K3 delivery and placement

[Todd Zucker]

Steve Wurster kindly posted photos of his workshop showing how he fit the K3 in a shop that had similar equipment to mine.

Based on that and some other posters' comments, I went with the K3, outrigger and 78" slider. I have the Felder technician coming December 26 to calibrate, so I need to make sure it is in its final home.

I figured I would post some photos to help others considering a slider think about space and delivery requirements and invite any comments on placement.

The delivery went smoothly, except the carrier put the Hammer pallet, which was in good shape, on top of a smaller pallet, requiring a ramp with an 8" drop instead of 4".
crate on crate.jpg

After over-thinking how to get it off the pallets, I installed the Hammer mobility kit and then raised one end of the Hammer pallet and got it to slide so that it was angled toward the floor on one end and then laid down two 2' x 8' sheets of 3/4" baltic birch plywood (rip cut it to fit into my SUV) and stacked some 2x4s from the Hammer crate (and some other random pieces) to support the ramp at about 18" spans. No screws into the supports. I had about 100 screws from the Hammer pallet and used 4 of them to screw the end of the plywood to the 2x4s under the end of the pallet. There were a couple of 3/4" steps from the pallet to the floor, but no problem with the mobility kit.
Top of pallet.jpg

Much easier than it looked. it took about a minute to get the machine on the garage floor.

Bottom of ramp.jpg

The garage is about 20' wide. I moved pretty much everything out of the way to see where it should go. I moved the Roubo into the dog room, moved the chop saw out of the house, along with the drum sander, and moved the Festool MFT out of the way. Then tried every configuration I could think of to get the hoses of the remaining machines close to the G700 dust collector outlet. I would not have thought to angle the machine, but a post from Jim B made this look like a good option. Here is what I came up with for one side of the garage. I thought about using the router table as an outfeed, but it was too tall and seemed like a pain to remove the fence and dust collection hose to use the saw table.

From kitchen door.jpg

The space between the K3 and the band saw looks a little tight, but it is actually roomy, and with the different surface heights, I don't think it is a problem. The other side still has the Festool MFT and a couple of Festool cabinets that I think I am going to break down and make shorter and move underneath the right side of the K3. Not the prettiest arrangement, but workable.

Festool view.jpg

Still trying to figure out how to configure the vacuum to the 50mm port above the table, but probably going to do some kind of run of the smaller hose from the wall or the slat wall with a support arm.

Wide view.jpg


Anyone have any suggestions on placement? Having the thing positioned at an angle lets me keep most of the other machines against the perimeter and close to the dust collector, with a clear area for a temporary assembly table and room to put large plywood pieces on the outrigger. But I haven't used it yet.

There have been a number of comments on whether to get the shorter slider. For me, I mostly build smaller furniture. But it fits, and I think it is going to be useful, as I do intend to use sheet goods.

[Jim Becker]

That worked out nicely, Todd! There are some folks who scoff at the idea of angling a machine away from the wall planes, but it really can be a big problem solver relative to workflow and reducing or eliminating infeed/outfeed interference along with surface height considerations. I like that you have a high ceiling in that garage space, too. Aside from certain practical things relative to woodworking activities and storage (such as vertical storage) it makes the whole space feel much larger, too.

[Steve Wurster]

It looks good! Great job on getting that K3 off the pallet. The space between the K3 and the router table looks a little tight, but I'm sure that can easily be moved out of the way when needed.

[Mike Wilkins]

Congrats on the new toy. It is always an adventure figuring out how to move a heavy machine from a pallet to its final resting place. Felder/Hammer does a great job packing their machines. My F3 shaper was on a pallet with boxing all around, sitting on another pallet. And they were nice enough to build the packaging with lots of Torx screws, most of which I still have.

[Michael Burnside]

Looks great. I have my cabinet saw at a slight angle and it works great. No rules say you can't do it, especially if it helps with workflow. I'd much rather have a tool at an angle that I don't have to move as opposed to something with casters. About the only thing you're missing is an outfeed of sorts that will support longer boards. Maybe sliders don't need an outfeed?

[Jim Becker]

Michael, depending on what one is cutting dimensionally, some form of outfeed support might be required to handle the cut/offcut that's to the right of the blade on a slider. A long rip of sheet stock, for example. I use portable stands for that which means the rest of the time, no space is consumed. But now that I have the big support table for flattening, I tend to throw a whole sheet of something on there and do a long rip with my tracksaw...it's been a long time since I needed to use any aux support with my slider. (also a short stroke like the OP, but that "other" brand)

[Steve Wurster]

Looks great. I have my cabinet saw at a slight angle and it works great. No rules say you can't do it, especially if it helps with workflow. I'd much rather have a tool at an angle that I don't have to move as opposed to something with casters. About the only thing you're missing is an outfeed of sorts that will support longer boards. Maybe sliders don't need an outfeed?

