Anybody here use Sommerfeld's Tongue & Groove Cabinetmaking Set ??

[Bob Wingard]

I have tried to use this set as per his "OPTIONAL" video, and at first, could not figure out how/why my corners weren't quite square. Then I looked more closely at the geometry of the set and found that, while the grooves cut by the set are 1/4" deep, the tongues are about 1/32" short of the claimed "matching" 1/4". If you use his system of attaching backs and sides, the boxes will be about 1/16" wider at the back than at the front.

My own solution was to make a rub bearing for the tongue cutter that was 0.066" smaller in diameter than the one provided in the set. This, obviously is not something that every purchaser has the option to do and I was just wondering if anyone else here uses this set, and if so, what do they think of it.

[Jay Albrandt]

I use the system all the time and I can't figure out why you are having this problem.

I attach the sides to the face frame first using corner blocks to keep the assembly square. Measure carefully at the face frame, cut and install the bottom next. Measure from the bottom of one groove in the side to the opposite, cut and install. Square every time.

Good Luck.

Jay

[Keith Hall]

I just built a set of kitchen cabs with this system and was very pleased with the results. I also noted the 1/32 difference in the tongue. I looked at that as a well for the excess glue to go to. There was enough mating surface on the tongue that the 1/32 inch seemed insignificant. To eliminate the tearing out of the cross grain of the plywood carcus surface, get a good grip on the panel and climb cut. It worked well every time.

[Bob Wingard]

I just built a set of kitchen cabs with this system and was very pleased with the results. I also noted the 1/32 difference in the tongue. I looked at that as a well for the excess glue to go to. There was enough mating surface on the tongue that the 1/32 inch seemed insignificant. To eliminate the tearing out of the cross grain of the plywood carcus surface, get a good grip on the panel and climb cut. It worked well every time.

Keith .. .. if you build just one cabinet, the 1/16" dimensional error doesn't seem significant. If you are building a series of modular cabinets, the error accumulates as you go. If you have 5 cabinets that are each 1/16" wider at the rear than the front, it can drive you nuts trying to get them aligned on the wall. You can clamp and fasten the cabinets at the face frame, but they will splay open at the back. 5 cabinets bolted together on a wall become 5/16" wider at the rear than at the front. I have spoken with a lady (Donna) at Sommerfeld's and she at first said the shallow tongue was, in fact a "feature" for excess glue and that I should take it up with CMT as they used to manufacture this bit set for Mark. CMT only has a voice-mail kind of comment system on their phone service and when I explained the error, they promptly sent me a new set of cutters for the tongue bit. Since they were exactly the same dimension as the old set, there was no improvement, but I give them credit for trying. A friend of mine contacted Mark and was told that he was aware that it might be a problem and he was going to "do something about it later this year". That was back in early spring. The sets they are now selling which are made by a different company in China are to the same dimensions, based on reviewing a recently purchased set.

I was just wondering if the dimensional error is showing up on all sets, and if so, to the same degree. The one way to tell is to make one set of cuts .. .. if the tongue does not bottom out in the groove, you have the error and the boxes you make with an affected set simply cannot be square no matter how many corner blocks you install.

[Larry Prince]

I have to agree with Mr. Wingard on this issue. I have the same problem with my set and while it can be ignored for one box, for a wall run it cant.

One solution is to remember to cut your nails rails 1/16th shorter than the system dictates you should. But this is a sloppy solution, as is the manufacture of the tongue cutter.

WIth regard to Mr. Hall's suggestion to climb cut the cross-grain grooves, I'm not at all comfortable with that. My method has been to set my fence forward so the tongue cutter is taking a cut of 1/64th or so. This effectively scores the face veneer, and when you set your fence back and finish the cut there is no tearout at all. I'm not disparaging Mr. Hall's method here, just saying that it doesnt fit my comfort level.

Aside from this one issue with the tongue cutter I'm very happy with the Sommerfeld system. I've been using it now for about 6-8 months and find that it really proves its worth at assembly time, where the parts just seem to fall together and alignment is near-perfect every time.

Oh, there is one other small issue with this system, and that is that the video (the only source of how-to info) doesnt cover diagonal faced corner boxes at all. However, I came up with a very easy way to do those and if anyone is curious I can provide you with a video slide show, or with a .dxf cad file.

Larry Prince
Ridge Custom WoodWorks

[Bob Wingard]

a brief update .. .. ..

CMT had a booth at I.W.F. .. .. I talked with one of their reps about this, and he seemed very interested after being presented with the numbers. Said he would talk with the owner immediately upon his return .. he was taking in the show himself. Checked back with him before leaving late the next day to find out what their solution was going to be .. he said he hadn't had "time" to talk with the boss yet .. don't think I'll be expecting much out of CMT as a fix.

On the other hand .. .. Woodline USA is now selling their version of the same set for about $79.00 and Freud rep says they might introduce a set with correctly sized cutters.

The CMT guy said he had received other complaints from guys at the show about the same problem,, so it looks like mine is not an isolated incident.

[Keith Hall]

Bob, I went to the CMT booth on Friday to inquire about the problem and got the same old song. They had never heard of the problem before and would look into it, BUT................ it would probably be Sommerfeld's job to deal with the solution. Inspiring customer service. You bought it, you own it! I also have a problem with their 5 piece cabinet door bit set as the cope and rail bits do not line up, as advertised, without adjustment.

[Bob Wingard]

I would agree it would be Sommerfeld's problem, EXCEPT .. .. . . CMT is continuing to produce and sell the set as their own part number. They have, by doing so, accepted at least some degree of liaability for the error. The rep I spoke with said they would need to either replace the dimensionally defective cutters, or at least take the product off the market. We'll lsee if they do either.