Strategy for applying Arm-R-Seal to long table with waterfall edge

[Brian Hummel]

Debating strategies for applying Arm-R-Seal to a 7ft long Ash table with a 30" waterfall edge with a white oak leg, sanded up to 150 grit. I plan to apply 2 layers of gloss and 1 final layer of satin.

I've read many informative posts here about applying Arm-R-Seal and think that the cloth/blue shop towel method sounds great but for a large surface like a table with a contiguous waterfall edge, would a terry cloth sponge or a handi-paint pad be a better applicators since they will hold more product?

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For large surfaces, I've seen folks pour the Arm-R-Seal into a squeeze bottle for easy application to a terry cloth sponge. Can Arm-R-Seal be shaken within a bottle to mix or will that create bubbles that would be problematic (particularly with satin).

Many folks work the the finish in circular patterns, others work in long lines. I'm trying to determine if I should run the Arm-R-Seal in strokes from one end of the table all the way to the end of the vertical waterfall and back or if that will be too far to go with each stroke.

Any suggestions for the applying Arm-R-Seal to the vertical waterfall edge? The first coat should soak in well since it's open-pored Ash and White Oak so I'm hoping that runs won't be a concern when applied vertically.The table is large and not easy to flip, so I plan to do go through the entire finishing process on the bottom first and then flip and do the top (bad idea for any reason?). This will give me a chance to iron out any kinks, hopefully.

Thank you for your advice!

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[John TenEyck]

I've never used one, but I'd be tempted to go with the stain sponge you are debating. As you said, it will hold a lot of product, and that's what you will need to cover both the top and waterfall side in one shot. I'd do a test on scrap first to make sure it goes on bubble and lint free before committing to it on the project.

As for straight strokes or circular, I've never been able to apply it with a circular pattern and have it end up free of circular patterns after drying. Others claim it's possible. Again, test it on scrap.

Good luck. Nice looking project.

John

[Stan Calow]

IMO, no reason to shake as it doesn't have solids that settle.

[Rob Sack]

IMO, no reason to shake as it doesn't have solids that settle.

This is true for the gloss. But doesn't the satin have flattening agents that can settle to the bottom of the can?

[Brian Hummel]

This is true for the gloss. But doesn't the satin have flattening agents that can settle to the bottom of the can?

Yes, that is the exact concern that I have...I've read that the Satin must be stirred frequently so that the flattening agents remain evenly dispersed, which would reduce potential streaking. So if squeezing Arm-R-Seal from a bottle, I'd want to agitate often but not if bubbles would end up being a problem...which they may not but I was hoping that somebody had direct experience.

[Dave Novak]

I recently finished a 10' x 3' table top. I literally poured the finish straight from the can and then spread it around quickly with half of an old white t-shirt. Then wiped down the length of the top to smooth it out. Turned out perfect.

[John TenEyck]

Yes, that is the exact concern that I have...I've read that the Satin must be stirred frequently so that the flattening agents remain evenly dispersed, which would reduce potential streaking. So if squeezing Arm-R-Seal from a bottle, I'd want to agitate often but not if bubbles would end up being a problem...which they may not but I was hoping that somebody had direct experience.

It takes many hours for the flatters to settle. This will not be a concern during the time it takes to do your workpiece if you stir it just prior to application.

John

[Edwin Santos]

Here's what I do:
Spread the finish briskly with a white synthetic 3M pad. The pads are pretty big, so cut it into quarters. I dip the pad into a container I have poured some finish into, but the squeeze bottle should do find. What I like is the synthetic pads don't steal as much finish as cloth material. Spread in a circular pattern. Then come back and wipe of excess in straight strokes with the grain using a folded blue shop towel.
If you live in a dry climate, you can add a bit of mineral spirits to the Arm R Seal to give yourself a little more working time. You can work in sections. As long as you are working briskly they should blend in well.
Because the coats are so thin, I usually do at least three.

No harm in practicing application methods on a board and getting comfortable before doing your project.

[Rob Sack]

I use Arm-R-Seal on a regular basis. On large surfaces, I will pour on the amount of material I think will cover and use a short nap paint roller to spread it out as evenly as possible and as quickly as possible. Of all the wipe on/ wipe off finishes I have used over years, Arm-R-Seal is among the most difficult to wipe off evenly on large surfaces without streaks. I have found the best way to achieve a streak free finish, is to wipe it off before it starts to set up and keep wiping until there are no streaks. If it stars to set up, re-apply a little more finish and wipe immediately. Another trick I am planning to try next time is a technique I use with spraying lacquer. After the final coat, I sand with 320-400, tack off, and spray on a coat of acetone (can't get lacquer thinner here anymore) mixed with a little lacquer retarder. This softens to surface just enough to blend in the sanding scratches, leaving a smooth scratch free surface. I have a large solid walnut dining table coming up and I am planning to try this out on the table using Arm-R-Seal and this technique. Obviously, this will require the use of spray equipment.

