Huh. First time I ever heard of Festool was on 'This Old House'. But it wasn't Norm using them, it was the Silva brothers.Originally Posted by Dan Clark
Contributor
Huh. First time I ever heard of Festool was on 'This Old House'. But it wasn't Norm using them, it was the Silva brothers.
Yoga class makes me feel like a total stud, mostly because I'm about as flexible as a 2x4.
"Design"? Possibly. "Intelligent"? Sure doesn't look like it from this angle.
We used to be hunter gatherers. Now we're shopper borrowers.
The three most important words in the English language: "Front Towards Enemy".
The world makes a lot more sense when you remember that Butthead was the smart one.
You can never be too rich, too thin, or have too much ammo.
Contributor
That's pretty good Dan...however it was a simple decision for me. I had the tools (CS) and needed to better manage my sheet goods. Festool tools are amazing...but the EZ system fits MY needs...and I simply don't need to spend the money. I have never had the pleasure of dealing with Bob...and I'm sure he is a great guy...but I have had the pleasure of dealing with Dino and he is amazing...but misunderstood. I wish people would STOP (!!!!) this them vs us...and get back to woodworking/building. It's not tools...it's the person who is using them.
Glenn ClaboMichigan
Member
Glenn,
What else can be more important? I can't think of anything.
When I started buying Festool, I looked around. In fact, I looked at EZ first. When I added up all the factors - including what I needed to accomplish and my current rather poor set of tools - the Festool best fit MY needs!
Sounds like we both won!
Best regards,
Dan.
It's amazing what you can accomplish in the 11th hour, 59 minute of any project. Ya just have to keep your eye on the goal.
Guest
Safety and Versatility.
http://eurekazone.com/gallery/smart-...torials?page=1
The fact that anyone now can make any cut safe with any tool is more important than Glenn's and Dan's tools.
Regards.
Last edited by Dino Makropoulos; 10-05-2006 at 10:24 PM.
Member
Can it, Burt. I for one am tired of reading your BS.
Guest
Bob,
This is my first post of the day? What are you talking about?
Burt
Edit add: I think I just figured out what you are talking about. You gave me credit for Dino's post and you think that making a safe cut is BS. To me, if there isn't safety, there is nothing.
Last edited by Burt Waddell; 10-05-2006 at 10:49 PM.
Member
Moderator, Close This Thread!!!!!!!!
Can it Dino! I'm tired of your constant hype!!!
I'm trying to recognize that each person's needs is important to them and that the best solution for each person is individual. HOW DARE YOU TELL ME WHAT IS IMPORTANT!!!! I AND I ALONE WILL DECIDE WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO ME.
You and Burt, on the other hand, use every stinking opportunity to stick your nose in and hype your products! You twist EVERY opportunity to your marketing advantage! I am completely sick of you!
MODERATOR PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD!!!
And I strongly urge you to ban these two hype mongers or at least limit them to their own forum.
Last edited by Dan Clark; 10-06-2006 at 12:12 AM.
It's amazing what you can accomplish in the 11th hour, 59 minute of any project. Ya just have to keep your eye on the goal.
Guest
I think the Clearview... oh waite I got the wrong thread.
Member
Burt, you have the single worst reputation of any individual on any forum that I have read. You are known far and wide as a marketer of EZ products and don't give one hoot in hell about anyone else's needs or wants.
Can it!
It's amazing what you can accomplish in the 11th hour, 59 minute of any project. Ya just have to keep your eye on the goal.
Member
I'll start out by saying I'm an EZ owner, and leave it at that. I'm relatively happy with the system, there are a few things about it that I find lacking, but any line of tools has it's high points and it's low points.
I paid about 500$ to integrate the EZ into my tool collection, and it's served me well.
Before I found the EZ, I looked at the festool guide systems and drooled over it for about a year. But I already had a saw. Already had a router. Good ones too, not tools I was unhappy with by any means. Not top of the line, but they got the job done.
To buy a comparable Festool collection to what I had with my current tools + the EZ Upgrade, would have cost me about 1200.00. Not to mention the prices of festool accessories. It's a pretty system, with many merits, that no reasonable person can deny. But for folks like me it's simply cost prohibitive. I don't do cabinet work. I build and install custom screen doors and window panels. I also don't do fine woodworking, though I've built several pretty pieces of furnature that i'm rather proud of.
I may one day, when my business has grown enough, spring for the TS55, as I really like the plunge-depth feature, and the dust collection on the router really makes me smile, but at this point it's not something in thre realm of possibility. I would likely continue to use the EZ system as well, because there are several things that the EZ is capable of that the festool system simply can't do, as there are things that the festool tools can do that that my regular tools cannot.
That being said, I'd like to make the following observation.
I'm not by any stretch of the definition, a tool snob. I used what tools work (and I can afford
One thing I've noticed though, is time after time I've seen Festool users bash the hell out of the EZ, and it frustrates the heck out of me. Frankly, I don't care what system you use, if you're happy with the Festool, good for you. But emotional outbursts like the one Dan has been kind enough to display for us, aren't all that uncommon when it comes to this "discussion".
