Borg - frustrating experiences (long)

[Mike Seals]

Lowes and Home Depot are the Wal-Mart of the building stores. That is they only carry volume items, or items that sell fast. Most of these stores do not have any wharehousing so to speak, deliveries are made day and night and stock normally at night.

Small items that move quickly can normally be purchased at these stores for a reasonable price. Where I live, most decent hardware stores (the few we have) close on Sunday. The one that did remain open had their small items marked up from 100-400% over the others. I'm glad a HD did opened up in our town just to force the others to be more competative. But I will agree, the stocking for folks that like to do as we do is poor at best. And the quality of help is normally poor.

[glenn bradley]

Good rant and good to get it off your chest. I make peace with the BORG's knowing I'll be looking for a needle in a haystack when I go in. I consider them a resource but not my usual supplier of shop good / tools.

In my part of the country we have smog, congestion and all sorts of unpleasantness. I also have 10 places to buy lumber within about 10 minutes of my house. This is the trade off.

I hope you will continue to pursue this hobby which I have come to love despite my lack of natural ability. I would look around for a quality supplier of lumber. That way when you need certain items and they have to be "good", you'll have a source. For the day-to-day 'stuff' that I need now and then, the BORG will do.

I also go through the effort to fill out their on line surveys or send emails directly stating my point or experience. My 'realist' nature tells me 9 out of 10 of these fall on deaf ears but at least I feel better. the 'optimist' in me hopes that the big box stores will react and fix a few things.

I don't know about your area but my HD does not post prices on probably half of their lumber goods. What is so difficult about printing off the inventory sticker and putting it on the rack? Oops, sorry I almost got off on a sub-rant.

Good luck and enjoy the hobby. Don't let the BORG's apathy get you down. ;-)

[Nate Rogers]

I have a simple rule in life, I DO NOT SHOP AT BORGS! Period! It never turns out good. I always shop at my local lumber yard, the owner is always there and he CARES about the business, therefore he cares if you are happy. I don't care if it costs a bit more, it I get what I want, when I want it..Then I am happy, nothing hits my my truckbed that doesn't meet my specifications..Are all lumber yards this way? Of course not, do some research ask around and you will find that place..The same applies to tool purchases, find a good dealer..and be loyal to that dealer and they will be loyal to you! Price is important, but it is not the only thing that is important.

Nate

[Lou Ferrarini]

Round 2 started when I asked one of the workers if he could get one of the unbroken bundles down so I could buy 3 sheets of beadboard. He point out that there were 4 sheets on the shelf and offer to help me load it on the cart. When I pointed out their condition, he offered to discount each sheet 10%. I asked him if he would buy them himself. He kind of smiled and said no. He then explained that it was company policy…

Last time this happened to me, I bought the warped pieces and enough good ones to do the job. I loaded the good ones in the truck and immediately took the others right back to the return desk.

[Alfred Clem]

You might look at your situation from another angle. If the Borg hands you lemons and you decide woodworking is not for you, they have controlled you. On the other hand, if you decide to tell them -- verbally or otherwise -- to take their shoddy merchandise and customer-be-damned policies to a place where the sun don't shine, then you are in control.

Which is it going to be? Borg in control? Or you in control? I hope it is the latter because woodworking and the people who love it are your true friends forever.

[Kyle Kraft]

Dave,
You must be referring to Johnsons Lumber Co. a.k.a. Johnsons Workbench. I bought my cabinet saw and drill press from them....excellent customer service and products!!!

[Kyle Kraft]

Lou,
I love your solution!!! Kind of reminds me of what a friend of mine did to a store years ago. They ticked him off for one reason or another and he went back, filled a cart, then abandoned it in the store for the drones to restock. Hows that for customer service.

[Bill Turpin]

Several years ago a VP at HD corporate told me that I was abusing my Garden cart by taking it off of level pavement. Do any of you garden in your paved driveway?

I used to buy clear and better pine shelving at a local lumber yard for 25% less than Lowes gets for their PrimeChoice kindling! Unfortunately they went the way of progress. The only good thing about it was that ALL the employees (7) were old enough to retire together.

Bill in WNC mountains

[tim mathis]

just don't take their pencil.

[Frank Chaffee]

Rich,
Most of us has probably had a bad experience at a borg, just as we have at a bank, car repair shop, or online vendor. Part of the learning curve in woodworking is learning where to buy what, and to ask questions about which products satisfy your needs. If you peruse these pages for a while, I’m sure you will absorb much information that will help you get started in your new endeavor, and I’ll bet that you discover needs you were never aware of!