The other option is to treat it more like a varnish and spray on as thin a coat as possible and let it dry. Sand lightly and re-spray. I have done this on several wood tops on storage cabinets in the shop, and it seems to be holding up quite nicely. I have even tried rolling it on and letting it dry without wiping any off. It actually levels out quite nicely and for shop cabinetry, this seems to be the best combination of ease of application and durability. However, I am not so sure I would try this on custom furniture.

[Brian Hummel]

I use Arm-R-Seal on a regular basis. On large surfaces, I will pour on the amount of material I think will cover and use a short nap paint roller to spread it out as evenly as possible and as quickly as possible. Of all the wipe on/ wipe off finishes I have used over years, Arm-R-Seal is among the most difficult to wipe off evenly on large surfaces without streaks. I have found the best way to achieve a streak free finish, is to wipe it off before it starts to set up and keep wiping until there are no streaks.

The paint roller is an interesting idea. Does the Arm-R-Seal need to be wiped off? I see many folks reiterating that it is a "wipe on" finish, meaning that it should be left to settle but I suppose that assumes that you are putting on a perfectly thin coat...if you go heavier, you may need to "wipe off"?

On a large table top, I'd sure prefer to not fuss with it at all after wiping it on the initial pass but I'm not sure if that is how Arm-R-Seal will behave...perfect upon first application.

[Jim Becker]

AFAIK, Arm-R-Seal is a wiping varnish...you leave it on. For application, you can wipe it one with whatever technique is best for the scale of the area you intend to cover. Wipe on finishes "generally" go on in very thin layers so hopefully, that deals with most, if not all, risk of running on the vertical surface. But you do have the option of just working on horizontal surfaces by finishing each face separately and rotating the workpiece to suit. Yes, that might mean getting out the step stool...

[mark mcfarlane]

I am an ARS fanboy. Goes on just about everything I build.

I generally do 5 coats of ARS on horizontal wear surfaces, 3 coats on vertical surfaces.

Prep: Sand, vacuum, compressed air blow, & tack rag. It was amazing to me how much dust comes out of white oak grain with a careful blow along the grain, after vacuuming. I vacuum first just to prevent as much dust as possible from getting in the air, and my lungs.

First coat of ARS is flooded on (poured out of the can on large pieces) and moved around with a foam brush. On large pieces foam brush makes 3 passes: with grain, ~perpendicular to grain, then final pass with the grain, working as fast as I possibly can. On wide pieces I'll do an ~8-12" strip down the entire length of the piece, then the next strip, so the patch transitions are with the grain.

VERY light hand sand with 320 on a cork block between every coat, with grain. Vacuum, compressed air blow, & tack rag between every coat. Tack rag is always done immediately before next coat applied.

Second and third coats are wiped on with a Scott shop towel, liberally.

4th and 5th coats are applied after wringing out the shop towel - i.e. very light coats that dry to touch in 15-20 minutes to minimize dust.

When putting satin over gloss you may or may not need 2 coats of the satin to get an even sheen.

I frequently do satin over semi-gloss. Why? I keep a gallon of semi-gloss ARS in the shop for shop cabinets, drawers,... For 'fine' furniture I prefer the satin look so the last 3 coats are satin. Probably 70% of the ARS I use is used in my first 'flood stage'.

[Rob Sack]

The paint roller is an interesting idea. Does the Arm-R-Seal need to be wiped off? I see many folks reiterating that it is a "wipe on" finish, meaning that it should be left to settle but I suppose that assumes that you are putting on a perfectly thin coat...if you go heavier, you may need to "wipe off"?

On a large table top, I'd sure prefer to not fuss with it at all after wiping it on the initial pass but I'm not sure if that is how Arm-R-Seal will behave...perfect upon first application.

Using a wipe on application method, I have never been able to get a truly streak free, even appearance by just wiping it on and leaving it alone. The only way I have been able to produce a truly streak free result is to use it as a typical wipe on/wipe off finish. This obviously is labor intensive and requires multiple applications, not to mention wiping it off is more difficult than most wipe on/wipe off finishes. Treating it like a varnish works better. I have only used the roller technique on shop storage cabinetry where protection was more important than a perfect furniture quality finish. But in lieu of using spray equipment, I don't see why rolling it on, letting it fully cure followed by block sanding and recoating wouldn't produce satisfactory results.

[Edwin Santos]

The manufacturer of Arm R Seal, General Finishes, has at least two videos on YouTube where their veteran expert demonstrates the application of ARS to large surfaces using a variety of applicators. I know he uses a paint pad applicator, and a terry sponge. In all cases he applies fairly quickly and then wipes off. It's worth a watch.

[mark mcfarlane]

The manufacturer of Arm R Seal, General Finishes, has at least two videos on YouTube where their veteran expert demonstrates the application of ARS to large surfaces using a variety of applicators. I know he uses a paint pad applicator, and a terry sponge. In all cases he applies fairly quickly and then wipes off. It's worth a watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Fb4U9toUrA