We need more trade schools

[Jerome Stanek]

We have a vocational school in our county. They have a number of trades that they train.

[Michael Schuch]

There are no trade schools in my area and the quality of workers and work is abysmal! I won't even call a "trade" business any more. Electrical, plumbing, HVAC, construction, repair, installing granite counters, appliance repair, etc. I will just figure out how to do it myself. The two exceptions in the past couple decades are roofing and deepening the well. Neither company had impressive workers but the jobs were too big for me to handle myself. It is pretty sad when an HVAC guy comes out and I know more about what he is supposed to be doing that he does!

It is amazing how much the Internet has empowered the technically minded to handle their own projects and problems if they can get over the fear of the unknown and do some self education.

After installing a few mini-splits for myself I helped my boss install one at his place. Only after the mini split was installed and working perfectly did the magnitude of the quotes from local HVAC shops truly hit him!

[Brian Runau]

A local industrial building contractor coupled with the local high school to open a trade school. A local industrial electrical manufacturer coupled with a local state college to create a trade/technical school. There are now 2 trade schools here in the valley.

My Dad chased oil rigs for a living. I grew up in places like Kemmerer, WY, Craig, CO, Blanding, UT and Flora, IL. In short, I worked in a large number of major cities in CA, OR, WA and throughout the Midwest including living and working 4 years in the Chicago area. My coworkers in Chicago were making book I couldn't slow down enough to learn to live in Lewiston, ID when I transferred here. I have advised several young people asking this question "Where do you want to live for the rest of your life?" If it's not in a major city, I wouldn't go into electronics but rather train to become a licensed electrician. You will be able to find work anywhere you want to go, even those small unheard of towns. There is a great need and reason for the trades!

Met a young man from England on a cruise in early 1980's. Both in our early 20's. Told me then people didn't go to college in England, no jobs, they learned a trade.

[mike stenson]

Or do we need companies to hire, train and retain employees with pay and benefits on their own Vs all of us being disposable at the drop of a hat. Sorry, in a mood today. Brian

"Lifetime employment" went out of vogue along with pensions. It's all a short-term, transactional, relationship now. By design. Then people wonder why there's no employee loyalty.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

My Grandpa went straight off the farm at 17 to a trade school in Chicago in 1930. It was called The Lewis Academy. I can't find a thing about it on the web. When he got back to the farm he embarked on a quest to bring electricity to rural southern Iowa. His work planting poles and stringing wire made him popular enough to win a seat on the state legislature. He never went to college.

[Jim Becker]

Jim, did they change the name of Middle Bucks Vocational Technical school to Middle Bucks Institute of Technology?

Indeed they did. I've known a few kiddos who have graduated from there and one who is a current student.

https://www.mbit.org/

[Jerry Bruette]

The high school I attended did a good job of preparing students for college, lots of college prep courses. Teachers and guidance counselors pushed college.

Unfortunately I wasn't college material. I had a keen interest in machine shop activities but the high school didn't have any machine shop classes let alone a machine shop.

So I opted to go the military service route. The Navy trained me as a MR, Machinery Repairman. I got my machine shop training and job while being paid.

Fast forward eight years and I'm working in a local pulp mill and and they have a job opening for millwright. I passed the aptitude test and started my apprenticeship at the local Vocational/Technical College. Part of the Wisconsin system Dave Fritz referred to earlier. Spent the next 30 plus years making a good living as a millwright/maintenance mechanic. It was a challenging and enjoyable job. I got to work with my head and with my hands. Many of the jobs we did had no guidance from engineering, we thought of the solution to a problem, designed the solution and fabbed/built the solution.

I don't know about other states but I believe Wisconsin has enough trade schools in their system. What the world needs is more young people to have an interest in the trades be it mechanical, electrical, instrumentation, piping or which ever trade you pick. They're good paying jobs that may require some holiday, weekend, and overtime work but they are very rewarding when faced with a problem and you find the solution and get a machine installed or back up and running.

When I retired two years ago the company I worked for was robbing a local foundry of their maintenance employees. The foundry didn't believe in having journeymen maintenance employees. So they were picked away for more money and schooling. Many of my former teammates were dual and triple carded journeymen. The more cards you held the more you got paid. And all the schooling was on the company's dime. Hard to beat that offer.

