Some electric cars have a road trip problem.

[Patty Hann]

Agreed, I also buy used and keep them until they are no longer reliable or my needs change. I parted with my 1976 280Z in about 1988 when I needed an SUV. I'm currently driving a 2009 Murano, I considered trading it last fall to get a more efficient hybrid with some of the new safety and convenience features. Both the new and used car market was so overpriced that I'm still driving the Murano. So I'm not suggesting you get rid of a perfectly good car. But, when it is time to get a new (used) car, I think your financial adviser would agree, the smarter thing to do is consider the lifetime ownership cost not just the off the lot cost when deciding what to buy. The CR report found that most EVs both new and used, have lower 5 year ownership costs than comparable ICE vehicles.

We shall see...when the time comes.

Honestly, I'm not anti-tech....I worked as a tech (mainly electronics) for 40 years, and 25 of those years in a calibration lab
(this is one type of equipment I used: Rohde and Schwarz )
I'm all for efficient renewable energy... I'd just like it to be fusion produced, is all .
Right now it's just a lot of stumbling around, trying to see what works and what doesn't and the efficiency, cost etc.
When they iron out MOST of the bugs (and if I'm still around) I'll see about changing from an ICE.

[Bill Dufour]

On top the EV would have been through the same tire wise or more as they go through tires more at least based on what I read[/QUOTE]
I understand the tire wear issue is mainly because of the way people drive a BEV. There is little engine and transmisson noise to warn the driver they are accelerating so fast. This means many get tire miles about equal to a supercar like a Ferrari because they are driving like one.
Zero to 60 in 3.56 seconds for a four door sedan? A Ferrari from several years ago is considered super fast at zero to 60 in six seconds. No wonder Teslas burn out tires with 670 to 1,020 horsepower while ferraris have only 615 to barely 800 horsepower.
Bil lD

[roger wiegand]

Are we to conclude from this that Ford, GM, Chryslers, Toyota, etc have never disappointed a customer with a poor warranty/service decision?

Local guinea pig (Scottsdale AZ)

SCOTTSDALE, AZ (3TV/CBS 5) — A Scottsdale woman brought her Tesla in for repairs. When she got the car back, a key system no longer worked and she couldn’t get Tesla to fix the problem. That’s when she called in On Your Side.**

Erine Erickson loves her Tesla Model 3. But these days, the EV stays parked in her garage. “It’s, you know, 3,000 pounds of metal in a parking spot downstairs,” she said.
Erickson’s problem started last month when the battery on her Tesla died. She took it to Tesla, and they replaced the battery for free under their warranty. However, during the process, Tesla technicians turned off the key feature that allows Tesla drivers to supercharge their vehicles in 15 minutes. Erickson says she didn’t find out until she stopped at a supercharger station and could not charge her Tesla. “That’s when people saw me and came up to me and people were trying to troubleshoot it,” she said. “But nobody had ever seen anything like it.”
Turns out, Tesla had intentionally deactivated Erickson’s supercharger feature for safety reasons. Here’s why. When replacing Erickson’s battery, Tesla says they discovered that Carfax listed her car as having a salvaged title due to being totaled in a collision. As a result, Tesla removed the supercharger feature as a safety precaution.

If my car were [mistakenly] listed as "totaled", I'm pretty sure I'd still be able to buy gas for it.

**local TV station that "advocates" for consumers with businesses that are reluctant, slow, or truculent in dealing with customer complaints.
So her ($40K? $50K) EV is unusable for a month, and only when she publicly shames Tesla does Tesla act to investigate the problem.

[Brian Runau]

I'm at about 14,000 miles of electric car travel which includes three 1500-2000 mile road trips. Charging has been a complete non-issue. Quick and convenient. This contrasts sharply to traveling with my F350 diesel and 24 ft trailer, where virtually every trip has drama related to finding a diesel-selling station that I can get my rig into every 210-220 miles.

Methinks these "news" stories about the difficulty of recharging electrics are carefully placed by entities with a vested interest in discouraging the transition. They just don't square with reality-- just as my tales of woe in buying diesel fuel don't square with what most truckers experience. Of course I wouldn't have those range anxiety problems either if Ford had deigned to give me a fuel tank bigger than a teapot.

