Milling machine as a mortiser

[Bill Dufour]

The chisel housing has to be held at the top by a bracket that grip the quill and is big enough to clear the chuck. On a bridgeport the quill is about 3+3/8 " diameter. This is about double the quill diameter on most drill presses in a small shop.
Bill D

[andrew whicker]

ah yeah. I wasn't thinking about the mechanics, but the tool has to both turn the drill bit and hold the chisel. Sure. That makes sense.

[andrew whicker]

I think you would find a knee mill accurate but cumbersome for mortising due to the slow gear feed on the table. Perhaps one with motorized spindle and table feeds would be practical.

As with most specialized woodworking machinery finding a good used mortiser requires systematic and patient searching and probably will require shipping. Hollow chisel machines are most common but there are slot mortisers to be found, in fact there is a Bacci oscillating slot mortiser in MA and a manual Griggio machine in PA on Facebook now. The JDS Multirouter is still available new and is a capable slot mortiser. If you want lots of square holes in a hurry there's a swing chisel unit also in PA on Facebook and Mark Hennebury has a rebuilt Maka for sale.

A Festool Domino 700 is an excellent and versatile solution for mortises up to 14mm.

You East coasters get all the cool stuff!

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...6200549695703/

This looks nice. Is the price point ish for the old heavy machines?

[John TenEyck]

There's no need to make integral tenons unless you want to make exposed through tenons. Loose tenons work just as well for nearly every project and that eliminates the need for a chisel mortiser. A slot mortiser is easier in every way, and there's no chisel to sharpen; when the bit finally dulls just change it to a new one.

But if you really want to have integral tenons then buy or build one of my Horizontal Router Mortisers, or buy a MultiRouter, or Panto Router, or just use your tablesaw or RAS with a dado stack. The first three options allow you to make both the mortise and the integral tenon on the mating part, too, all with one compact machine.

To me, loose tenons are the fastest and easiest option for most joinery. Being able to cut the parts to final dimension before cutting the joinery assures accuracy of the assembly.

John

[Kevin Jenness]

Mortises come in two flavors. square and round end. Square holes can be made with hollow chisels or oscillating chisels. Hollow chisel mortisers use square tools making overlapping holes for variable length mortises and can have manual or power strokes. Oscillating chisel mortisers like the Maka are powered and very fast but require a separate specialized chisel for a specific mortise length. Both these types of mortisers are suitable for integral tenon work.

Round hole mortisers include power stroke oscillating machines like those made by Bacci and Balestrini, manual stationary slot mortisers which can do boring as well, router based machines like the Pantograph and Multirouter, and the Domino line. They are well suited to spline tenons, but there are round end tenoners ranging from heavy stationary machines to, again, the Multirouter and Pantograph. Spline tenon joinery is simple and versatile as a simple butt joint or coped stub tenon can be made very strong by this method. Integral round tenons are not really suited to coped joints used in millwork.

So there is a wide range available, you need to figure out your market and methodology and go from there. I have had an Italian slot mortiser for 30 years which has served well for a variety of work, but I also have a benchtop hollow chisel machine for sash work and through tenons and a Domino 500 for casework and rapid small scale frame work.

I should point out that you already have a capable heavy shaper that is well suited for making tenons using a sled or bolt-on sliding table. One thing about square integral tenons is that they usually need haunching so it is not a single operation.

[mike stenson]

They make attachments for drill presses to hold the chisels. I have one, I'd be happy to give away.

[Kevin Jenness]

You East coasters get all the cool stuff!

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...6200549695703/

This looks nice. Is the price point ish for the old heavy machines?

I don't know. You will have to look around to decide your ish factor. No doubt the choices available used are limited in your region but if you can buy what you need from a trustworthy seller shipping is an option. I would say that manual (actually pedal in this case) hollow chisel mortisers are the most common types to be found used and generally lower priced than other types but that would depend on model and condition. Slot mortisers are thin on the ground and oscillating chisel and slot mortisers more so and generally more costly and more complicated.

Honestly, you can't go too far wrong with a Domino 700 as a basic slot mortiser. It's useful for casework and millwork as well as furniture, it has a guarantee and if you don't like it you can resell it at a high price point.

[Brian Holcombe]

There's no need to make integral tenons unless you want to make exposed through tenons. Loose tenons work just as well for nearly every project and that eliminates the need for a chisel mortiser. A slot mortiser is easier in every way, and there's no chisel to sharpen; when the bit finally dulls just change it to a new one.

But if you really want to have integral tenons then buy or build one of my Horizontal Router Mortisers, or buy a MultiRouter, or Panto Router, or just use your tablesaw or RAS with a dado stack. The first three options allow you to make both the mortise and the integral tenon on the mating part, too, all with one compact machine.

To me, loose tenons are the fastest and easiest option for most joinery. Being able to cut the parts to final dimension before cutting the joinery assures accuracy of the assembly.

John

This is not quite accurate in my experience. I cut very accurate mortises on the chisel mortiser in 10-15 seconds. Unlike a router, I'm not anywhere near as limited on sizing, so if I'm cutting long or deep mortises I have no trouble. Recently I cut mortises 1.5" wide, 4.5" deep, 6" long with a chisel mortiser. Probably two minutes each since I had to move the position one time.