I once did about a year long remodel (hey, I’m slow!), and spent a lot of time at a nearby Home Depot. Through that period I got to know various dept managers, and so knew who to look for, or ask for when I had specific questions that couldn’t be answered by “Asile 3 and to the right”. Many HD employees worked hard to help me, and on several occasions managers recommended trade shops by name when they felt that HD’s offerings would not be right for me.

Once I walked into a strange HD needing ten sheets of *cheap* 4x8 stock. There were not ten sheets of 3/8 cdx in the rack, so the guy on the floor in lumber gave me ten sheets of ½” five ply for the same price. It worked for me.

There’s good management/bad management, good people/uncaring people, good advice/inappropriate advice everywhere.

Seek and ye shall find.

Happy trials to you…

[David G Baker]

Frank.
I agree with you.
I have had similar experiences with the Borgs, this is why I keep going back to HD. I have learned their limitations and try to work within those limitations. If it doesn't work they will take it back, another plus.
It is frustrating at times because I had access to the old style hardware and lumber stores. There are still a few in my area that I give quite a lot of my business to.
David B

[Jerry Olexa]

Don't give up on this time-honored craft. There are many good, honest people in this business who take pride in their work and provide quality goods/service.
But as said earlier, you have to seek them out and FIND them. I live in a BIG metro area (cHicago) and still there are only a handful of places and people that I really trust that understand WWers like us. As far as the BORGs, you're on your own when you go there. They are fast and convenient but BUYER BEWARE when buying there. YOU have to the advisor when you go there. You need to know more than they do (pretty easy)..Stay with us. Don't be discouraged. WWers by and large are good, honest, trustworthy people. Hang in there. We need people like you to stay...

[Loren Hedahl]

The problem with the narrow guide slots in your Hitachi saw is also found on other brands; Makita comes to mind.

But all is not lost!

Go up a couple of threads on this forum and make yourself a "SLED", custom made for your Hitachi. It will work far better and more accurate than any after-market miter guide you can buy.

Then install a top quality blade and tune up your little Hitachi. You will be surprised at how smooth the cuts will be that it makes. These are actually great little saws. Many trim carpenters make a very comfortable living with this saw and a compound miter saw as their main power tools.

Good luck and many great projects from your Hitachi!

Loren

[Wilbur Pan]

I think the key to dealing with the big box stores is to know exactly what they are good for, and what to stay away from. I've had two recent good experiences with the local Home Depots recently.

First, I bought a Wagner Power Painter that happened to be on sale. When I opened it, it was obviously a refurbished model, since I could see faint paint splatter on the sprayer. But since it was on sale, I figured that as long as it worked, I'd be happy. Problem was, it didn't work anywhere near what it was supposed to. I brought it back, obviously used, explained the situation, and my credit card was credited within 3 minutes.

Second, I have a project that required building a thick table top. One of the local Home Depots happens to stock kiln dried Douglas Fir 4x4 beams. They are a bit over $12 for an 8 foot 4x4 beam. Of course, I had to pick through the stack to find ones that were usable, but luckily it was on the way home to work. So I would stop in once every 1-2 weeks, pick through the stack, and come away with 3 beams that had at least 6 feet of clear Douglas fir. After a few trips, I had all the clear Douglas fir I needed, at $1.12/board-foot.

However, I do agree that overall buying lumber at a Home Depot is a losing proposition. But they are good for boxed items, like that Power Painter, that can be returned easily if need be.

[Rich Engelhardt]

Hello,

Wow! Thank you everyone for the encouragement and support.
You're right, WWers are real stand up people.

I'll be sure to look into finding a better source for materials. One problem is the local "borg" have driven out the other lumber yards in the area. Mail order or Internet buying is difficult since my wife and I both work and there's no one home during the day to accept shipments. I can probably work around that though.

Re: The quality of materials. My analogy here is that I don't expect Prime rib at hamburger and fries prices. If I buy a burger and fries though, I don't expect to be served a stale bun with rancid meat.

Hopefully, someone with the authority to change things at the borg will take notice of threads like this and wake up to the fact that they are shooting themselves in the foot. There must be millions of people like myself that are nearing retirement age that are looking for a new hobby or venture once they have the free time. While I'm no Rockefeller, I am at the point in life where I don't have to pinch every penny.

Loren,
Yes, I'm going to build a sled for it (the Hitachi).
I bought the Hitachi prior to finding SMC. I actually stumbled across SMC while looking for plans on how to build a sled last fall. It was then that I discovered that all the "easy" methods used standard 3/4" materials. I'll have to get creative with the Hitachi.
I guess I'm letting my frustration with that one thing dimish my view of it.
Overall, it seems to be pretty decent. I was impressed the first time I ripped a board to a 2" width. I set the fence at 2" on the guide and ripped the board. It measured dead on from one end to the other at 1 15/16th". Oops! I know better now and allow for the 1/16" kerf of the blade.