Sliders don't "need" an outfeed in the same way that they are used / needed on cabinet and similar saws. For most cuts done on a slider you want the "keeper" to be on the sliding table and therefore it stays supported the entire time. You will want an outfeed of some sort when doing something like cutting a long piece of plywood, and even with the K3 having only a 78" sliding table you could still end up with most of the cutoff piece hanging off the back of the saw. I have the short Hammer extension (400mm long, Felder part number 500-101) installed on the back of my K3 just for this purpose. If I have to rip something even longer that can't be done via the sliding table then I just setup an outfeed stand.

[Todd Zucker]

I did get a lifetime supply of the Torx screws when I took apart the crate.

Jim, the high ceilings are great except when I need to change the fluorescent light bulbs.

For outfeed, I might try using the infeed extension currently installed on the A3 just to see if it is worth buying another one to keep them on both machines. I think they are the same. But I also have a Bora adjustable conveyor roller unit that could work. Another option is to build a shortage cabinet on the rear side of the table that would work as outfeed support. I have a bunch of systainers in cabinets hanging on the wall but would prefer to have them at ground level, and there is a lot of empty space under the table saw.

One thing i overlooked was that the micro adjuster that attaches to the cast iron fence i ordered is a separate option that I did not order. I am not sure if I will really need it. Still reading everything I can find in these threads to figure out how to use the machine.

i ordered a Ridge Carbide dado set and a scoring blade, and I got a Felder silent power 10” combination blade. I am trying to decide whether to get one or more 10” or 12” dedicated blades for ripping or cross cuts. The owners manual says to use the smallest blade for greater accuracy, but a number of posts here have suggested using the 12” blades when not using the scoring function as the cut is better.

One other thing to decide is which F&F jig to build. Lots of helpful posts on those.

[Jim Becker]

Well...you can replace the fluorescent tube fixtures with LED "one time" and have more light that generally lasts many years longer than the older formats. All my shop lighting for my 24x36 shop cost me a grand total of... $280. (link) "Surface of the sun" lighting is really nice in the shop and it uses less electricity, too.

[Ron Selzer]

LED lighting is a great thing. I replaced all the fluorescent lighting in my shop.
At work we have problems with LED lighting and have to replace driver boards, most of the time. Lighting is 3 years old and have been dealing with this since buildings were build/rehabbed.
Ron

[Steve Wurster]

For outfeed, I might try using the infeed extension currently installed on the A3 just to see if it is worth buying another one to keep them on both machines. I think they are the same.

They are the same, but of course if you want a second set then you need to buy the extension *and* the mounting bracket.

One thing i overlooked was that the micro adjuster that attaches to the cast iron fence i ordered is a separate option that I did not order. I am not sure if I will really need it. Still reading everything I can find in these threads to figure out how to use the machine.

I have the micro adjuster on mine and I like it. I had them install it at the Felder office in Delaware, as having it installed in Austria would have meant an even longer delay (since it would be a custom build), and installing it yourself after the fact is apparently annoying due to the not-so-great instructions. The Delaware guys just charged me a labor fee, which I was happy to pay.

I ordered a Ridge Carbide dado set and a scoring blade, and I got a Felder silent power 10” combination blade.

I hope you got a 6" dado set, as you cannot use an 8" set on the K3 due to how its designed. The scoring blade came with my K3, although the shims for it were missing so I had to reach back out to my salesman to get them to send those to me. I run with Felder blades; mostly 10" just because.

[Cameron Wood]

+1 on angling the machine. Lay out for the largest material that will be cut i.e. 4x8 sheets, long stock 18-20'.

[Michael Burnside]

Well...you can replace the fluorescent tube fixtures with LED "one time" and have more light that generally lasts many years longer than the older formats. All my shop lighting for my 24x36 shop cost me a grand total of... $280. (link) "Surface of the sun" lighting is really nice in the shop and it uses less electricity, too.

Dang you Jim! I need a few LEDs for my utility shed and I just went ahead and ordered the 4ft versions of these because you can vouch for them. Ya'll spending my money this close to xmas is not cool!

Sliders don't "need" an outfeed in the same way that they are used / needed on cabinet and similar saws. For most cuts done on a slider you want the "keeper" to be on the sliding table and therefore it stays supported the entire time. You will want an outfeed of some sort when doing something like cutting a long piece of plywood, and even with the K3 having only a 78" sliding table you could still end up with most of the cutoff piece hanging off the back of the saw. I have the short Hammer extension (400mm long, Felder part number 500-101) installed on the back of my K3 just for this purpose. If I have to rip something even longer that can't be done via the sliding table then I just setup an outfeed stand.

Thanks for the clarification Steve. I figured it was a bit less straightforward in that sometimes you might need it and other times, not necessary.

[Dan Barber]

Well...you can replace the fluorescent tube fixtures with LED "one time" and have more light that generally lasts many years longer than the older formats. All my shop lighting for my 24x36 shop cost me a grand total of... $280. (link) "Surface of the sun" lighting is really nice in the shop and it uses less electricity, too.

I've got those exact lights in the 2 car garage - temporary shop. When the new shop gets built, I'll use them again.

[Jim Becker]

Yea, I added a couple 4'-ers to the backyard shed once I finally completed hooking in the electric to it from the shop. I used the 8 footers in the shop and even with the 10' ceiling, the light is awesome. These are the same lamps that Matt Cremona has used in his shops which is how I learned about them