[Jerry Bruette]

I'll add one other important thing here. I have a female acquaintance who is the only woman journeyman in a 600+ member millwright union in the mid-west. Not only are women not represented in the trades in numbers, my friend indicates that she and others who have tried to stick around, have been treated poorly by the males they need to work with. It's not about skills. It's about deep seated, um...learned behavior...that is frankly immoral. I truly admire my friend for sticking it out for over four years now so she can support her now 12 year old son and make a good living. But I abhor what she has had to endure just because she has indoor plumbing rather than outdoor plumbing. BTW, her work has been in huge manufacturing facilities as well as building 300' tall windmills. It's hard work, but even as a 5'2" 120 lb human, she carries her load in the work.

I didn't work out of a union hall, but I know a few people who did. My understanding is that the "learned behavior" comes from being afraid of someone you view as less capable doing the job as well or better than you. I've heard stories of journeymen training apprentices and not giving them all the information or knowledge to do a job out of fear of being replaced by the apprentice.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

Indeed they did. I've known a few kiddos who have graduated from there and one who is a current student.

https://www.mbit.org/

Where would we be without that trade school in Cambridge Mass, M.I.T. ? (we would be wishing we had a steadier hand to hold our routers).

[Edward Weber]

Indeed they did. I've known a few kiddos who have graduated from there and one who is a current student.

https://www.mbit.org/

Thanks Jim
When I graduated from there in 82, there were lots of different trades.
As far as I remember, there was;
Mechanic (gas/car)
Diesel mechanic
Carpentry
Appliance repair
Food prep
Baking
Masonry
Printing/graphic arts
Machine shop
Auto Body
Cosmotology
Electronics of some kind
and some more I can't remember right now.
There was a modular (two piece) home built every year and I believe it was auctioned off.

[Bruce Wrenn]

Having taught shop/carpentry in the mid nineties, the in thing was everybody is going to be a computer whiz. We didn't need people who could fix the toilets. Our influx of people into this country, is because they are willing to do the trade jobs, and they are plenty of jobs. During the recession of 2008, several MILLION left the building industry, and have never returned. Same for the food industry during Covid. As an example, our two sons, one college educated, and the other a high school drop out, both work in the trades. College one owned (10+ years) his home repair company and recently sold it. Other son recently closed his independent heavy equipment repair business to go full time with one of his customers. Both make six figure salaries. Despite having a degree in engineering, I spent most of my working years in the construction industry. Spent last 25 years working for myself. Never printed a business card, and turned down more work than I did.

[Bill Dufour]

My Grandpa went straight off the farm at 17 to a trade school in Chicago in 1930. It was called The Lewis Academy. I can't find a thing about it on the web. When he got back to the farm he embarked on a quest to bring electricity to rural southern Iowa. His work planting poles and stringing wire made him popular enough to win a seat on the state legislature. He never went to college.

Something in here maybe. Too hard to read for me, google claims it is related.
Bill D
https://ecommons.luc.edu/cgi/viewcon...ntext=luc_diss

[Larry Frank]

I think this is reflective if society today. There are very few kids building things or working on things. Too many are stuck to their phone screens. In a way, we are all responsible for letting our schools do away from shop and other similar classes.

There are too many getting college degrees that do not lead to good jobs. The trades pay pretty well and there is a big demand.

[Ron Citerone]

I taught Middle School Industrial Arts from 1983 to 2018.

* My department once had 9 teachers.

* When I retired I was one of three and I was not replaced upon leaving.

My thoughts on why this is happening:

Educators making decisions at the State levels are college educated and see college as the main path to success.

Administration sees hands on learning as "Old School" and see computer technology as the be all and end all.

Parents of influence are often college educated and aren't willing to fight for technical education.

Industrial Arts programs cost more per student hour than classroom instruction.

New generation administrators have been trained to worship test scores above all else, and technical education doesn't impact test scores.

College students are not choosing Industrial Arts Education as a major and school districts can't find certified teachers even if they want them.

Technically trained teachers find more lucrative jobs for their skill set and leave the profession.


Industrial Arts/ Tech Ed is not exactly trade/vocational education but are intertwined and the challenges are similar IMO.

[Rod Sheridan]

As far as I know school wood shop and farming isn’t even considered a trade anymore. With everybody looking for a reason to sue, I can understand shutting down school woodshop. I took wood shop in school and made a career from it. I’m the only one that I know that did..

the last cabinet makers union was in KC. There all just carpenters union now..

Hello Jack, is cabinet making a licensed trade in the US?

I agree that the loss of shop classes is a tragedy for students, some students used it as a motivation to a career,some used used it as a motivation to a hobby and some learned that it wasn’t for them, all valuable outcomes.

In Canada, we also have a shortage of shop classes, and a shortage of trades people due to lack of training and apprenticeship availability, as well as the Boomer demographic retiring ( me 3 years ago).

It doesn’t seem to be something we’re doing a good job of solving.

Regards, Rod.