Reamalgamation of shellac on wood trim?

[Brit Sherman]

I have a 1919 Craftsman Bungalow with what I think is Douglas fir trim and baseboards and Oak veneer doors. It looks like it was finished with a garnet shellac. I've tried using denatured alcohol and the finish becomes sticky, and actually came off when rubbed with 0000 steel wool (whoops).

Parts of the finish look great, but there are numerous chips, pitting, and orange peel texture that I'd like to repair. I'm going to try reamalgamation with a natural bristle brush, but I'm wondering if there's any prep work or different techniques that might help. The orange peel texture on the sills is very heavy and dull, and I'm worried that I won't be able to smooth this out. Are there any recommendations on how to tint new shellac should I need to strip it and refinish?

20230816_084310.jpg20230816_084237 copy.jpg20230816_084320.jpg20230816_090141.jpg20230816_105314.jpg20230816_105337.jpg

Album of images: https://imgur.com/a/fgCqW8G

[roger wiegand]

Transtint colors work great in shellac, but start with natural garnet shellac (see shellac.net for materials), it may be a pretty good match from the start. If it's heavily alligatored I'd be pretty tempted to take most of it off and apply fresh rather than trying to redissolve thick chunks. You don't need to strip it clean as you're going back with the same finish (good for you!) When I've done this before I've wetted the surface with denatured alcohol or shellac reducer, let it sit for a while, redistribute the shellac by rubbing with steel wool, then applying a coat of new shellac over the top after it dries. That has retained the old color but left a new looking surface, it also evens out the imperfections.

Buy a Grammercy ox hair brush, you will be astonished at how much better it works for shellac than any other brush you've tried.

[John TenEyck]

Yes, it probably was done with what then was called orange shellac, now known as amber shellac. You can try to redissolve and homogenize the surface as you proposed. You could try Restor A Finish if denatured alcohol doesn't work. I doubt you will be able to fill the deep chips with either approach.

The chips can likely be filled with shellac tinted with alcohol soluble dye, like Transtint. Use a small brush to build up however many layers are needed to fill the low spot. Alternatively, you could try using a shellac stick to fill the voids. I've never tried it on a vertical surface, which might be quite a challenge.

The window sill looks really gone. I think you'll have to strip it and start over. It's generally not as bad a job as most fear. Shellac, in particular, strips pretty easily.

John

[Brian Tymchak]

The window sill looks really gone. I think you'll have to strip it and start over.

John

That sill looks like a finish (maybe shellac) was applied over a deteriorated paint. Please take care to test for lead before you strip that.

[Brit Sherman]

Transtint colors work great in shellac, but start with natural garnet shellac (see shellac.net for materials), it may be a pretty good match from the start. If it's heavily alligatored I'd be pretty tempted to take most of it off and apply fresh rather than trying to redissolve thick chunks. You don't need to strip it clean as you're going back with the same finish (good for you!) When I've done this before I've wetted the surface with denatured alcohol or shellac reducer, let it sit for a while, redistribute the shellac by rubbing with steel wool, then applying a coat of new shellac over the top after it dries. That has retained the old color but left a new looking surface, it also evens out the imperfections.

Buy a Grammercy ox hair brush, you will be astonished at how much better it works for shellac than any other brush you've tried.

Thanks so much Roger! Is there any specific product or method you use when stripping? I can continue using denatured alcohol and steel wool but am open to using something else if there's a better way.

[Brit Sherman]

Yes, it probably was done with what then was called orange shellac, now known as amber shellac. You can try to redissolve and homogenize the surface as you proposed. You could try Restor A Finish if denatured alcohol doesn't work. I doubt you will be able to fill the deep chips with either approach.

The chips can likely be filled with shellac tinted with alcohol soluble dye, like Transtint. Use a small brush to build up however many layers are needed to fill the low spot. Alternatively, you could try using a shellac stick to fill the voids. I've never tried it on a vertical surface, which might be quite a challenge.

The window sill looks really gone. I think you'll have to strip it and start over. It's generally not as bad a job as most fear. Shellac, in particular, strips pretty easily.

John

Thanks so much for the great advice. I'm debating just stripping all the woodwork and re-applying shellac, which would allow me to make repairs to the wood underneath. I've tried to reconstitute the finish again today and even with a brush, the finish is just sliding off. Restor-A-Finish hasn't worked very well either. I looked through the Transtint colors and I think I can get something close to the dark finish.

Do you have a recommendation for a brand of stripper or a technique to remove shellac?

[Brit Sherman]

That sill looks like a finish (maybe shellac) was applied over a deteriorated paint. Please take care to test for lead before you strip that.

That's a great point - I'll buy a test kit just to be safe. I think the wood is so sun damaged and aged that it looks like it's a worn down brown paint. I can't imagine that anyone would've painted just one window casing, but you never know.

[roger wiegand]

I use the Mohawk shellac reducer, which is primarily ethanol and a consistent product. The formulations of denatured alcohol (now labeled as "fuel") changes over time and may contain methanol, which I'd just as soon not breathe so much of. It's a lot more expensive, but I only use a gallon or two a year. I do use the "fuel" DNA for washing out my brushes.

[John TenEyck]

That sill looks like a finish (maybe shellac) was applied over a deteriorated paint. Please take care to test for lead before you strip that.

Stripping is the safest way I know of to remove lead based paint.

John

[John TenEyck]

Thanks so much for the great advice. I'm debating just stripping all the woodwork and re-applying shellac, which would allow me to make repairs to the wood underneath. I've tried to reconstitute the finish again today and even with a brush, the finish is just sliding off. Restor-A-Finish hasn't worked very well either. I looked through the Transtint colors and I think I can get something close to the dark finish.

Do you have a recommendation for a brand of stripper or a technique to remove shellac?

Since my go to stripper was removed from the market (KleanStrip Premium) I'm at a loss as to what product to recommend. Sorry.

If a brush with alcohol has no effect on the finish then it's probably not shellac; rather, it's more likely varnish. Aged varnish looks exactly like what you have color wise, and structure wise like the stuff on the window sill. The only way to deal with that is to strip it or sand it off. The good news is there's no lead in varnish.

John

[Rich Engelhardt]

Since my go to stripper was removed from the market (KleanStrip Premium) I'm at a loss as to what product to recommend. Sorry.

If a brush with alcohol has no effect on the finish then it's probably not shellac; rather, it's more likely varnish. Aged varnish looks exactly like what you have color wise, and structure wise like the stuff on the window sill. The only way to deal with that is to strip it or sand it off. The good news is there's no lead in varnish.

John

You have to be careful with old clear finishes.
Older varnish may have lead in it. Japan dryer used to have a ton of lead in it.
Some of it still does, even today you can find original formula Japan Drier w/10% lead in it.

The common myth of all the lead being removed from paints/coatings in 1978 isn't 100% true.

Sherwin Williams continued to sell paints with lead well into the 1990s. Granted, they were intended mostly for industrial use, but, there was no fool proof method of insuring that would be the case.
Anyone could go into one of their stores and pick up a gallon of red hi-gloss oil based enamel and use it somewhere they shouldn't. Japan drier continued to have lead