Cherry for Ashley Isles Bench chisel Handles?

[allen long]

I am getting around to re-handling some ancient Buck Brothers and Addis carving chisels (warning - major gloat at the end of the post) (and 17 vintage Taylors) in cherry. One, for the looks, two for a better feel in the hand, and three, so my son's will be more likely to keep them and remember Dad when they go down the rabbet-hole and start using them later in life. Honestly, the last one is the primary reason.

Here are a couple of pics of the smaller and larger carving chisel handles:

chisel handle cherry large & small.jpgchisel handle cherry large.jpg


I am getting ready to give one of my sons a set of Ashley Isles bench chisels and wanted your opinion. Is cherry a suitable wood for a chisel where one might use a mallet? I will send him a Wood is Good Poly mallet when I send the Ashley Isles. The insert in the larger handle is a 1/2" long 5/8" diameter plug of bloodwood with a 5/16" diameter 1-inch long brass dowel going into the handle.

I am thinking of re-handling the Ashley Isles with the larger of the two styles shown above. The cherry is really beautiful and the handle style has a much nicer feel in the hand.

Is cherry a good idea? Or would curly maple be advised? I know the maple is harder and tougher, but wanted your ideas on the cherry and whether it is "tough enough".

Your thoughts and opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Many Kind Regards . . . Allen

My once in a lifetime gloat

Several years ago I stumbled upon a cache of about a dozen and a half of Addis and buck brothers carving chisels and a couple of Swan chisels (1/8 and 1/4 inch mortise chisels it appears), a sweet set of rosewood handled tiny chisels, a tiny Arkansas slip stone set , a few misc. goodies, an antique wood tool box, oh, and a millers falls cigar spokehave in excellent condition all for $35. The handles of the Buck Bros and Addis chisels were egregiously ugly and unfinished. The Swan socket chisels had no handles and someone had beaten on the sockets @#$^&* (but they finished nicely). They were so dirty when I bought them that I had no idea what I had until I got around to cleaning them up a year or so later!

[Trevor Goodwin]

What is the purpose of the brass dowel?

[Stephen Clement]

Generally, cherry is not a great wood for any sort of impact tool. Hornbeam and beech are traditional and they are about twice as hard as cherry. For smallish carving gouges, it is probably fine since they are used with light mallet taps, not heavy hits like mortise chisels.

I've heard that maple isn't ideal since it is a bit brittle; that said, I learned that after I handled my mortise chisels in maple and haven't had a problem yet. Straight grain is best mechanically , but some figure won't kill it.

That said, I'd consider this: if your goal is for your kids to remember you, you may want a handle material that is most certain to last.

[Marty Schlosser]

I recently rehandled two of my Veritas bench chisels (with PM- V11 steel) as I wanted to do some experimenting with shapes to fit my smallish hands. I turned them out of soft maple and although I don't pound on them excessively, and they're not hooped, they've stood up very well.

I, too, would be interested in others' thoughts on this topic.

[Andy Nichols]

Used figured cherry for my Classic Thin Greenlee bench socket chisels, with no issues....don't pound on them but do use a hard maple mallet cutting dovetails and even light mortise work.

Regards,
Andy
Mos Maiorum

[george wilson]

I would not put any inserts into the end of your handles. The bloodwood one is too short,and bloodwood is very brittle,and will soon crack under hammer or mallet blows. The brass one will spread out with the pounding,and MIGHT crack the handle as it spreads.

I'm not absolutely certain if the brass will spread enough to crack the wood,but over time and pounding,it very well may.

A better plan would be to just put a sole leather ring around the end of the handle. I would rather just leave the end of the handle alone,though. Cherry will be fine for a handle.

[Chet R Parks]

Marty, can I ask how you got the old handles off the Veritas bench chisels? I understand there epoxied on.
Thanks, Chet

[Marty Schlosser]

Chet,

It wasn't that difficult. I split them first down the centreline, then chunked away to get the wood and glue out of the ferrule and from around the tang.

Took all of about 5 minutes, then it was on to mounting the new ones I'd made, which I also epoxied into place. So far they're held up, but again, I'm not doing much hammering on them. Whick remindes me, I still need to make myself a decent mallet. Gotta find one of those round-tuits...

[Chet R Parks]

Thanks Marty, I've been reluctant to try resizing/replacing Veritas bench chisel handles because of the epoxy.
Chet

[lowell holmes]

I would not put any inserts into the end of your handles. The bloodwood one is too short,and bloodwood is very brittle,and will soon crack under hammer or mallet blows. The brass one will spread out with the pounding,and MIGHT crack the handle as it spreads.

I'm not absolutely certain if the brass will spread enough to crack the wood,but over time and pounding,it very well may.

A better plan would be to just put a sole leather ring around the end of the handle. I would rather just leave the end of the handle alone,though. Cherry will be fine for a handle.

George,
Do you pound on your bench chisels?

I quit doing that. I do have some old beaters that I will pound on. For the most part, I have mortise chisels to beat on.

Paul Sellers taught how to make mortises with blue handle chisels. They work pretty good with a light mallet.

[allen long]

George gave me the idea to try to get one of these bad boys to fail. I put an Ashley Ilse 5/16 into one of these cherry handles and beat on it like Popeye wailing on Bluto after I eats me spinach.

I took a 1.5" by 1.5" by about 4" hard maple block and banged a through-mortise. By the time I did that the piece was falling apart. So I took the two solid sides of the destroyed mortise, and mortised each of these as seen in the picture below. I then chopped up the remnants.

I used a 12 ounce Wood is Good urethane mallet. It took me a couple of hours of solid pounding. And I was not gentle. I would sink the chisel as deep as I could with each blow. I did not take glancing blows or slices once I got to a certain point. I kept on wailing the fool out of the chisel.
Hogged Wood.jpg

After two or so hours, there was no damage to the end of the chisel handle. I did have to hone the business end of the chisel several ttimes during the beat down. The finish dulled a bit, but so did the finish on the handle where I was holding it. I had not put poly on it yet since I was trying to see if it would fail (no sense in spending the time to coat it with multiple coats if I was going to ruin it) I have included a couple of different views below.

20161031_214926.jpg20161031_214929.jpg

I understand that such a punishing use of the chisels over a longer period might still induce failure or deformation. HOWEVER, that is not how these chisels are supposed to be used (think of my exercise an accelerated life test).

I intend to send a Wood is Good mallet with the chisels and instruct my son on using the chisels for moderate work such as dovetails.

Someone asked about the purpose of the brass dowel. I wanted a signature for each of my modified/reground chisels (such as my fish-tail chisels) and any tools and handles I might make. The blood wood and brass just look nice. I sank the dowel a little further into the handle than the blood wood plug to add a little more strength, but strength was not primary reason or function of the brass. The down and plug are bonded together with epoxy and then the plug assembly is epoxied into the handle.

Next project will be a solid copper dovetail gage and a striking knife with brass, curly maple, blood wood, and a PM-V11 knife tip that are available as replacements for one of Lee Valley's knives.

Many Kind Regards . . . Allen

[Andy Nichols]

Really like the handles, brass does look good, and could be used for balance in certain applications.....

Regards,
Andy
Mos Maiorum

[george wilson]

The urethane mallet helped the handles to not get damaged. Try a hard wood mallet over a period of time.

[Michael L. Martin]

Nice work on the handles. I like the blood wood/brass detail..... looks great. The handles seem to be working for you. I'd go with 'em.