FWW article on strength of Glues

[Jay Keller]

In the last FWW , there is an interesting article on the strength of different clues. Pva glues did very well! Epoxy was as good and the wood actually failed rather than the glue. Hide glue was approx 80 % as strong... The worst was Gorilla glue or other polyurethanes at only 58 %. That is what I always thought....it is really no surprise ...and I hate the mess. See this older thread..
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...t=gorilla+glue

what is pva glue. The link goes to a thread, not an article. Is there an article to read?

[Corey Hallagan]

what is pva glue. The link goes to a thread, not an article. Is there an article to read?

Jay, see this link:

http://www.thistothat.com/glue/pva.shtml

Corey

[Kim Spence]

what is pva glue. The link goes to a thread, not an article. Is there an article to read?

PVA = Polyvinyl Acetate, or standard Yellow or White woodworking glues (Titebond, Elmers, the like).

The thread is a discussion of Polyurethane glues vs PVA glues.

The new article about glues is in the latest FWW.

[Andrew Williams]

I'd like to know what sort of hide glue they were using..Hot?, liquid bottled?, which gram strength and how was it applied...

[Jay Keller]

Jay, see this link:

http://www.thistothat.com/glue/pva.shtml

Corey

Thanks. Thats very interesting article. I tried the gorilla glue and didnt like it because its so messy but it does expand so it has its applications. What is the long setting glue I see mentioned on David Marks show so often for complicated glue-ups? The gorrilla glues says it sets up in 1/2 hour.

[Per Swenson]

I gotta add a little here....

I 'am a tite bond three man= pva.

For your basic assembly's.

Urea For time.

Epoxies on moldings.

But when it comes to shear holding power on darn near anything...

There is one poly I believe to be invincible.

PL premium polyurethane adhesive.

Just last week I returned to a job I did 21 years ago,

stilled glued up tight, outside and exposed to the elements.

Per

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

that moisture cure polyurethane adhesive Glue is my GO TO glue in only two situations:
1.) when gluing a polymer to wood and for whatever reason contact cement won't do it.
2.) when gluing end grain to something and all I really want is to seal the end grain and a little adhesion is good.

That said I wonder if the following wouldn't be a good idea for end grain apps':

End grain glue up in 2 stages: first stage: seal the end grain with epoxy. Second stage: sand and re-apply epoxy and make the glue joint.

Any one ever tried that?

[Martin Shupe]

I'd like to know what sort of hide glue they were using..Hot?, liquid bottled?, which gram strength and how was it applied...

They used Old Brown Glue, which I use and like a lot. They compared it to hot hide glue, and I was surprised to see that they were statistically similar in strength.

I use Old Brown Glue instead of PVA, so I don't have to worry about messing up my finish.

[Brad Naylor]

A feature of PU glues which no-one has yet mentioned is it's contraceptive qualities.

A day using that stuff in the shop and SWMBO will scream 'You're not coming near me with those hands!'

And it takes a week to wear off...

[Carl Eyman]

Remember Bob's posting relative to which glues can be re-glued? If I remember correctly only epoxy, hide, and plastic resin could be re-glued to itself if the joint failed. Now I don't like the idea of contemplating a joint failure, but in the 200 years some of our early American cabinetmakers have had pieces survive, there are bound to be some failures occur.

One of my most ambitious projects has polyurethane glue (Gorrilla) in a ctitical joint. Hopefully, the mechanical aspects of that joint will save it.
Well, at 85 I don't have to worry very long about it.

[Dennis Peacock]

In some old post , I mentioned that i thought the strength was about the same....Liqid hide is very good for fixing flaws in the wood surface and does not bother the finish much

Yup....I use a lot of liquid hide glue. I like it and guess what.....no glue stains anywhere because this stuff will clean up nicely with warm water.

I even tried to take a glue joint apart by saturating it with water for about 2 hours. It never would come apart......it's still stuck together today.

[Alfred Clem]

On the other hand (no pun intended), I use Gorilla Glue when cementing brass tubes into drilled pen blanks. The stuff does a good job bonding metal to wood. But I sure wear rubber gloves when handling Gorilla Glue. Otherwise, it stains the skin like crazy. Even acetone will not remove the stains on my fingers although it does remove spills from my workbench. The FWW article made me wonder if other glues might not work just as well...without the staining. Any experience with other glues for bonding metal to wood?

[Pat Germain]

Thanks. Thats very interesting article. I tried the gorilla glue and didnt like it because its so messy but it does expand so it has its applications. What is the long setting glue I see mentioned on David Marks show so often for complicated glue-ups? The gorrilla glues says it sets up in 1/2 hour.

I read about this on David Marks' web page recently. He uses Weldwood, Cascamite and Urac 185. I think those are all slow setting, plastic resin glues. There were some others mentioned, but I think they were waterproof glues designed for boats.

[Howard Acheson]

>> Titebond 3 lists 58°F as the minimum temperature.

That's not correct. The specs on Titebond III is that it is usable down to 47 degrees. It's one of the benefits of using that product and is the lowest using temperature of any PVA adhesive.

[Howard Acheson]

I'd like to know what sort of hide glue they were using..Hot?, liquid bottled?, which gram strength and how was it applied...

The article goes into some of your questions. They tested both hot hide glue and liquid hide glue.