For furniture sized work I can cut perfect square end mortises with the Maka in about 4-5 seconds each.

Cutting deep mortises with a router bit on an extension takes a while, I pocket out door hardware with a router bit on an extension made by Guhdo, it's a beautiful setup but I hate it by comparison to easy, low stress cutting on a chisel mortiser.

Tenons on a shaper are very, very fast.

[Mark Hennebury]

Balestrini tenoner, twin table, automatic continuous operation, cuts round end tenons, scribes shoulders, chamfers tenon. Infinitely variable length, thickness and radius. straight, angled and compound angles. mortise length up to 100mm plus the thickness, thickness up to 30mm, depth to 80mm. they can also cut round dowels. If i recall the maximum output was either 600 or 900 per hour. I never really counted, but I cut thousand of tenons for tables and chairs on these machines, and the are excellent, along with the twin table mortiser

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[John TenEyck]

This is not quite accurate in my experience. I cut very accurate mortises on the chisel mortiser in 10-15 seconds. Unlike a router, I'm not anywhere near as limited on sizing, so if I'm cutting long or deep mortises I have no trouble. Recently I cut mortises 1.5" wide, 4.5" deep, 6" long with a chisel mortiser. Probably two minutes each since I had to move the position one time.

For furniture sized work I can cut perfect square end mortises with the Maka in about 4-5 seconds each.

Cutting deep mortises with a router bit on an extension takes a while, I pocket out door hardware with a router bit on an extension made by Guhdo, it's a beautiful setup but I hate it by comparison to easy, low stress cutting on a chisel mortiser.

Tenons on a shaper are very, very fast.

I suspect your equipment is better than most, Brian. I read all the time on here about problems people have with chisel mortisers. Most hobbiests have bench top units, which seem pretty light duty to me for the job they are asked to do. And then there's the tooling. Sharpening chisels and augers, adjust the bit gap, on and on. And how many people have a Maka? I didn't even know what one was until I read it about it on here. I'm sure tenons are quickly made on a shaper, once it's setup to do so, but how many hobbiests have one? And then there's the issue of space. All these machines take up space, space hobbiests often don't have.

I agree that mortises beyond about 2-1/2 - 3" deep become difficult with a router, but how often for furniture making is that needed? The only time I've had to go that deep was for making exterior doors. And for furniture making, mortise depth of 3 - 4 times the width seems plenty adequate to me. Most furniture making uses mortises less than 2-1/2" deep, and routers do that easily, quickly, and with no clean up required. Similarly, I can't remember the last time I actually needed to make a mortise wider than 1/2". If I feel the need for more glue area/strength, it's easy to make two mortises, side by side. Folks who own Dominoes follow this strategy.

For specialized work I can see the advantage of a quality chisel or other deep mortiser. For furniture work I prefer loose tenons cut with a router or slot mortiser. It's just so straightforward, simple, space efficient, and low-cost.

I guess we look at it differently, and that's fine.

John

[Warren Lake]

had to do mortises with a drill press at first. 1/2" mortises in birdseye pushing back. Not ideal but the work got done. The chain on the robinson is fast.

[Richard Daugird]

How about a Shaper Origin handheld 3D router? Doesn't take up much space and does A LOT of different tasks.

[Chris Parks]

I had a mate who did all his dovetailing on a Bridgeport mill.

[Brian Holcombe]

I suspect your equipment is better than most, Brian. I read all the time on here about problems people have with chisel mortisers. Most hobbiests have bench top units, which seem pretty light duty to me for the job they are asked to do. And then there's the tooling. Sharpening chisels and augers, adjust the bit gap, on and on. And how many people have a Maka? I didn't even know what one was until I read it about it on here. I'm sure tenons are quickly made on a shaper, once it's setup to do so, but how many hobbiests have one? And then there's the issue of space. All these machines take up space, space hobbiests often don't have.

I agree that mortises beyond about 2-1/2 - 3" deep become difficult with a router, but how often for furniture making is that needed? The only time I've had to go that deep was for making exterior doors. And for furniture making, mortise depth of 3 - 4 times the width seems plenty adequate to me. Most furniture making uses mortises less than 2-1/2" deep, and routers do that easily, quickly, and with no clean up required. Similarly, I can't remember the last time I actually needed to make a mortise wider than 1/2". If I feel the need for more glue area/strength, it's easy to make two mortises, side by side. Folks who own Dominoes follow this strategy.

For specialized work I can see the advantage of a quality chisel or other deep mortiser. For furniture work I prefer loose tenons cut with a router or slot mortiser. It's just so straightforward, simple, space efficient, and low-cost.

I guess we look at it differently, and that's fine.

John

Bench top units are not very good.

As far as sharpening chisels goes, it’s pretty easy and I cut a lot of mortises between sharpenings and the setup is quick.

I cut deep mortises for tables, beds and doors pretty routinely.

[Chris Parks]

Another way to do mortises is to use a Domino and multiple cuts to make one mortise. Derek Cohen has used this method and it works well for loose tenon joinery.