Enter Kutztown, PA. furniture exhibition

[Pete Lamberty]

Hi, I ran across this and thought that some of you might be interested. There is a furniture exhibition at Kutztown University for furniture makers within 125 miles of Kutztown, PA. Go to http://faculty.kutztown.edu/rogers/index.htm Click on the call for artists furniture exhibition window. I think submissions need to be in by April 2004 so you will have lots of time to make something. Pete

[Bill Grumbine]

Hi Pete

I got all excited when I saw your message header, since I live in the greater Kutztown metropolitan area. Then I went to his website. I doubt he would appreciate my furniture any more than I appreciate his. And, since art is subjective, I will refrain from further comment.

Bill

[Pete Lamberty]

Hi Bill, I feel about the same way you do about his furniture. I like things to be at least 50 percent functional. A couple of his students works looked nice. And I liked his ribbonish end table. I posted this just because I thought someone may like to get involved. Pete

Hi Pete

I got all excited when I saw your message header, since I live in the greater Kutztown metropolitan area. Then I went to his website. I doubt he would appreciate my furniture any more than I appreciate his. And, since art is subjective, I will refrain from further comment.

Bill

[Ken Garlock]

My goodness, I saw three items of use for 27 years work: log house, dinette set, and a china cabinet. All you Pa. residents, remember you are paying his salary.

[Dave Anderson NH]

Is that I don't particularly like it. But then what does an ignorant enjinear know about "true art"

Dave- with all my prejudice showing thru

[Von Bickley]

I don't want to say anything bad about a man's work, so I'm going to keep quite about this one.

[Glenn Clabo]

Ya...I can't say it's my cup of tea...or my brand of beer. But I guess that's why there are so many paint colors, eh?

[Kevin Gerstenecker]

I also checked out the link and the photos of the Professors Work. As far as the items displayed go, all I can say is "Alrighty Then". Different, thats for sure!

[Bill Grumbine]

My goodness, I saw three items of use for 27 years work: log house, dinette set, and a china cabinet. All you Pa. residents, remember you are paying his salary.

Now then Ken, there's no need at all to go rubbing salt in the wound. I don't think there is anywhere one can go to get away from these ivory tower academia nuts. They're probably down by you too.

If I want to see stuff like that most recent one, all I have to do is go to downtown Philly to see some drunk lying by a bus stop bench.

Bill

[Pete Lamberty]

Hi, I find it interesting that there have been no positive comments about his work. Maybe the people who like his stuff are afraid to express their opinion. I myself do like some of the things in the 75 to 89 years and a couple in the next group. Maybe we as a group don't try to express our own creativity enough. We as a group don't stretch to see what we can really come up with. We stick to the tried and true. All of us think highly of Sam Maloof, James Krenov, etc, but next to none of us try to emulate their creative approach to the craft. They wouldn't be where they are today if they thought like most of us. Now I don't want you to think that I am sticking up for this university guys work, but I do like to see new imaginative designs. For myself the design process is the most fun. I do notice that there are extremely few posts on the design forum. I guess by everything that I have said, you will realize that I don't think we are artistically progressive enough. That said, let everyone do as they like and enjoy their woodworking. Also I feel that it would be nice for us to let each other know when there are contests or exhibitions to enter. Besides the Kutztown exhibition there is also another exhibition coming up. Go to www.furnituresociety.org and click on the word exhibition in the left side menu. Then on the next page look for the word curvi-ture. Pete

Hi, I ran across this and thought that some of you might be interested. There is a furniture exhibition at Kutztown University for furniture makers within 125 miles of Kutztown, PA. Go to http://faculty.kutztown.edu/rogers/index.htm Click on the call for artists furniture exhibition window. I think submissions need to be in by April 2004 so you will have lots of time to make something. Pete

[Dave Avery]

Pete,

I went to the web site thinking I'd like the stuff - even wanting to like it. But I just couldn't. Most of the guys here aren't reluctant to express an opinion, popular or not.

The reason why so few of us appreciate the work is that all (or almost all) of us build things for function. A chair to sit in, a table to eat at, a bed to sleep in.

