Sellers freely admits he did not invent it the practice, but he does take credit for the term “knife-wall”.Originally Posted by David Carroll
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Sellers freely admits he did not invent it the practice, but he does take credit for the term “knife-wall”.
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Just irks me that he has to say this every time. He does claim a lot. All aimed at his choir.
Regards from Perth
Derek
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Having found many of Mr. Sellers' claims to be dubious, it is my pleasure to not be irked by him. This is accomplished in a most enjoyable way, by ignoring him.
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
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Sellers Bashing? And it has what to do with the OP's Question?
BTW: since we are WAY of topic...L/N is having a Meet & Greet down at this place..
Road Trip, Lost Art Press building.JPG
Today and tomorrow, I think...Hmmmm..
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
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A method of creating a dado was mentioned along with a person who lays claim to certain aspects of the method.Sellers Bashing? And it has what to do with the OP's Question?
Comments, corrections and opinions ensued.
Some may see it as an exposé, others will see it as bashing.
Google has changed some over the years. It appears even with a vast number of hits on a search it isn't possible to see multiple pages of the results. There is likely a way, it just isn't apparent to me at this time.
This was one comment found in a search with over 10,000,000 hits >
Another shows it mentioned on a TV program as far back as 1965.The technique has been around for a very long time, and the name "knifewall" was popularized by Paul Sellers, a proponent of the technique.
That is when it was decided to stop looking. It became apparent the knitting of these two words together has served many meanings over many years.
It is like so many things in woodworking done by people centuries ago, when someone from current times does it they are awarded the mantle of discovery or being associated with the process.
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
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Not the first time Paul Sellers has been the subject of conversation.
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread....2-Paul-Sellers
Warning, a long thread.
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Jim, in my opinion Sellers is an excellent teacher. For example, he is clear in his explanation and demonstration of how a joint or construction is made. For this reason, I will watch his videos, with the willingness to learn from him. However ... I find his patter and spiel strongly narcissistic. He is not only constantly blowing his own trumpet, but he will negate anyone who disagrees with him. His sermons are long-winded, presenting his philosophy to save mankind. It stops being about woodworking, and morphs into religion.
To link to the original question about dado planes, for me, the joys in joinery - and here creating a dado - can come from the result of my hand skills, the pleasure of using a beautiful tool, the satisfaction of using minimal tools, or the knowledge that I can do it in several different ways. There is no single, perfect method. Determine what works best for the moment, or just have fun exploring something of interest.
Regards from Perth
Derek
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Agreed.
In my opinion there are enough "excellent teachers" available. So, there isn't any reason to not ignore one in order to learn from one more to my personal liking.
It may have been the final straw for me years ago when my question was ridiculed by a Sellers' fan who insisted the master should never be questioned about why something is done only one way.
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
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Still doing the "Bash"? So...Dados with a ...what?
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
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I also like Sellers to a point. For someone who is just starting out he does tend to aim much of his instruction at beginners, without a lot of tools. So he focuses on beginner-level projects that can be done with a couple of saws, a No. 4 plane, hardware store chisels, a combination square, a small utility knife, and a few others. I appreciate that, (despite owning enough tools to start a small school myself), and I often recommend his videos to newbies who ask. I like the little dovetail marking block he made, and made one for myself.
But, as Derek pointed out, he does get a bit preachy and seems to equate "making" (I dislike that term) with divinity. While from one point of view, I can see his point, however, creativity--for it's own sake--is a very human trait. But I like to think my own thoughts about such things, and his constant sermonizing, particularly in his blog posts doesn't resonate with me at all, rather I lose interest in what point he is trying to make.
His narcissism, I can deal with. He's very proud of his accomplishments and crows a bit too much "to his choir" (I might have used the term "echo chamber), and if you do question him about something, as Jim pointed out, he and his "Seller-dwellers" (I just made that up) are quick to snippy replies, bordering on bullying. But recent converts and acolytes are often given to strong opinions and fierce loyalties to their masters.
But all-in-all, I think he has been a positive force in keeping hand-tool woodworking alive, and I appreciate that.
JMHO
DC
Last edited by David Carroll; 02-24-2024 at 2:27 PM.
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The Sellers Box, page 3.JPG
I did down load a set of FREE Plans from his Masterclass Series..
Episode 5, first coat, front.JPG
Followed both the plans and the 6 part video...
And it came out as nice as can be..
I take everything I read on the internet ( including here) with a 1 pound grain of salt. And constant bashing of fellow woodworkers does get a bit BORING, like when people go off topic to get in a "Jolly Good Bash"....
Dados? Anyone?
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
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This is almost funny coming from one who is so often "doing the "Bash"" on those who recommend quality tools from a company supporting this site with paid advertisements.
If expressing why I do not frequent Mr. Sellers' site is bashing, then call me guilty. My main reason for no longer visiting his internet presence is having felt like I was being bashed by his fans for asking a simple question.
As others have mentioned, preachiness and a narcissistic personality can turn some away. Others will become devoted foollowers and rabid defenders. My preference is someone like Charles Neil. He demonstrates how something is done and also can spin a nice folksy tale in the process.
Rex Krueger is also a good teacher who isn't trying to sell tools or make people feel guilty for having "the wrong tools," too many tools or too few tools.
There are many others who also do not ridicule those who ask why something is done in such a way or do not insist that their way is the best or only way.
As for dados, I like mine stopped, here they are with a saw & chisel > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?208154
Here with a dado plane > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?278928
Here is another thread with dado planes making dados > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?278860
There are a couple of wooden dado planes in my shop, maybe someday a post with those can be done. So much to do, so little time.
Finally here is doing stopped cuts with a Stanley #45 > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?242089
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
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Look in the mirror...
Same two people always either bring in the fellow's name on about every other topic...
Seems sometimes, those that say "this is the best tool for a Job" seem to be trying to get someone to BUY that tool.
Dados:
Stanley No. 45, Type 5
Stanley No. 39, 3/8" for narrow stuff
Disston No. 4 ,14", 9ppi Backsaw, then the chisel to remove 99% of the waste, then the Stanley No. 71-1/2 to "plane" the floor of the Dado
Finally, Have a Router Guide to guide a Craftsman Router with the size straight bit needed...used for WIDE panels....bit can sometimes be a dovetail bit, as well
Afraid my 160+ yr old wooden Plough plane can only do grooves...fence gets in the way, no nickers..
YMMV, of course...
So.....how does all this HELP the OP?
BTW, in that Sellers plan I posted...it needs 2 stopped dados...to house a center divider.....but, there is NO such dado in the ends of the lid. Or, did you miss that tiny detail, while chewing me out?
The Sellers Box2, one dado done.JPG
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
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I do not recall having seen that post. Probably busy doing something else.
Is saying I like my dados stopped "chewing you out"?
Try walking outside without a jacket, maybe the cold air will thicken your skin.
jtk
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Contributor
Combination plane as a dado plane...isn't that one of the "7 planes in 1" that Stanley said about their No. 45? Hmmm
I am a wee bit GRUMPY tonight...the Household is all down sick, the main camera I was using has died...still learning the How-tos of the phone's camera....so..the fuse is a bit on the short side....
" The world is full of Kings and Queens, who blind your eyes, and steal you dreams.." RJD..
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
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