Roger, how do you manage this when you drive father than the full charge on the batteries in a give day on a road trip? My wife and want to go electric, but being retired we rely on the one car for out of town trips, so.... Thanks brian

[Alan Lightstone]

On top the EV would have been through the same tire wise or more as they go through tires more at least based on what I read
I understand the tire wear issue is mainly because of the way people drive a BEV. There is little engine and transmisson noise to warn the driver they are accelerating so fast. This means many get tire miles about equal to a supercar like a Ferrari because they are driving like one.
Zero to 60 in 3.56 seconds for a four door sedan? A Ferrari from several years ago is considered super fast at zero to 60 in six seconds. No wonder Teslas burn out tires with 670 to 1,020 horsepower while ferraris have only 615 to barely 800 horsepower.
Bil lD

I agree that tire wear is high on Teslas. But I don't find it any different than it was on the many Lexus sedans that I had. I can see this on heavy cars like the Model S and the Lexus LS460. But on a Model 3?

I haven't seen a Tesla spinning its tires and burning rubber on the road, so I don't think that's it. And mine goes 0-60 in 2.3 seconds or less, which is stupid fast and potentially dangerous. It actually accelerates faster than a Formula 1 car (2.6 sec as they are more tuned for high end speed). On my last Tesla Model S with Ludicrous mode when you floored it you almost passed out. So not sure how making it quicker is safe. On my new quicker one would I actually pass out???? Needless to say, never floored this one.

[Patty Hann]

Are we to conclude from this that Ford, GM, Chryslers, Toyota, etc have never disappointed a customer with a poor warranty/service decision?

Let's agree to disagree on this.... you buy your EV and I'll buy my ICEV.

[Jim Becker]

my saturn cost 2k, five years later and 76,000 kilos with tires and brakes and stabilizer links I have 3k into it. Gas averages 38 MPG canadian galons summer less in the winter. If i had bough an EV id pay some large amount of money, more in tax than I paid for the saturn and I could sell it tomorrow for 2k but wouldnt as the money saved put more machines in my shop.

Cost is more than just operating costs. On top the EV would have been through the same tire wise or more as they go through tires more at least based on what I read

No question, for the metrics of your specific vehicle purchase choice, the numbers were in your favor. But that doesn't represent the market that EVs are trying to get into, at least for the foreseeable future. Folks who prefer lower cost, older, pre-owned are a different market. And just to be clear, it's a valid one for sure.

I absolutely agree with you about cost being more than operating costs. Everyone needs to weight that as part of their decision, even if their primary reason for choosing an electric vehicle isn't financial. That would be me, honestly, and my next vehicle likely will be an EV. The only reason I haven't bought one to-date is the general dearth of what I want in a vehicle being available in the marketplace that doesn't have the name Tesla on it.

[roger wiegand]

Roger, how do you manage this when you drive father than the full charge on the batteries in a give day on a road trip? My wife and want to go electric, but being retired we rely on the one car for out of town trips, so.... Thanks brian

Speaking only for Teslas, since I don't have experience with others. The navigation system in the car knows both where all the chargers are and how busy they are. You put in your destination and it plots a route that takes into account traffic, weather conditions (eg for less range in cold temperatures or driving into high winds), and elevation changes as well as your current state of charge and your driving history in terms of how many watt-hours/mile you typically consume for a given type of driving (city vs highway). In my experience it works very well and the predictions are accurate to 2-3%.

A third party program, A Better Route Planner, will do all of this for any electric car, with a lot more control than Tesla offers-- eg you can tell it you never want to go below 15% charge, or that you want to arrive at your destination with 40%. It will also factor in how heavily your car is loaded. I have used it to supplement the Tesla software sometimes, for example when I want to show up at my sister's house (no charger) with 50% in the tank. More often now I just add more than it asks for at my last stop or manually add a stop at the charger closest to her house. You can try ABRP online for free to see what the routing looks like for different cars, when you have an account it tracks your personal usage trends to map the routes. The Tesla software picks non-Tesla chargers only as a last resort, in ABRP you can prioritize your favorite charging networks.

In looking for an EV I'd suggest that charging speed is right up there with range as a concern for long trips. My car takes about 20 minutes to charge from 15-20% to 70-80%, which typically is the most time efficient way to charge (10 to 80 takes about the same amount of time as 80 to 100 because of the nature of the battery chemistry) That's about how long I need to get the kinks out between stints of driving-- roughly every 200 miles/ three hours. If this charging took 40 minutes (as it did in some other cars we looked at two years ago) that would begin to get tedious.

[Brian Runau]

Speaking only for Teslas, since I don't have experience with others. The navigation system in the car knows both where all the chargers are and how busy they are. You put in your destination and it plots a route that takes into account traffic, weather conditions (eg for less range in cold temperatures or driving into high winds), and elevation changes as well as your current state of charge and your driving history in terms of how many watt-hours/mile you typically consume for a given type of driving (city vs highway). In my experience it works very well and the predictions are accurate to 2-3%.

