Monopolistic wood prices

[Pat Germain]

Sorry, Bert, but you and I ain't the customer base they are targeting. Heck, they don't mind us but they don't really want us. They are going for the Pro customers.

The ones that buy a unit of ply, not 4 sheets. The ones who understand what lumber is and how it works, and take the first 50 pieces off the top of the unit, not sorting through 50 to find the 3 that meet our standards. The wane and the knots don't matter to them. They can cut around it for header stock, or window sill cripples, or doorway jack studs, if they need to.

The $15,000 per week people, not the $150 every 3 months people. Both consume the same amount of employee time.

And 7-4 are the hours their customers work. Buying materials is part of their customers' job, not their after-hours hobby like you and me.

I think both points are accurate and relevant:

- I typically can't buy from a local business which is only open during my working hours

- When local businesses go belly-up, they almost always complain the community didn't support them, big box stores put them out of business, etc. Well, if you're only open when I'm working, how am I supposed to support you? You can't completely ignore the general public customer then complain the general public customer doesn't support you

- I order from Amazon a LOT. I'm not necessarily looking for the best price. Rather, I'm looking for something which is in stock and will be on my porch in a couple of days. And I almost always get free shipping. If I order from other online vendors, it's going to take longer to get and I'm going to pay shipping. If I go to a local, brick and mortar store, they're not open or they don't have what I want in stock

[Bert McMahan]

Sorry, Bert, but you and I ain't the customer base they are targeting. Heck, they don't mind us but they don't really want us. They are going for the Pro customers.

The ones that buy a unit of ply, not 4 sheets. The ones who understand what lumber is and how it works, and take the first 50 pieces off the top of the unit, not sorting through 50 to find the 3 that meet our standards. The wane and the knots don't matter to them. They can cut around it for header stock, or window sill cripples, or doorway jack studs, if they need to.

The $15,000 per week people, not the $150 every 3 months people. Both consume the same amount of employee time.

And 7-4 are the hours their customers work. Buying materials is part of their customers' job, not their after-hours hobby like you and me.

Yeah I know, I was just replying to Darrell's point that they trained the public to think they're cheaper. I think that's partly true but it's also because the local lunberyards basically don't want "the public" in there at all, like you said. It's a bummer but of course I understand. $150 every few months just ain't worth it.

[Kent A Bathurst]

I think both points are accurate and relevant:

- I typically can't buy from a local business which is only open during my working hours

- When local businesses go belly-up, they almost always complain the community didn't support them, big box stores put them out of business, etc. Well, if you're only open when I'm working, how am I supposed to support you?

Again, the "pro yard" people don't really care much about my business or yours. They'll certainly take it, but won't restructure their strategy to get it. They are there for the professionals. They are open the hours their customers want them to be open. The last thing they want is the expense of longer hours and going head-to-head in that time period with the BORG - they will lose that fight. The trade-off is focusing on what the professionals want, in particular items the BORG doesn't carry.

Including quality of a given product. Buyer beware of lower cost walnut plywood at Menards - you get what you pay for. $15 Chianti and $115 Tignanello are both Italian red wines.

[Michael Burnside]

Again, the "pro yard" people don't really care much about my business or yours. They'll certainly take it, but won't restructure their strategy to get it. They are there for the professionals. They are open the hours their customers want them to be open. The last thing they want is the expense of longer hours and going head-to-head in that time period with the BORG - they will lose that fight. The trade-off is focusing on what the professionals want, in particular items the BORG doesn't carry.

Including quality of a given product. Buyer beware of lower cost walnut plywood at Menards - you get what you pay for. $15 Chianti and $115 Tignanello are both Italian red wines.

Not saying you're wrong generally, but I will say the two local "pro yards" I go to in the Norther Colorado area are quite accommodating to hobbyists of the caliber that frequent these forums. It's true their hours suck, but both places I buy from are open Saturday mornings until noon-ish. The other alternatives are Rockler and Woodcraft (around here). IMHO Woodcraft, at least in Denver, runs a little to lean on choices, but in a pinch Rockler works too. When prices were outrageous, my local Rockler kept selling Walnut for what they purchased it for until they ran out. A testament to an honest business.

I really only build fine furniture and CNC projects, so I've probably only purchased a handful of MDF/Ply sheets from the local big-box stores. I can't say how they compare price wise as the quality/variety, even with sheet goods, I see is generally lacking so I just don't use them.

[Kent A Bathurst]

No blanket generalization survives the first mortar shell

You've got a couple winners there. I've got a pro's pro lumber operation who is open Sat mornings who acts the same way. Elite materials and service.

[Darrell Bade]

I thought the blue and orange borgs catered to pros, half the spaces on the one end are marked Pro Parking only 🙃. Guess I'm a pro, I park there anyway 🤣.

[Doug Garson]

Amazon's success is not based on best prices it's convenience. Sit on your coach and search for it online and if you have Prime get it delivered for free in a couple days or drive around to a bunch of bricks and mortar stores hoping to find it. Big box stores are also convenience, pick up lumber, fasteners, paint, a tool, new microwave, some electrical boxes and wire and a new kitchen sink all in the same trip in air conditioned comfort at ten o'clock at night on a Sunday.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Yes - that's the marketing arm hard at work.

They get their share, but they don't carry the product line that the other flavor does, which is how I got into this conversation. Also, Joe Regular Homeowner is comforted to know he is shopping where the Pros shop. That must mean there is quality down every aisle, right? Like the store brand paints, etc. And a parking spot to boot.

And they can stock you up for a half mile of pressure treated fence, no problem - that's also in the pro category.

[Pat Germain]

Again, the "pro yard" people don't really care much about my business or yours. They'll certainly take it, but won't restructure their strategy to get it. They are there for the professionals. They are open the hours their customers want them to be open. The last thing they want is the expense of longer hours and going head-to-head in that time period with the BORG - they will lose that fight. The trade-off is focusing on what the professionals want, in particular items the BORG doesn't carry.

Including quality of a given product. Buyer beware of lower cost walnut plywood at Menards - you get what you pay for. $15 Chianti and $115 Tignanello are both Italian red wines.

I agree most pro lumber yards aren't interested in typical consumer customers. But they better not complain about the community not supporting them if they go belly-up.

It would be refreshing to hear a failed business owner acknowledge the real reasons for the failure: "Our management is inept, our hours suck and our selection is minimal. I'm surprised we lasted as long as we did."

[Curt Harms]

Yeah I know, I was just replying to Darrell's point that they trained the public to think they're cheaper. I think that's partly true but it's also because the local lunberyards basically don't want "the public" in there at all, like you said. It's a bummer but of course I understand. $150 every few months just ain't worth it.

But then don't complain about the lack of public support.