Why is this necessary?
Why shouldn't both EZ users and Festool users be able to tout the merits of their system in a thread that's by it's very title is intended to be for? Seems they should be able to, no?
I'm put off by the tool snobbery of Festool Users in general. While I'll probably one day own some Festool power tools myself, I don't think I'll ever want to belong to the club. Maybe I can find a company that will ship Festools in a discreet brown box, so no one will have to know.
Member
Mustard!I think the Clearview... oh waite I got the wrong thread.
No, Mayo!
Member
Oh yeah.... Ketchup.
Member
What good is this thread?
I don't understand the purpose of this thread.
This issue has been beaten to death so many times. There is nothing new.
I can understand if a person asks the question of E vs F because (s)he doesn't know either one (or knows only one) and is trying to make a purchasing decision. Even then, I'm sure someone will say "do a search."
But this is apparently not the case.
We all know that a review in a magazine doesn't mean a whole lot to anyone in either camp and to anyone in no camp.
So, enlighten me please, what's the point?
Does this post sound familiar? It does because it is. I posted it a few days ago (post #8). It was true then, it is true now.
Member
Jon,
I respect your choice. You and others must respect mine. As I've said multiple times in this thread alone, each of us chooses what meets their needs. Nothing else is important.
I cannot understand how you can say that ANY of my comments are snobbery. Yes, I like the Festools. Yes, they are very nice and high quality. But that's not why I bought them.
My primary reason for buying them was the same reason that you bought EZ - they met my needs better than any other product! Period.
My outburst was because Dino decided to jump in and define my needs. It does not and never has been about the product. It's about aggressive hype and massive disrespect. Dino seems to think that he can define what is important to me. NOBODY defines my needs but me!
Regards,
Dan.
I'll start out by saying I'm an EZ owner, and leave it at that. I'm relatively happy with the system, there are a few things about it that I find lacking, but any line of tools has it's high points and it's low points.
I paid about 500$ to integrate the EZ into my tool collection, and it's served me well.
Before I found the EZ, I looked at the festool guide systems and drooled over it for about a year. But I already had a saw. Already had a router. Good ones too, not tools I was unhappy with by any means. Not top of the line, but they got the job done.
To buy a comparable Festool collection to what I had with my current tools + the EZ Upgrade, would have cost me about 1200.00. Not to mention the prices of festool accessories. It's a pretty system, with many merits, that no reasonable person can deny. But for folks like me it's simply cost prohibitive. I don't do cabinet work. I build and install custom screen doors and window panels. I also don't do fine woodworking, though I've built several pretty pieces of furnature that i'm rather proud of.
I may one day, when my business has grown enough, spring for the TS55, as I really like the plunge-depth feature, and the dust collection on the router really makes me smile, but at this point it's not something in thre realm of possibility. I would likely continue to use the EZ system as well, because there are several things that the EZ is capable of that the festool system simply can't do, as there are things that the festool tools can do that that my regular tools cannot.
That being said, I'd like to make the following observation.
I'm not by any stretch of the definition, a tool snob. I used what tools work (and I can afford
One thing I've noticed though, is time after time I've seen Festool users bash the hell out of the EZ, and it frustrates the heck out of me. Frankly, I don't care what system you use, if you're happy with the Festool, good for you. But emotional outbursts like the one Dan has been kind enough to display for us, aren't all that uncommon when it comes to this "discussion".
Why is this necessary?
Why shouldn't both EZ users and Festool users be able to tout the merits of their system in a thread that's by it's very title is intended to be for? Seems they should be able to, no?
I'm put off by the tool snobbery of Festool Users in general. While I'll probably one day own some Festool power tools myself, I don't think I'll ever want to belong to the club. Maybe I can find a company that will ship Festools in a discreet brown box, so no one will have to know.
It's amazing what you can accomplish in the 11th hour, 59 minute of any project. Ya just have to keep your eye on the goal.
Member
I have to say Jon that I never have seen anybody bash the EZ system. I have seen people contest the claims that are made for the use of that system and the other ways of working that it can replace. I have seen people react to, what appear to me, overt marketing of the EZ system which contravenes the TOS of this forum. But I do not recall ever having seen anybody say that the EZ system is technically or functionaly inferior to Festool or any other system. If I am wrong I would be delighted if you could point me towards contrary evidence.
I believe that each system fills a different market space. Bravo! Thats what an economy ought to be about. Different choices.
I do, from a technical language point of view have a problem with claims that anything is "safe". Probably the only "safe" thing ever made by man is a padded cell with an anti-ligature door handle. Everything else brings with it the ability do harm to a lesser or greater degree. Therefore claims can be made for "safer" and it is probably fair to say that any system based on a guided rail is safer than some of the alternative means of achieving the same task. Problem is that the text that I have highlighted in blue doesn't make great advertising copy.
Last edited by Ian Barley; 10-06-2006 at 5:45 AM.
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