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Thread: My idea for a better table saw insert

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Page View Post
    This is the last throat plate I ever made. I made mine out of aluminum plate but it could just as easily be made out of hardwood. The slide in inserts are easily made in a few minutes.
    That is awesome! Well done.

  2. #32
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    IMO the best way to go, if one is made by anyone for your saw, is to buy an aluminum milled one that has removable blank strips. I went with the Infinity/Colliflower ZCI for my SawStop and so far its been awesome. (LINK)

    100-335_base.jpg
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Falk View Post
    Bruce, how did you machine the aluminum? With a milling machine?
    Bob, I have an old Lagun FTV-2 turret/knee mill that came out of a job shop. I wouldn't want to make a living with it but it's great for a garage shop.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rivel View Post
    IMO the best way to go, if one is made by anyone for your saw, is to buy an aluminum milled one that has removable blank strips. I went with the Infinity/Colliflower ZCI for my SawStop and so far its been awesome. (LINK)

    100-335_base.jpg
    I have one of these too, and love this thing!
    Kevin

  5. #35
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    IMG_0174.jpg
    Here's a better view

  6. #36
    How well do you find that the Infinity insert holds down into the saw. In their original versions they had the same kind of lock down lever as the Sawstop inserts; but they had to stop that due to Sawstop asserting a patent on it. If it had the regular hold down, I would definitely get it, but without the same kind of positive lock down of the insert I am less sure about it.

  7. #37
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    The Infinity has no latch on the front of the insert like the SS one does, but I've never seen a latch on any other saw insert either. I can see no danger at all of the Infinity insert ever lifting up. It does hold captive at the rear of course.

    One thing I've discovered about the Infinity is that the leveling screws at the rear work differently than the SS insert. If you set the original insert level, then you have to relevel if you switch to the Infinity insert & vice versa. That is a pain. It's either that or abandon the original insert altogether.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    John,

    Some comments on your idea and some constructive criticism of your writing.

    -------------------------------------------------

    I have two editorial comments for you, one about your initial post and one about your submission to a periodical.

    FIRST: considering your initial post. I agree with the others - your initial post is very difficult to read. Not because of the length - there are many very long posts. Not because of the content - it appears to be well thought out and well written. Not because of the words - the grammer and sentence structure is fine and I noticed few typos.

    However your post is one of the most diffucult I have ever read because visually, all the sentences are jammed together! Browse this forum and others and look at some long posts. They are almost always broken up into paragraphs. Often the photos are interspersed with the paragraphs. Sometimes the writer includes a few words of caption with each photo which can make it easier to follow the ideas.

    Here is a suggestion of how to go about this. Go ahead and write your text as one big block. Then go back and break it up into paragraphs to make it easy to read. Insert photographs between the paragraphs where appropriate. (NOTE: you can still do this by editing your post!)

    Another way to approach organizing a long post with photos is to insert all photos first and leave some space between each one. Then write the text between each photo.

    Your supposition that forum members here don't read much is flawed. In fact, a recent thread revealed that many here are avid readers! I personally read dozens of books each year and many articles.

    One thing you might consider is how many busy people read forums. First, they look at the subject title and decide if they are interested enough to take a look. If so, they click on the post and often glance at the whole thing, notng the length, visual content, etc. This is a bit like turning a page in a magizine and glancing over the page.

    Then, if still interested, they start reading the first few lines and decide whether to continue. If afraid you lost most readers before this. Reading through a huge block of text is a chore for the human eye and brain. This is MUCH worse if the lines are wide, for example all the way across the screen. Look at any magazine or newspaper. (Have you ever read one? Sorry, I couldn't resist!) All of these are printed in columns! It is too easy for the eye to lose the place when returning to the left side of a long line.


    SECOND: Concerning your submission to a periodical. Editors are very busy people. They get 100s of submissions from hopeful people. But they are also human. If a submission is difficult to read and understand at first glance... guess what, it is ignored, trashed, forgotton. Next please. This is a very much like a personnel manager leafing through a stack of employment resumes. A quick glance at a few key points and it goes into one of several piles. The way a resume is organized says a lot about the way the person thinks.. I'm afraid a resume written as one huge paragraph would go in the pile at the bottom of the next to the desk.