A university professor is not going to make a name for himself teaching shaker or A&C design. He HAS to be different. As such, he's in the business of furniture for art's sake, rather than furniture for the sake of function. Just a different business with a different audience. Calling much of the work furniture, however, is a stretch. Dave.

[Bill Grumbine]

Hi Pete

I agree with quite a bit of what you write, but perhaps it does not come through that way. First of all, don't feel bad about posting the link. I think it is appropriate, and at the very least, it has gotten some discussion going beyond "what tool should I buy".

I participate in a number of groups, both regular woodworking and turning, on and off line. I see a lot of stuff all the time, in pictures and in real life. A large part of my creativity consists of fitting a piece of furniture to the needs, space, whatever, of my customers. I like simple clean lines accentuated by highly figured wood. Occasionally I will go for a very minimist look, with spare lines and less figured wood. Right now I am taking a table design that is about 150 years old and updating it to be harmonious with a very contemporary table top.

Beyond creativity though, there is a highly technical aspect to this pursuit. I am firmly of the opinion that a person cannot effectively express their creativity until they gain some degree of mastery over the technical aspects. I see a lot of woodturnings that are butt ugly and worse. Often the person who turns one of these shapes prefaces his or her remarks with the phrase, "I wanted to try this new shape to see how it would look". Well, it looks terrible now, and it looked terrible 4000 years ago when the Chaldeans first tried it out on their lathes, pottery wheels, or whatever. For the same reasons that certain shapes are always winners, certain other shapes are always losers.

There are certian shapes and certain proportions which naturally appeal to the human eye. They are often referred to as classical. These shapes and proportions have endured for thousands of years and across cultural lines, not because of some hidebound group of guildsmen, but because of the nature of our soul and spirit. While these aspects are not carved in stone (so to speak), one cannot stray too far before one gets onto the shaky ground of ugly. Trying to change them, or break them is like trying to calculate the value of pi to be something different than it always is.

So when I talk about mastery of technical aspects of the craft, I am not talking only of good joinery or proper sanding technique, but even more I am talking about an understanding of proportion and shape. Admittedly, I am very conservative in my approach and in my sensibilities, but there is still a wide range of what appeals to me because it fits into general rules of form and function. There are too many people out there who are trying to explore new areas by breaking old and inviolable rules. This guy is one of them. He says so on his website.

I've danced around it up to this point while making my preferences very clear, but I'll come right out and say it. I don't like this guy's work. But, it isn't in my house, and no one is trying to sell it to me. He has every right to make it, and to associate with others who find it attractive. I do not think (except for a very few pieces mentioned already) that his work is very appealing because it has very little in the way of orderly form to it. It represents chaos and dissipation to me, and quite frankly, I find it repugnant. Maybe it is my German ancestry, maybe it is my religious viewpoint. It is probably a large amount of both.

I see an order and a beauty to creation, even when wood is distorted or rotted (to a certain extent). Even in that fallen state, there is order and beauty. For example, I can really appreciate the free form work of Nakashima because he knew how to bring out the beauty of the medium (Now I'm starting to sound like an artist! Where's my clip on ponytail!?!).

When I look around me at creation, I see an order and a symmetry. That symmetry continues down to a subatomic level. There is asymmetry as well, but even then, there is order. When both order and symmetry are violated, the result is repulsive on several levels, not all of them conscious. But they are there in every human being.

There is the old joke that goes, "I may not know art, but I know what I like". I know that a large part of my reaction to this person's work has not only to do with the work itself, but to his vocation. This is going to sound prejudicial (because it is!), but there is probably very little he and I would agree on in any aspect of life you would care to name. However, in addition to being prejudicial, it is also most likely accurate, based on past experience. In the contemporary art world, I would be dismissed as some proletarian hacker for my failure to appreciate the avaunt garde style represented by his efforts. His website says so, although maybe not in so many words. He writes,

"We are looking for new and experimental approaches to form, and materials while maintaining functionality and are especially interested in innovative design realized in non-traditional materials."

