside and oustide rests arriving today, why not tack on a banjo. This is not a matter of needing an accessory, their specs brag 22" of swing, one would expect being able to turn objects within that spec. This is another mistake on Grizzly, 3 inches shy of the mark.

[Roger Chandler]

Well, I was thinking about getting a second banjo anyway... I have a couple of Oneway inside and oustide rests arriving today, why not tack on a banjo. This is not a matter of needing an accessory, their specs brag 22" of swing, one would expect being able to turn objects within that spec. This is another mistake on Grizzly, 3 inches shy of the mark.

It will turn a 21.5" bowl blank with current banjo and toolrest. To make a 21.5" cylinder for a hollow form, then you are right that the banjo is short for that.

I agree that the engineering on these specs was lacking on the part of the manufacturer! They basically took the frame and bed of the g0733 and added a bigger headstock and tailstock with more swing, which is fine in and of itself, as the bed is plenty stout for that, but they did not refine the ergonomics and should have made a new banjo that was about 4" longer than the one they put on this lathe, which is again the same as on the G0733.

I guess with the substantial value we got, there was a trade off of $$$ and engineering. I still think Grizzly should go back and re-do these issues and going forward change those things to make this a solid home run, even if they have to raise the price a couple hundred dollars........then their reputation might not suffer! Value is important, but so is the engineering specs to make this lathe optimal in its configuration!

I am not trying to contradict my statement in the former post above, but the ideal would be to issue these with a correctly machined tool rest and a longer banjo and have that included in the price, even if it is an extra hundred or two!

[Mark Greenbaum]

What about making a banjo offset? Like this:
banjo offset.JPG

[Roger Chandler]

What about making a banjo offset? Like this:
banjo offset.JPG

That might have possibilities, Mark......one would just have to try one and see if too much vibration was introduced, but it looks like one with the correct diameter post might be a viable option.

[Belton Garvin]

Robust already makes an offset like the one above. Thought about getting it when I ordered my tools rests but couldn't come up with a good reason...Tool Rest Dog Leg - $64 http://www.turnrobust.com/product/tool-rest-dog-leg/

[Mark Greenbaum]

That might have possibilities, Mark......one would just have to try one and see if too much vibration was introduced, but it looks like one with the correct diameter post might be a viable option.

This was just a quick 3D CAD sketch - 25mm post x 5" long, with a tube to receive the same - gussets may help, but I'd have to wait and see what kind if interferences there would be.

[James Conrad]

Robust already makes an offset like the one above. Thought about getting it when I ordered my tools rests but couldn't come up with a good reason...Tool Rest Dog Leg - $64 http://www.turnrobust.com/product/tool-rest-dog-leg/

I figured someone had made something like that. Unfortunately, with the stock tool rest, it will make the height issue worse.

[Mark Greenbaum]

I figured someone had made something like that. Unfortunately, with the stock tool rest, it will make the height issue worse.

The outboard tube could go under the plate, and then it would be 1/2" higher, or the plate can have a Z-bend to allow a drop down.

[Belton Garvin]

With the Robust rests I purchased, the added height won't be a problem at all. Of all the Tool Rests I've used, I really like the configuration of the Robust rests the best. I have both the low profile (6") and the comfort rest (15")

[hu lowery]

What about making a banjo offset? Like this:
banjo offset.JPG

As has already been mentioned, the part to hold the tool rest would have to go down, not upwards. Still not something that hard to make if someone didn't like the Robust adapter. Something like this with the socket to hold the toolpost going down instead of up was one of the things I considered making. I also considered a heavy plate on the lathe bed that would have to drop down also to hang the banjo off of.

My concern is that we are re-engineering the lathe, making major changes in the loads that can be put on it. Most personal modifications to a lathe are like a vacuum chuck or hollowing system, they don't increase the load on the lathe. With the longer banjo or adapters we are putting sideboards on our pick-up truck to stay with Roger's analogy. Just because I put sideboards on my pick-up doesn't make it able to haul six yards of gravel! Is the 766 able to haul six yards of gravel and the banjo just an oversight? My time in design engineering says that such a gross oversight is very unlikely but not impossible.

If it is only an oversight I sure wish Grizzly would make us aware of that. I really liked my 766. However I intended to turn some twenty inch diameter pieces on it. Those required some pretty massive blanks and I wasn't sure the Grizzly was up to the task.

Hu

[Roger Chandler]

As has already been mentioned, the part to hold the tool rest would have to go down, not upwards. Still not something that hard to make if someone didn't like the Robust adapter. Something like this with the socket to hold the toolpost going down instead of up was one of the things I considered making. I also considered a heavy plate on the lathe bed that would have to drop down also to hang the banjo off of.

My concern is that we are re-engineering the lathe, making major changes in the loads that can be put on it. Most personal modifications to a lathe are like a vacuum chuck or hollowing system, they don't increase the load on the lathe. With the longer banjo or adapters we are putting sideboards on our pick-up truck to stay with Roger's analogy. Just because I put sideboards on my pick-up doesn't make it able to haul six yards of gravel! Is the 766 able to haul six yards of gravel and the banjo just an oversight? My time in design engineering says that such a gross oversight is very unlikely but not impossible.

If it is only an oversight I sure wish Grizzly would make us aware of that. I really liked my 766. However I intended to turn some twenty inch diameter pieces on it. Those required some pretty massive blanks and I wasn't sure the Grizzly was up to the task.

Hu

As far as load goes, on my former G0698 I turned some pretty good sized log sections..........a couple of them were at least 17" diameter and about 14 inches tall........a pretty good sized piece of timber. That lathe handled it, and this 0766 should handle a piece that is 20" without problems. That being said, I do think we need the blanks to be in balance as much as possible to avoid any unnecessary forces being put on the unit.............

Not disputing your concerns, Hu......each of us has to do what we feel is appropriate and safe. My truck analogy notwithstanding, I got the V-8 motor and had the basis for hauling built into the truck, but just needed to add a couple of upgrades to make it a solid hauler..........

Same here, I think. I think the biggest thing that would improve stability of these lathes would be if they designed them with more splayed out legs with a bigger footprint front to back. I think the bed, headstock and tailstock can handle the load, but the footprint could be bigger front to back ............sort of like what is on the Robust American Beauty.

[Dok Yager]

Roger a silly question here. Would the banjo from the 698 work on the 766 and is it shorter?

[Roger Chandler]

Roger a silly question here. Would the banjo from the 698 work on the 766 and is it shorter?

The banjos on both lathes are identical in size and shape................so they are interchangeable, but do not change anything by changing them out!