A third party program, A Better Route Planner, will do all of this for any electric car, with a lot more control than Tesla offers-- eg you can tell it you never want to go below 15% charge, or that you want to arrive at your destination with 40%. It will also factor in how heavily your car is loaded. I have used it to supplement the Tesla software sometimes, for example when I want to show up at my sister's house (no charger) with 50% in the tank. More often now I just add more than it asks for at my last stop or manually add a stop at the charger closest to her house. You can try ABRP online for free to see what the routing looks like for different cars, when you have an account it tracks your personal usage trends to map the routes. The Tesla software picks non-Tesla chargers only as a last resort, in ABRP you can prioritize your favorite charging networks.

In looking for an EV I'd suggest that charging speed is right up there with range as a concern for long trips. My car takes about 20 minutes to charge from 15-20% to 70-80%, which typically is the most time efficient way to charge (10 to 80 takes about the same amount of time as 80 to 100 because of the nature of the battery chemistry) That's about how long I need to get the kinks out between stints of driving-- roughly every 200 miles/ three hours. If this charging took 40 minutes (as it did in some other cars we looked at two years ago) that would begin to get tedious.

Thanks for the education. Brian

[Rick Potter]

About that woman in AZ that has the Tesla that won't Supercharge (charge at a Tesla Supercharger), that sounds to me like she got ripped off by a used car dealer on a totaled and 'fixed up' car.

With all the talk of electric cars burning up on every street corner, I can understand why Tesla would not allow it to be charged on their chargers. If there was a problem it would be assumed Tesla was at fault, when in fact it would be the person who sold a totaled car to an unsuspecting person. Do you really think ANY manufacturer would take on that extra responsibility? I don't.

I wonder if the car will still charge on lower powered chargers? She should be going after the guy who sold her an unusable car, not Tesla.

Too bad we don't have 'The rest of the story'.

[Edwin Santos]

Our family is a recent newcomer to the EV club having recently bought a Tesla Model Y. I have to say it's been a fascinating experience.
The purchase of the car was completely frictionless. I think we interacted with only one live human being the whole time, and that was only when taking delivery and for about 10 minutes. I asked the guy, what's the next step. He said drive away.

Yes, it cost some money to get the charger put in the garage, but on base I don't think a comparable new ICE vehicle would have cost much less in today's market.

One unexpected feature that I don't see being discussed much is my wife's perceived safety and security benefit of charging at home in lieu of going to a gas station. For years she has felt gas stations are magnets for creepy characters. She's been catcalled before, witnessed fights, encountered drunk people. So the idea of never going to a gas station again is just fine with her.

Another benefit is the regenerative braking. I think the whole idea and use of physics is brilliant. It takes a day to get used to it, but once I did, I wouldn't want to go back.

[Jerome Stanek]

Peak power on my solar array is in theory 31.6kW. In practice, I never reach more than 24kW. It's a big array. I don't pay for electricity, they pay me for surplus.

My car charges at 48amps (11.5kW) and easily charges in a few hours. No batteries, and no off-grid power, as cost, as you said is crazy for that now. And Tesla's new Powerwall+ doesn't increase capacity (just charging rate), so that was a big thumbs down, unfortunately. One Powerwall can easily charge a car, but leaves very little if any for the rest of the house while doing that off-grid. The vast majority of people won't be off-grid, though.

Your in an area that gets plenty of sun year round what about the people that live in the north. Hard to charge or sell back electric if there is none there.

[roger wiegand]

Your in an area that gets plenty of sun year round what about the people that live in the north. Hard to charge or sell back electric if there is none there.

Clearly if you live in Alaska you need a different solution, at least in the winter time. That doesn't negate the utility of the technology for the other 99% of the population. Solar PV works quite effectively in New England, if that's what you're thinking of as "north". Conveniently it produces more power in summer when the air conditioning makes for the highest bills of the year.

[Alan Lightstone]

Your in an area that gets plenty of sun year round what about the people that live in the north. Hard to charge or sell back electric if there is none there.

Agreed. But I was pretty impressed with the number of houses with solar panels I saw on a recent trip to Boston / Maine.

[Ron Selzer]

Guy I work with had a new roof and solar panels installed, west side of Columbus area about a year ago. So far he is running a surplus of electricity. Keeps the house at 68 in the summer. 1600+- sq ft 2 story, lives by himself. I have been after him to buy some electric milk house heaters and use them for heat in the winter. Just keep adding until his electric usage becomes more equal in the winter.
Ron