A very wise man once wrote, "there is nothing new under the sun", speaking of course, about human nature and our relationship to the creation. "New and experimental approaches to form" is going to mean breaking the rules of what appeals to the human eye and soul, and I am not going there. I choose to spend my time perfecting the skills I have and perfecting my ability to express my creativity in a way that will appeal to as many people as possible.

Two good friends of mine in the turning world who are no longer with us used to get into this discussion with me all the time, and we had some very spirited discussions. In the end it is all opinion, but opinion don't feed the bull dog (unless one is a university professor of art!). Please though, when you come across something like this, post it for the rest of us. Shooting this guy down in flames is no reflection on you.

Bill

[Ken Salisbury]

Hi, I ran across this and thought that some of you might be interested. There is a furniture exhibition at Kutztown University for furniture makers within 125 miles of Kutztown, PA. Go to http://faculty.kutztown.edu/rogers/index.htm Click on the call for artists furniture exhibition window. I think submissions need to be in by April 2004 so you will have lots of time to make something. Pete

WEIRD ! !

I did finally find a piece of what we traditionalists call furniture. in the 1975 - 1989 gallery (which was not specifically dated). I assume this was made prior to the "artist's" admission to the "funny farm".

Of course this is only my personal opinion ! !

I was making plans to go to the "5 Barns" get together in August but I am re-evaluating that decision. I will only go if I have Grumbine's assurance that I will not be required to share a Bud Light with this person (don't want anything to rub off on this 'old man') -- I have enough medical problems now .

[Dave Arbuckle]

Maybe the people who like his stuff are afraid to express their opinion.

Can't imagine why anyone would be afraid. SMC has been a flame-free environment thus far.

I don't dislike his work nearly as much as other opinions that have been expressed here. I think he misses the mark a little. But, I don't tend to evangelize, particularly on furniture style. Everyone gets to have their own taste. Thank goodness, or I'd have to learn to like Mission and Shaker styles.

Dave

[Pete Lamberty]

Hi Dave, I agree with you when you said how you wanted to like the stuff but just couldn't. And I, like you, understand the old saying "form follows function". Bill G. has made some good points about history and reasons for good design in the next post. And I agree with all of you guys or at least most of everything that has been said except for the idea that not one of us (or group of us) can be the one/s that can be the originator of a new movement of design like the shaker style or the arts and crafts style. Although they take into account the historical requirements for good design as Bill listed, these two schools of design were not around two hundred years ago ( please excuse my ignorance on the shaker school of design, I am not sure when it started.) I do think that in the next five hundred years "someone" will come up with a new style of design that will be regarded as highly as the shaker or arts and crafts styles and still use all of the old good design requirements. I just don't see why it can't be you or any one of us (I admit that this is a very lofty ambition). I also don't see why anyone of us or group of us should stifle the will to do so. Even tho Maloof, Krenov, Castell (sp?) aren't complete schools of design, they each have their own style, all fitting into the classic "rules" of good design that Bill has mentioned. I just think that each of us could strive to find our own "style" and should be incouraged to do so. I, myself, really enjoy seeing "new" well designed pieces of furniture that are functional and beautiful. In my opinion, learning the aspects of good design is just as important as learning how to make a tight fitting joint. Even as a begginer slowly learns to handle tools, she/he could be slowly learning the basics of good design. My opinions are certainly coming from the fact that I have been taking architecture classes, just about all of them contain alot of design work. I have really enjoyed this discussion. You and Bill have added greatly to it. Some very humerous remarks have been made. I have actually laughed out loud at some of them. Thanks to all of you who have made posts. I will probably have more opinions to post as you and others add to the discusion. Pete

Pete,

I went to the web site thinking I'd like the stuff - even wanting to like it. But I just couldn't. Most of the guys here aren't reluctant to express an opinion, popular or not.

The reason why so few of us appreciate the work is that all (or almost all) of us build things for function. A chair to sit in, a table to eat at, a bed to sleep in.

A university professor is not going to make a name for himself teaching shaker or A&C design. He HAS to be different. As such, he's in the business of furniture for art's sake, rather than furniture for the sake of function. Just a different business with a different audience. Calling much of the work furniture, however, is a stretch. Dave.