[OP]
Member
Hello. My son and I are building him a headboard out of birch. I'm looking for a clear finish that is as water resistant as possible (glass of water bedside nightly) that will highlight the wood and not amber
I know I can use WB poly, but I've also read about ceramic finishes and hard wax oils like Rubio monocoat.
Any advice is appreciated.
Member
Aside from water-based polyurethane, you can opt for conversion varnish, hard wax oil (I've used ones from Rubio Monocoat and Osmo and they apply easily with low odor compared to varnish/lacquer), or shellac.
I'd probably try a water-based poly or hard wax oil for the bedhead application. You can also test samples first, as birch can have varied coloring.
Contributor
In my experience, all oil-borne finishes are amber colored. Waterborne finishes are uncolored unless the manufacturer adds pigments. I use waterborne acrylic on birch.
In my testing, Rubio Monocoat is not particularly water resistant. According to the manufacturer it is a single coat finish. I think the water just soaks through that thin layer.
As far as I can tell, "ceramic" is just marketing BS when applied to finishes. There's no actual ceramic in the finish. When the manufacturer does admit to what's in the can, it is "...resin...". That's what makes up every non-"ceramic" wood finish.
Contributor
Some of these new ceramic coatings are siloxane-based. Calling them "ceramic" somewhat makes sense, in as much as they are not metallic or organic compounds.Originally Posted by Jamie Buxton
Contributor
I've tested RM quite a bit. Water does seem to penetrate through it if left on the surface, but it does no damage that I can see, nor does it alter the appearance, as it does to Osmo Polyox. It's not a traditional surface film, but it performs very well, better than many traditional finishes from chemical or heat exposure.
Many companies that make floor finishes advertise them as containing ceramic or nano technology. Many do in fact contain colloidal alumina, and that definitely is a ceramic material. Those finishes seem to be more abrasion resistant than traditional finishes. Whether or not it's from the ceramic component I can't say, but I would think so. (Full disclosure, I'm a ceramic engineer.)
I agree that most any waterborne acrylic or urethane/acrylic would be a good choice for the OP's project.
John
Contributor
John,
I was under the impression that the ceramic finishes you describe were only able to be applied by the factory, not the home oner DIY crowd. Something to due with keeping the ceramic or abrasion resisting particles suspended in the finish, not having them simply sink to the base.
Any thoughts or am I just going crazy,, again
Contributor
What’s the product name of a wood finish like that?
Contributor
Here are two you can buy at your local big box store:
https://www.rustoleum.com/product-ca...r-floor-finish
https://www.rustoleum.com/product-ca...m-floor-finish
Another group of products that I think that are sold through distributors: http://www.arboritec.com/
I'm sure there are more.
John
Contributor
The one I had looked into last year, for wood, was the nano line of finishes. The boat detailers have been using the cermaic products for years, and if I remember correctly, I was hearing siloxane thrown around a few years ago when they were talking about these (then) new coatings.
Contributor
Thanks for the info and links, I appreciate it.
Contributor
I asked a friend who’s a flooring contractor about those floor finishes containing aluminum oxide. He says they are very durable. However the downside is that you can’t refinish the floor. The resin is polyurethane. Fully cured polyurethane doesn’t bond well to new coats of urethane, so you have to remove the old finish - you can’t just recoat it. If you try to sand the old finish, the aluminum oxide in it immediately wears out the sandpaper.
Contributor
Has your contractor friend tried zirconia sandpaper? It's substantially harder than aluminum oxide. The particles of aluminum oxide in these varnishes are very small, too, probably 1000X smaller than the starting grits used to refinish floors. I just can't imagine the aluminum oxide making it impossible to remove. I'm not saying he's wrong, only wondering if he's tried other options.
John
Contributor
John, can you expand on the difference you found between RM and Osmo Polyx as far as water resistance? I tested 4 hard wax finishes and prefer Osmo over RM because I found it doesn’t amber woods like maple as much, and has a slight satin finish compared to the flat finish of RM (not using a power buffer). The quick test I did where I left some water on the finished samples for an hour showed better results with Osmo than RM, but I have the feeling that you might have tested more thoroughly. Thanks!
Contributor
Hi Tim,
RM looks pretty great on maple, but maybe it's darker than Osmo. I've never tried Osmo on it. Here's RM, 180 grit on the left, 600 on the right. The sheen is much higher than what RM gives on walnut, so species is important.
I have tested RM quite a lot and nothing has left permanent damage or changed the look. With Osmo PolyOx I only tested it with bourbon and water. I'm not positive, but I think this is bourbon on the left and water on the right.
After they had dried, it looked like this.
The bourbon left a ring, water changed the sheen. What soured me the most about Osmo Polyox is that when I sanded away the damage from the bourbon and applied a new coat of Polyox the sheen was different on the undamaged surrounding area. With RM the repair is invisible. I like Osmo because it doesn't go bad in an opened can like RM does, but it hasn't worked as well for me as RM.
I hope this helps some.
John
Contributor
John, thanks for your detailed response. I may have to do some more testing. It’s interesting that the Osmo did not blend in well after you sanded down the damage and reapplied the finish, because that is supposed to be one of the advantages of hard wax oil finishes. Now that I think about it, I do seem to recall one of the professional woodworkers on YT switched from Osmo to Fiddies because of concerns with durability, but I can’t remember who ir was. Maybe Padulla?
But there was one big difference in our tests. I used water and white wine, where you went much more upscale and used bourbon. I think I need to up my game 😁
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