    My wonderful wife was an editor for years and reviewed scientific documents from all over the country. When she received a document like yours that lacked formatting she would not even read it. It would be returned to the author with a page of helpful guidelines.

    -------------------------------------------------

    If you are interested in improving your writing so people will look at your content instead of the image it presents, there is a wealth of information on the internet and in books. Another very helpful thing is to get someone you trust to read the article and make constructive suggestions.

    It is very helpful to first type a long document into a word processing program where it can be reviewed, edited, printed, and easily passed to others for review. Then when honed, it can be copied, prehaps in sections, into a new thread. Note that I did not do any of that for this lengthy response but just typed it into my iPad! It is likely poorly organized and full of typos. However, I'm not trying to make a good impression and get my ideas across to to the public. Just to you.

    JKJ
    John, these are very good comments. Periodically, when we hire I review tons of resume's. One that comes in like the OP's is immediately cast to the side. Once, they might get a style / suggestion guide as to how to write cogent prose (or a legible resume). One is not communicating if no one is willing to read the information due to format, etc...

    The best advice I ever got in my life is around communication. "Become expert in communication. You are translating the desires of the owner to the hands of the builder. The clearer you can make this, the better all will be."

    The concept of paragraphs was not created merely to add an arbitrary structure; but instead to provide an organizing structure in which separate ideas / concepts / topics may be interpreted by the reader and understood most effectively. It is not about the author but about the needs of the reader / audience.

    I don't write technical material anymore. But, I often edit or comment upon it. The OP's material is fine, but if lost in structure (or lack thereof) it really doesn't exist if no one is willing to read it. I might suggest Strunk's, the Elements of Style. This is still the essential book. No one seeks James Joyce style prose. Why use five words when fifty might do? Simple sentances in simple paragraphs. Edit down as much as possible but no further.

    James, again, this is a nice response.
    Shawn

    "no trees were harmed in the creation of this message, however some electrons were temporarily inconvenienced."

    "I resent having to use my brain to do your thinking"

  9. #39
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    I have one of those aluminum inserts. I made a slight modification by drilling a small hole in the front and inserting a pin to keep it from lifting up.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce Page View Post
    This is the last throat plate I ever made. I made mine out of aluminum plate but it could just as easily be made out of hardwood. The slide in inserts are easily made in a few minutes.
    I had one made for my Craftsman saw that uses the same type of insert.
    Lee Schierer
    USNA '71
    Go Navy!

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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Schierer View Post
    I had one made for my Craftsman saw that uses the same type of insert.
    lol, a friend, after seeing the one I made for my Unisaw asked me if I could make one for his '70's vintage Craftsman. Sure, says I! It turned out to be much more involved and took twice as much time to machine as the one for my Unisaw.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Bruce Page; 01-20-2016 at 2:43 PM. Reason: Added drawing
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  12. #42
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    Can I be your friend, please?!
    This (making a reusable ZCI) is among lots of other little things that I postpone until I have more time and not running after a project. Seems that time never comes. Very slick

  13. #43
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    The comments by John K Jordan and Shawn Pixley should be in a sticky somewhere. They contain excellent advice. Some of Shawn's comments are great concerning why or how people decide to read something.

    It does not matter very much if the writer thinks it is easy to read. The goal is to get people to read it and understand it. A post needs to have a title, structure and content that pulls the reader into the post.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by mreza Salav View Post
    Can I be your friend, please?!
    This (making a reusable ZCI) is among lots of other little things that I postpone until I have more time and not running after a project. Seems that time never comes. Very slick
    Me too. So I cut a piece of wood to fit the worn kerf and jam it in with glue. Fast and easy.
    Last edited by Andrew Joiner; 01-20-2016 at 6:29 PM.
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  15. #45
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    I'll limit my comments to the merits of the OP's design. Others have ably dealt with presentation and attitude.

    If I want to make a zero-clearance insert adjustable, and the choice is between drilling and tapping holes in the most vulnerable parts of a $300+ cast iron saw table, and installing $3 worth of threaded inserts in a piece of MDF scrap, the decision is a no-brainer. A pretty common rule of engineering is that you modify the least expensive part, if it will accomplish the same goal. I suspect the reason the submission wasn't accepted for publication is that it was not, in fact, a way to make a better zero-clearance insert.

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