blacksmith making chisels and request for ideas for tooling

[Clinton Findlay]

I agree with others that the statement should be retracted.

I don't agree that it should be retracted.

I would much rather the issue of Mikes post and word usage be laid to rest, or continued elsewhere.

I'll be happy to give the issue of Mike's word choice the attention it deserves in another thread.

[Andrew Homan]

I don't agree that it should be retracted.

Sure, I changed my mind, too, let it stand as a testiment to what it is.
-Andy

[harry strasil]

a piece with holes is either used as a header or as a bolster, A swage block has depressions around the outside normally half a hole usually round and on one side square. Old style swage blocks had round, square and rectangular holes clear thru the center, modern swage blocks usually have various depressions on both sides of the middle for dishing spoons, shovels and ladles etc.

If any chamfering is done it should be just enough to break the sharp edge.

[Mike Henderson]

Wilbur Pan and I have been having a discussion via PM - a very polite and reasonable discussion. If I'm choosing the right words, Wilbur's position is that I was making an accusation against the whole country of Japan and its people. He suggested that I change my statement and provided a correction that he felt was better. Althought I certainly did not mean to imply anything against the country of Japan, I'm more than willing to change my statement to more accurately reflect what I was trying to say.

The statement that Wilbur would prefer, and which I agree to is:

"Japanese tools are made using primitive techniques and sold at very high prices - it's all in convincing buyers that there's something special about "hand-made" using primitive methods"

I also offer my sincere apology to Wilbur and to anyone else who was offended by my slight to the country of Japan and its people. Absolutely none was intended.

Mike

[harry strasil]

High prices, because the making of tools in Japan is steeped in traditional ways of doing things, thus it takes more time to make a tool.

Damascus or patten welded does not necessarily make a better tool, just make is look different, I prefer the older chisels made by the old timers in this country, with the hard blister steel forge welded to the soft wrought iron body. they seem to stay sharper longer. also the old tapered plane blades made the same way.

[Pam Niedermayer]

...Japanese tools are made using primitive techniques and sold at very high prices - it's all in convincing buyers that there's something special about "hand-made" using primitive methods"

I also offer my sincere apology to Wilbur and to anyone else who was offended by my slight to the country of Japan and its people. Absolutely none was intended.

Thanks, Mike, I was hoping this was what you meant.

Pam

[Dave Burnard]

"Modern tools are made with labor and time saving mass production techniques and "space age" materials and can be sold at very low prices - it's all in convincing buyers that nothing significant was lost in the transition to modern techniques and materials"



Hooray for those smiths Clinton is trying to help out - wish I had something useful to contribute. Harry's assortment of sets and your spring fullers should go a long way.

Leaf spring steel wouldn't benefit much from lamination, but they could consider it - if the steel is in very short supply compared with iron there. Obtaining flux could be a problem, but they may already be doing fluxed forge welding in their regular work with an improvised version from local materials. Cross that bridge when they get a feel for whether edge tool making will be practical for them.

I would guess chisels, small knives, and carving tools would be useful locally - but that all depends on what is available from elsewhere and what is in short supply locally.

Very interesting - please keep us posted on their progress...

[Charles McKinley]

Hi Clinton,

Ask what they want to use the bar with the holes for. They may want touse them to make various sized dowels. Spring steel will have to be softened before it is drilled. There are several blacksmithing site that could be of use to you. I can provide you a list if you would like.

[Clinton Findlay]

Charles,
I will ask tomorrow when I go to see them.... I think it is for making dowels and also heading/upsetting, but I'm only assuming.
I'd like the list of blacksmithing resources, so if you could pm them to me I'd greatly appreciated it.


Tomorrow we'll be making the spring fuller and sen.
If we get the time we will make a few sets of Oval Bolstered Mortice chisels, "pigstickers", ... I've got a few orders for them, amongst other chisel sets.
Drawknives are next of the list.
Its all good!

Thanks,
Clinton

[Dave Burnard]

Shoot! I entered a long post about sen making and usage hoping to catch Clinton before he left - somehow it was lost in the ether (possibly in the ether between my ears).

I can reconstruct the post, but maybe I'll wait and adjust it depending on how the sen-making project went.

[Pam Niedermayer]

I'd love to hear about sen making and using, Dave, but no hurry.

Pam

[gene wiedenroth]

I have worked metals a large part of my life perhaps i can give a few pointers. high carbon steels may be annealed by heating to none magnetic or slightly higher then burying in ashes, dry sand ,or dry clay if a small piece ,bury w/ a large, also hot piece of metal to slow the cooling.annealed high carbon may be made into files&rasps of all shapes & sizes by cutting the teethw/ a chisel then heating to none magnetic & quenching. drill bits may be made by making a spade bit or a ''D'' bit as viewed from the end of the tool even a tap or reamer may be made this way vegtable oils also work for quenching also oil on water will slow the quench

[Clinton Findlay]

I've been rather busy with a few things over here, so apologies for 'being away' for so long.

Here's a pic of the Pig sticker style chisel all polished up via an oilstoine and to 500 grit Wet and Dry sandpaper.

I'm getting there with presentation... currently have orders for 5 sets and a few other items, so its all good.